Global Warming is a myth. I'll agree with Al Gore's bullshit after he shovels my driveway and scrapes the ice off my windsheild

rookie_j70 wrote: Global Warming is a myth. I'll agree with Al Gore's bullshit after he shovels my driveway and scrapes the ice off my windsheild

That's a pretty ignorant statement. I don't think most people would argue that the earth's temperatures over the last century or two have risen. It's the cause that's disputed.

derek bomar wrote:

rookie_j70 wrote: Global Warming is a myth. I'll agree with Al Gore's bullshit after he shovels my driveway and scrapes the ice off my windsheild

That's a pretty ignorant statement. I don't think most people would argue that the earth's temperatures over the last century or two have risen. It's the cause that's disputed.

You are dealing with people who think snow in January proves you wrong. And Fox news told them............

derek bomar wrote: I don't think most people would argue that the earth's temperatures over the last century or two have risen. It's the cause that's disputed.

Well, if it's "or two", I know what isn't the cause.

queencitybuckeye wrote:

derek bomar wrote: I don't think most people would argue that the earth's temperatures over the last century or two have risen. It's the cause that's disputed.

Well, if it's "or two", I know what isn't the cause.

Commercial mining of coal dates to 1748.
The greatest acceleration in warming patters is in the past 50 years.

zhon44622 wrote: The greatest acceleration in warming patters is in the past 50 years.

ENIAC (The first stored program computer) was first turned on in 1947. That was just a little over 50 years ago. Coincidence? I think not. </sarcasm>

Carbon is not the only byproduct of burning coal.

zhon44622 wrote: The greatest acceleration in warming patters is in the past 50 years.

Same is true of Mars - how are we doing that?

queencitybuckeye wrote:

zhon44622 wrote: The greatest acceleration in warming patters is in the past 50 years.

Same is true of Mars - how are we doing that?

Shhh, that's logic. We can't have that. Don't you know that greenhouse gases travel through space. We are responsible for everything that happens in this solar system. :rolleyes:

FatHobbit wrote:

zhon44622 wrote: The greatest acceleration in warming patters is in the past 50 years.

ENIAC (The first stored program computer) was first turned on in 1947. That was just a little over 50 years ago. Coincidence? I think not. </sarcasm>

Carbon is not the only byproduct of burning coal.

We all know nothing beats scientific theory better than illogical sarcasm.

zhon44622 wrote: We all nothing beats scientific theory better than illogical sarcasm.

Sweet. Let me know when you have some. (Other than Carbon is bad, give me all your money)

queencitybuckeye wrote:

zhon44622 wrote: We all nothing beats scientific theory better than illogical sarcasm.

I'm going to assume that he meant

We all know nothing beats scientific theory better than illogical sarcasm.

FatHobbit wrote: I'm going to assume that he meant

We all know nothing beats scientific theory better than illogical sarcasm.

Probably, but sarcasm is every bit as valuable as science IMO.

queencitybuckeye wrote:

zhon44622 wrote: The greatest acceleration in warming patters is in the past 50 years.

Same is true of Mars - how are we doing that?

We have only been able to track any sort of reliable stats on this since 1999, the rest is also theory.

FYI - I am in no way claiming that I have the missing link, simply debunking the asinine claims (mainly snow in January) of those who seem to know without a doubt that it does not exist.

zhon44622 wrote: FYI - I am in no way claiming that I have the missing link, simply debunking the asinine claims (mainly snow in January) of those who seem to know without a doubt that it does not exist.

That's fair and a great step forward from just a couple of years ago when any scientist in opposition was minimized as a hack. Too damn many good ones out there for this strategy today.

I fully believe in global warming and global cooling. I just don't believe that we have much, if anything to do with it. The Earth and the solar system as a whole has been going through warming and cooling patterns since its existance.

I think it all comes down to how the sun is acting at certain times. If the sun is putting out more solar energy, our planets heat up and the opposite is true. We've had ice ages before, and we've had lush jungles try up and scorch into deserts.

If we are so influential on the temperature on this planet, how did the ice age ever end? There weren't cars and CO2 emmissions then caused by humans.

However, I'm fully for being green and environmentally conscious like Websurfinbird said earlier. I don't want new taxes for companies that aren't optimal at it, but I would be all for incentives for those that try to clean things up. I like clean air and low pollution. It's good for our health and things in general.

Where's global warming? It's in that "lockbox" super idiot extrodinaire Al Gore keeps close by.

queencitybuckeye wrote:

zhon44622 wrote: We all nothing beats scientific theory better than illogical sarcasm.

I love Freehuddle because we get gems like this.


Re the topic at hand, weather and climate aren't the same thing--when we're talking about climate change, we're talking about fractions of a degree over time. It's not like Ohio in December should suddenly be 85 for there to be anything to global warming. I do find it interesting, though, that lefties are suddenly jumping all over this and hammering out the point that we should expect cold weather even with climate change. If my memory serves me correctly, lots of people blamed Katrina on "climate change," which is equally nonsense. I don't recall many lefties working hard to argue that climate change wasn't responsible for Katrina. I guess it doesn't go both ways (not that this is much of a surprise).

Having a cold snap or a hot snap or a hurricane or a hurricane-free season does not, by itself, make any iota of difference in the argument of whether global warming is happening.

I'd say I'm pretty on the fence about it. I think that we probably have some minimal effect, but I'm not sure we're willing to pay the price to remedy that--the climate change push ends up looking like a bunch of Luddites. With the rapid pace of China/India industrializing and modernizing, the steps necessary to halt or reverse anything on our end aren't politically palpable, so it kind of seems like a moot point.

There are a number of national security reasons to encourage renewables (which in some areas have already achieved grid parity with marginal fossil fuel generators), but not so much with carbon abatement. The underlying economics suggest that we're going to increase our "carbon footprint" for the foreseeable future.

This pretty much sums it up.

fan_from_texas wrote:

queencitybuckeye wrote:

zhon44622 wrote: We all nothing beats scientific theory better than illogical sarcasm.

I love Freehuddle because we get gems like this.


Re the topic at hand, weather and climate aren't the same thing--when we're talking about climate change, we're talking about fractions of a degree over time. It's not like Ohio in December should suddenly be 85 for there to be anything to global warming. I do find it interesting, though, that lefties are suddenly jumping all over this and hammering out the point that we should expect cold weather even with climate change. If my memory serves me correctly, lots of people blamed Katrina on "climate change," which is equally nonsense. I don't recall many lefties working hard to argue that climate change wasn't responsible for Katrina. I guess it doesn't go both ways (not that this is much of a surprise).

Having a cold snap or a hot snap or a hurricane or a hurricane-free season does not, by itself, make any iota of difference in the argument of whether global warming is happening.

I'd say I'm pretty on the fence about it. I think that we probably have some minimal effect, but I'm not sure we're willing to pay the price to remedy that--the climate change push ends up looking like a bunch of Luddites. With the rapid pace of China/India industrializing and modernizing, the steps necessary to halt or reverse anything on our end aren't politically palpable, so it kind of seems like a moot point.

There are a number of national security reasons to encourage renewables (which in some areas have already achieved grid parity with marginal fossil fuel generators), but not so much with carbon abatement. The underlying economics suggest that we're going to increase our "carbon footprint" for the foreseeable future.

+1

Pretty much my view.

fan_from_texas wrote:

queencitybuckeye wrote:

zhon44622 wrote: We all nothing beats scientific theory better than illogical sarcasm.

I love Freehuddle because we get gems like this.


Re the topic at hand, weather and climate aren't the same thing--when we're talking about climate change, we're talking about fractions of a degree over time. It's not like Ohio in December should suddenly be 85 for there to be anything to global warming. I do find it interesting, though, that lefties are suddenly jumping all over this and hammering out the point that we should expect cold weather even with climate change. If my memory serves me correctly, lots of people blamed Katrina on "climate change," which is equally nonsense. I don't recall many lefties working hard to argue that climate change wasn't responsible for Katrina. I guess it doesn't go both ways (not that this is much of a surprise).

Having a cold snap or a hot snap or a hurricane or a hurricane-free season does not, by itself, make any iota of difference in the argument of whether global warming is happening.

I'd say I'm pretty on the fence about it. I think that we probably have some minimal effect, but I'm not sure we're willing to pay the price to remedy that--the climate change push ends up looking like a bunch of Luddites. With the rapid pace of China/India industrializing and modernizing, the steps necessary to halt or reverse anything on our end aren't politically palpable, so it kind of seems like a moot point.

There are a number of national security reasons to encourage renewables (which in some areas have already achieved grid parity with marginal fossil fuel generators), but not so much with carbon abatement. The underlying economics suggest that we're going to increase our "carbon footprint" for the foreseeable future.

Context and subsequent post show we are both on the same boat.

fan_from_texas wrote:Re the topic at hand, weather and climate aren't the same thing--when we're talking about climate change, we're talking about fractions of a degree over time.

True but the conflict arises over whether humans are the cause or if it's the result of naturally occurring causes such as the sun and the earth itself. Since climate change has been around for a lot longer than human consumption of eeeeeeevil fossil fuels, rational people are inclined to believe that the natural causes far outweigh any human impact on climate change.

fan_from_texas wrote:I do find it interesting, though, that lefties are suddenly jumping all over this and hammering out the point that we should expect cold weather even with climate change. If my memory serves me correctly, lots of people blamed Katrina on "climate change," which is equally nonsense.

I couldn't agree more. The problem with the leftist viewpoint is the odd juxtaposition of radical environmentalism and the liberal politicians who largely see it as an opportunity to capitalize on mass redistribution of wealth. One idea naively gives the human condition too much credit and the other not enough.

fan_from_texas wrote:I'd say I'm pretty on the fence about it. I think that we probably have some minimal effect, but I'm not sure we're willing to pay the price to remedy that--the climate change push ends up looking like a bunch of Luddites.

I'm not on the fence at all not surprisingly. No right thinking person disagrees with the concept of being good stewards with Earth's limited resources, but claiming that humans are the cause of global climate change - once again - naively gives mankind way too much credit. We are puny and relatively insignificant compared to the forces of nature...short of full-scale nuclear war of course.

fan_from_texas wrote:With the rapid pace of China/India industrializing and modernizing, the steps necessary to halt or reverse anything on our end aren't politically palpable, so it kind of seems like a moot point.

Realpolitik. I'm more concerned about the impact these emerging economies are having on our economy than whether or not Chinese coal-fired electric plants are allegedly pissing off El Nino.

fan_from_texas wrote:There are a number of national security reasons to encourage renewables (which in some areas have already achieved grid parity with marginal fossil fuel generators), but not so much with carbon abatement. The underlying economics suggest that we're going to increase our "carbon footprint" for the foreseeable future.

I agree. I also admit that we need to reduce carbon emissions over time but there needs to be balance between common-sense environmentalism and responsible world-wide economic growth.

The myth of man-made global climate change should never be an excuse by world socialists for mass redistribution of wealth. That's the part of the climate change issue that gets my panties in a bunch!

zhon44622 wrote:

fan_from_texas wrote:

queencitybuckeye wrote:

zhon44622 wrote: We all nothing beats scientific theory better than illogical sarcasm.

I love Freehuddle because we get gems like this.


Re the topic at hand, weather and climate aren't the same thing--when we're talking about climate change, we're talking about fractions of a degree over time. It's not like Ohio in December should suddenly be 85 for there to be anything to global warming. I do find it interesting, though, that lefties are suddenly jumping all over this and hammering out the point that we should expect cold weather even with climate change. If my memory serves me correctly, lots of people blamed Katrina on "climate change," which is equally nonsense. I don't recall many lefties working hard to argue that climate change wasn't responsible for Katrina. I guess it doesn't go both ways (not that this is much of a surprise).

Having a cold snap or a hot snap or a hurricane or a hurricane-free season does not, by itself, make any iota of difference in the argument of whether global warming is happening.

I'd say I'm pretty on the fence about it. I think that we probably have some minimal effect, but I'm not sure we're willing to pay the price to remedy that--the climate change push ends up looking like a bunch of Luddites. With the rapid pace of China/India industrializing and modernizing, the steps necessary to halt or reverse anything on our end aren't politically palpable, so it kind of seems like a moot point.

There are a number of national security reasons to encourage renewables (which in some areas have already achieved grid parity with marginal fossil fuel generators), but not so much with carbon abatement. The underlying economics suggest that we're going to increase our "carbon footprint" for the foreseeable future.

Context and subsequent post show we are both on the same boat.

I guess I'm on the same boat too

And if the theory of the polar caps and glaciers completely melting comes true, where better to be than on a boat?

The Earth is warming, that is an indisputable fact. Hell 12,000 years ago there were glaciers in Ohio. So yes the Earth is warming, the question is how much of it is our impact?

I'll try one more time. I've asked this question before on one of these "Climate change"/"Global warming" threads and haven't received an intelligent answer.

What did humans do to end the last ice age?