ytownfootball wrote:

dwccrew wrote: When your conference champ gets dialed two years in a row, you really shouldn't be talking.

ie; you really shouldn't be talking.

you're an idiot

LJ wrote: They have auto qualifer status pertaining to their ranking and record, which includes them in this convo.

Again, Notre Dame is not in a conference, so their conference champ hasn't been "dialed" two years in a row. Based on what qualifications dwc laid out as to who can post on this thread, I really can be talking.

technically, you're still an idiot

karen lotz wrote:

ytownfootball wrote:

dwccrew wrote: When your conference champ gets dialed two years in a row, you really shouldn't be talking.

ie; you really shouldn't be talking.

you're an idiot

LJ wrote: They have auto qualifer status pertaining to their ranking and record, which includes them in this convo.

Again, Notre Dame is not in a conference, so their conference champ hasn't been "dialed" two years in a row. Based on what qualifications dwc laid out as to who can post on this thread, I really can be talking.

Either you are really this dense, or you just refuse to believe anyone that says something against your opinion. Notre Dame has auto qualifier status. They are a 1 team conference. Their conference champ was destroyed in all 3 of their appearances, so why should they be an auto qualifier? They should have at large status, not their own auto qualifier nor non-bcs. Just plain at large status. Notre Dame REALLY does not deserve auto qualifier status.

ytownfootball wrote: technically, you're still an idiot

I'm sorry you aren't good at reading comprehension.

LJ wrote: Either you are really this dense, or you just refuse to believe anyone that says something against your opinion. Notre Dame has auto qualifier status. They are a 1 team conference. Their conference champ was destroyed in all 3 of their appearances, so why should they be an auto qualifier? They should have at large status, not their own auto qualifier nor non-bcs. Just plain at large status. Notre Dame REALLY does not deserve auto qualifier status.

Yeah ok, because they are independent, they are in a one team conference. Are you that dense that you don't understand what independent means? Yes, they have auto qualifier status if they reach certain criteria, just like non BCS teams do. Saying Notre Dame is a conference champ and automatic qualifier is laughable. According to you, they won their "conference" every year of the BCS' existence, except I've never seen any mention of it and they only have 3 BCS appearances? Seems like ND didn't get a very good deal...

First of all, you have the Big East 8-6 when they are 7-7. They were 1-2 in 2007, but you counted it as 2-1. Anyway, if you add in this year they are 9-9 and the Big Ten is 11-23 vs. BCS conferences over that time period (with one game left). Here is how that happens:

Since 2005 the Big Ten has played up (played a team placed higher in their conference, example the 8th place Big Ten team playing the 2nd place ACC team) 13 times. That is 13 games they should lose. The Big East has played down (played a team placed lower in their conference) 12 times. That is 12 games they should win. They didn't play up one single time. Here is the breakdown.

Big Ten:
Played up 13 times.
Played down 6 times.
Played even 15 times.

Big East:
Played down 12 times.
Played even 6 times.

Take out the 13 games that the Big Ten should lose and the 12 games the Big East should win, and the records would be dramatically different.

One guy on here claimed that the Big East would have a better national perception if they had Big Ten tie-ins. Their bowl record would be ugly if they did, even uglier than the Big Ten's record.

2005:
W - Ohio State v Notre Dame
Big Ten #2 vs. Notre Dame

W - Penn State v Florida State
Big Ten #1 vs. ACC #1

W - Wisconsin v Auburn
Big Ten #3 vs. SEC #3

L - Iowa v Florida
Big Ten #6 vs. SEC #5

L - Northwestern v UCLA
Big Ten #5 vs. Pac-10 #3

L - Minnesota v Virginia
Big Ten #7 vs. ACC #8

L - Michigan v Nebraska
Big Ten #4 vs. Big XII #6
2 up, 2 down, 2 even


W - West Virginia v Georgia
Big East #1 vs. SEC #1

L - Louisville v Virginia Tech
Big East #2 vs. ACC #2

L - South Florida v NC St
Big East #4 vs. ACC #9

L - Rutgers v AZ State
Big East #3 vs. Pac-10 #5
2 down, 2 even

2006:
L - Michigan v USC
Big Ten #2 vs. Pac-10 #1

L - Ohio State v Florida
Big Ten #1 vs. SEC #1

L - Minnesota v Texas Tech
Big Ten #6 vs. Big XII #6

L - Purdue v Maryland
Big Ten #5 vs. ACC #5

L - Iowa v Texas
Big Ten #8 vs. Big XII #2

W - PSU v Tennessee
Big Ten #4 vs. SEC #5

W - Wisconsin v Arkansas
Big Ten #3 vs. SEC #2
3 up, 1 down, 3 even


W - Louisville v Wake Forest
Big East #1 vs. ACC #1

W - Rutgers v Kansas State
Big East #3 vs. Big XII #7

W - West Virginia v Georgia Tech
Big East #2 vs. ACC #2
1 down, 2 even

2007:
L - Illinois v USC
Big Ten #3 vs. Pac-10 #1

L - OSU v LSU
Big Ten #1 vs. SEC #1

L - Michigan State v Boston College
Big Ten #8 vs. ACC #2

W - PSU v Texas A&M
Big Ten #6 vs. Big XII #6

L - Indiana v OK State
Big Ten #9 vs. Big XII #7

L - Wisconsin v Tennessee
Big Ten #4 vs. SEC #3

W - Michigan v Florida
Big Ten #2 vs. SEC #4
4 up, 1 down, 2 even


W - West Virginia v Oklahoma
Big East #1 vs. Big XII #1

L - UConn v Wake Forest
Big East #2 vs. ACC #5

L - South Florida v Oregon
Big East #4 vs. Pac-10 #5
2 down, 1 even

2008:
L - Wisconsin v Florida State
Big Ten #6 vs. ACC #4

L - Northwestern v Missouri
Big Ten #4 vs. Big XII #5

L - Minnesota v Kansas
Big Ten #7 vs. Big XII #7

W - Iowa v South Carolina
Big Ten #5 vs. SEC #5

L - Michigan State v Georgia
Big Ten #3 vs. SEC #3

L - Penn State v USC
Big Ten #1 vs. Pac-10 #1

L - OSU v Texas
Big Ten #2 vs. Big XII #2
1 up, 1 down, 5 even


W - West Virginia v North Carolina
Big East #3 vs. ACC #5

W - Rutgers v NC State
Big East #4 vs. ACC #8

L - Pittsburgh v Oregon State
Big East #2 vs. Pac-10 #3

L - UC v Virginia Tech
Big East #1 vs. ACC #1
3 down, 1 even

2009:
W - Ohio State vs. Oregon
Big Ten #1 vs. Pac-10 #1

W - Penn State vs. LSU
Big Ten #3 vs. SEC #3

W - Wisconsin vs. Miami (FL)
Big Ten #5 vs. ACC #4

L - Michigan State vs. Texas Tech
Big Ten #6 vs. Big XII #4

L - Northwestern vs. Auburn
Big Ten #4 vs. SEC #8

L - Minnesota vs. Iowa State
Big Ten #8 vs. Big XII #8

? - Iowa vs. Georgia Tech
Big Ten #2 vs. ACC #1
3 up, 1 down, 3 even


L - Cincinnati vs. Florida
Big East #1 vs. SEC #2

W - Pittsburgh vs. North Carolina
Big East #3 vs. ACC #7

L - West Virginia vs. Florida State
Big East #2 vs. ACC #6

W - Connecticut vs. South Carolina
Big East #5 vs. SEC #7
4 down

Now all of the information is out there.

karen lotz wrote:

LJ wrote: Either you are really this dense, or you just refuse to believe anyone that says something against your opinion. Notre Dame has auto qualifier status. They are a 1 team conference. Their conference champ was destroyed in all 3 of their appearances, so why should they be an auto qualifier? They should have at large status, not their own auto qualifier nor non-bcs. Just plain at large status. Notre Dame REALLY does not deserve auto qualifier status.

Yeah ok, because they are independent, they are in a one team conference. Are you that dense that you don't understand what independent means? Yes, they have auto qualifier status if they reach certain criteria, just like non BCS teams do. Saying Notre Dame is a conference champ and automatic qualifier is laughable. According to you, they won their "conference" every year of the BCS' existence, except I've never seen any mention of it and they only have 3 BCS appearances? Seems like ND didn't get a very good deal...

#
# A special case is made for independent Notre Dame, which receives an automatic berth if it finishes in the top eight.

Tell me, what has ND done to deserve that AQ status over the other independants? What gives them status like a conference champion?

Are you so dense that you don't understand that ND is being treated like a conference champion when they reach #8? Why do they deserve that? What have they done to deserve that? 3 BCS appearances, 3 blowout losses. Give me a break. Go spew your opinionated bullshit somewhere else. Hell, I even LIKE Notre Dame.

LJ wrote:
Tell me, what has ND done to deserve that AQ status over the other independants? What gives them status like a conference champion?

Are you so dense that you don't understand that ND is being treated like a conference champion when they reach #8? Why do they deserve that? What have they done to deserve that? 3 BCS appearances, 3 blowout losses. Give me a break. Go spew your opinionated bullshit somewhere else. Hell, I even LIKE Notre Dame.

I'm not sure what they have done to deserve it but I didn't write the BCS selection procedures, did I? Someone who was a part of that process felt it was necessary to include that Notre Dame clause.

The champion of Conference USA, the Mid-American Conference, the Mountain West Conference, the Sun Belt Conference, or the Western Athletic Conference will earn an automatic berth in a BCS bowl game if either:

A. Such team is ranked in the top 12 of the final BCS Standings, or,
B. Such team is ranked in the top 16 of the final BCS Standings and its ranking in the final BCS Standings is higher than that of a champion of a conference that has an annual automatic berth in one of the BCS bowls.

What have those conferences done to show they deserve that clause? There are 10 BCS spots available, correct? If a MAC champion ended at #12 in the BCS rankings, do they deserve to take a spot away from a team ranked ahead of them from one of the BCS conferences? Not necessarily. The Bylaws were written to be fair to everyone, not to give an edge to Notre Dame.

karen lotz wrote:

LJ wrote:
Tell me, what has ND done to deserve that AQ status over the other independants? What gives them status like a conference champion?

Are you so dense that you don't understand that ND is being treated like a conference champion when they reach #8? Why do they deserve that? What have they done to deserve that? 3 BCS appearances, 3 blowout losses. Give me a break. Go spew your opinionated bullshit somewhere else. Hell, I even LIKE Notre Dame.

I'm not sure what they have done to deserve it but I didn't write the BCS selection procedures, did I? Someone who was a part of that process felt it was necessary to include that Notre Dame clause.

The champion of Conference USA, the Mid-American Conference, the Mountain West Conference, the Sun Belt Conference, or the Western Athletic Conference will earn an automatic berth in a BCS bowl game if either:

A. Such team is ranked in the top 12 of the final BCS Standings, or,
B. Such team is ranked in the top 16 of the final BCS Standings and its ranking in the final BCS Standings is higher than that of a champion of a conference that has an annual automatic berth in one of the BCS bowls.

What have those conferences done to show they deserve that clause? There are 10 BCS spots available, correct? If a MAC champion ended at #12 in the BCS rankings, do they deserve to take a spot away from a team ranked ahead of them from one of the BCS conferences? Not necessarily. The Bylaws were written to be fair to everyone, not to give an edge to Notre Dame.

The highest ranked champion from a combination of those conferences gets the AQ bid, you cherry picked that part out. So only 1 non-AQ team gets an AQ bid. So, you ask, why is Notre Dame included in this discussion? Because they have the Notre Dame Clause, they aren't battling with scores of other teams for 1 AQ bid, they get their own if they are #8. They don't deserve it.

The non-AQ conferences are 3-1 in BCS bowls, I believe that deserves an AQ-bid over ND don't you?

What did I cherry pick out? That is quoted from the BCS selection process page. One of those champions will get a berth IF it is ranked in the top 12 or top 16 and it is ranked higher than an AQ from a BCS conference. So what would be more deserving? A team playing a schedule full of directional schools that ends up ranked #12 or a Notre Dame team that is ranked #8?

karen lotz wrote: What did I cherry pick out? That is quoted from the BCS selection process page. One of those champions will get a berth IF it is ranked in the top 12 or top 16 and it is ranked higher than an AQ from a BCS conference. So what would be more deserving? A team playing a schedule full of directional schools that ends up ranked #12 or a Notre Dame team that is ranked #8?

The non-AQ AQ-bids record= 3-1
ND record= 0-3

You tell me?

LJ wrote: The highest ranked champion from a combination of those conferences gets the AQ bid, you cherry picked that part out. So only 1 non-AQ team gets an AQ bid. So, you ask, why is Notre Dame included in this discussion? Because they have the Notre Dame Clause, they aren't battling with scores of other teams for 1 AQ bid, they get their own if they are #8. They don't deserve it.

The non-AQ conferences are 3-1 in BCS bowls, I believe that deserves an AQ-bid over ND don't you?

Why are you changing your argument? Couldn't be because you were wrong could it?

karen lotz wrote:

LJ wrote: The highest ranked champion from a combination of those conferences gets the AQ bid, you cherry picked that part out. So only 1 non-AQ team gets an AQ bid. So, you ask, why is Notre Dame included in this discussion? Because they have the Notre Dame Clause, they aren't battling with scores of other teams for 1 AQ bid, they get their own if they are #8. They don't deserve it.

The non-AQ conferences are 3-1 in BCS bowls, I believe that deserves an AQ-bid over ND don't you?

Why are you changing your argument? Couldn't be because you were wrong could it?

What the fuck did I change? Tell me "oh dumb one".

Cleveland Buck-nice leg work

So you are still saying that the highest ranked non BCS conference champion gets an automatic bid?? You failed to bring that up after I slowly explained the IF in their clause.

karen lotz wrote: So you are still saying that the highest ranked non BCS conference champion gets an automatic bid?? You failed to bring that up after I slowly explained the IF in their clause.

What the hell kind of strawman are you trying to spin?

I never said that the highest ranking non BCS conference champ didn't get an Auto bid.

They have also gone 3-1 and ND has gone 0-3.

Obviously the non BCS conference bid is much more worthy than the Notre Dame bid.

props to Cleveland Buck for some nice work there....

I'm curious as to why only Little Danny responded to my post, and not the original poster.