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se-alum
Posts: 13,948
Sep 18, 2013 12:17pm
Well, there may be a handful of QB's in college football that have as strong an arm as Miller, so compared to Miller, yea, Guiton has the weaker arm. Meyer joked about Guiton not having enough arm strength, but then pointed out it was a joke. I'll take what I see on the field over what some "analyst" says. A guy with a weak arm doesn't throw the ball 60 yards in the air with accuracy. Granted, we haven't gotten to see much of Miller this year, but his reading of progressions has never been that great either.LJ;1502946 wrote:The coaches and all the analysts talk about him not having as strong of an arm as Miller.
A good Ross Fulton breakdown from 11W
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LJ
Posts: 16,351
Sep 18, 2013 12:21pm
I never said he had a weak arm, I said he lacks the arm strength to throw some of the routes that the staff wants to run. I haven't seen anything to say that he can zip the ball in on a 10 yard out to the wide side of the field.se-alum;1502950 wrote:Well, there may be a handful of QB's in college football that have as strong an arm as Miller, so compared to Miller, yea, Guiton has the weaker arm. Meyer joked about Guiton not having enough arm strength, but then pointed out it was a joke. I'll take what I see on the field over what some "analyst" says. A guy with a weak arm doesn't throw the ball 60 yards in the air with accuracy. Granted, we haven't gotten to see much of Miller this year, but his reading of progressions has never been that great either.
I'd also have to say that I will take Ross Fulton's word over anyone on here's eye test any day.
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se-alum
Posts: 13,948
Sep 18, 2013 12:24pm
Well, it's not worth arguing over. We're lucky to have 2 QB's that we can even have this conversation about.LJ;1502954 wrote:I never said he had a weak arm, I said he lacks the arm strength to throw some of the routes that the staff wants to run. I haven't seen anything to say that he can zip the ball in on a 10 yard out to the wide side of the field.
I'd also have to say that I will take Ross Fulton's word over anyone on here's eye test any day.
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WebFire
Posts: 14,779
Sep 18, 2013 12:37pm
If this is lack of arm strength, I'd take it.
Edit: watch 30 seconds in. The YouTube time thingy is not working.
[video=youtube;zyXjI48A0-w][/video]
Edit: watch 30 seconds in. The YouTube time thingy is not working.
[video=youtube;zyXjI48A0-w][/video]
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slcoach
Posts: 421
Sep 18, 2013 12:42pm
I cannot believe that there are people actually calling for Kenny over Braxton. That is just stupid.
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LJ
Posts: 16,351
Sep 18, 2013 12:44pm
WebFire;1502965 wrote:If this is lack of arm strength, I'd take it.
Edit: watch 30 seconds in. The YouTube time thingy is not working.
[video=youtube;zyXjI48A0-w][/video]
Ok, but we aren't talking about those throws. Getting air under a ball is different than a 10 yard out to the wide side of the field.
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WebFire
Posts: 14,779
Sep 18, 2013 1:05pm
Has Braxton shown a consistent ability to do that? Honest question, because I don't know.LJ;1502973 wrote:Ok, but we aren't talking about those throws. Getting air under a ball is different than a 10 yard out to the wide side of the field.
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LJ
Posts: 16,351
Sep 18, 2013 1:10pm
Yes. And supposedly he is better at checking down his progressions. Guiton has a tendency to lock onto a guy, but that was pretty much moot the past 2 weeks with SDSU and Cal (SDSU is #101 in pass D, Cal #110 in pass D). Miller went through his progressions to a fault during the UB game because the staff told him that he was not allowed to run. The staff runs a lot more intermediate routes to the outside with Miller in the game. As referenced, Guiton has thrown almost exclusively come backs, middle of the field, or deep.WebFire;1502986 wrote:Has Braxton shown a consistent ability to do that? Honest question, because I don't know.
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se-alum
Posts: 13,948
Sep 18, 2013 1:11pm
Maybe a handful of guys in college football that can make that throw consistently.LJ;1502973 wrote:Ok, but we aren't talking about those throws. Getting air under a ball is different than a 10 yard out to the wide side of the field.
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LJ
Posts: 16,351
Sep 18, 2013 1:12pm
And Miller is one of them, which is who people are comparing Guiton to. What's your point?se-alum;1502992 wrote:Maybe a handful of guys in college football that can make that throw consistently.
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se-alum
Posts: 13,948
Sep 18, 2013 1:24pm
Evidently there is some sort of phenomenon where a QB's arm gets weaker the shorter the throw.WebFire;1502965 wrote:If this is lack of arm strength, I'd take it.
Edit: watch 30 seconds in. The YouTube time thingy is not working.
[video=youtube;zyXjI48A0-w][/video]
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LJ
Posts: 16,351
Sep 18, 2013 1:30pm
se-alum;1503003 wrote:Evidently there is some sort of phenomenon where a QB's arm gets weaker the shorter the throw.
Physics > you, apparently.
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se-alum
Posts: 13,948
Sep 18, 2013 1:34pm
Apparently you are from the Coa/like_that school of debate.LJ;1503012 wrote:Physics > you, apparently.
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LJ
Posts: 16,351
Sep 18, 2013 1:37pm
Why, because I understand that it takes less force to propel an object in an arc than in a straight line?se-alum;1503017 wrote:Apparently you are from the Coa/like_that school of debate.
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LJ
Posts: 16,351
Sep 18, 2013 1:38pm
Hence
Guiton throws a very nice deep ball, however, where he can put air under the football.
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se-alum
Posts: 13,948
Sep 18, 2013 2:03pm
Undoubtedly if you're trying to throw the ball 10 yards in a straight line as opposed to 10 yards on an arc, it takes less force for the arc. When you can throw the ball 65 yards on an arc, it's hard to believe you don't have the arm strength to throw the ball 35 yards with some force. It would be an interesting study though. I would believe that timing and accuracy may be a problem with Guiton on the intermediate routes. I'm also in no way advocating Guiton to be the starter. This is Miller's team.LJ;1503019 wrote:Why, because I understand that it takes less force to propel an object in an arc than in a straight line?
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se-alum
Posts: 13,948
Sep 18, 2013 2:33pm
Found a study on Cam Newton. It took 2m/s higher velocity to throw the ball 50 yards, as opposed to 20 yards.
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LJ
Posts: 16,351
Sep 18, 2013 2:39pm
So (I am assuming) less than 1.5x the force to throw the ball more than 2.5x the distancese-alum;1503083 wrote:Found a study on Cam Newton. It took 2m/s higher velocity to throw the ball 50 yards, as opposed to 20 yards.
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vball10set
Posts: 24,795
Sep 18, 2013 3:19pm
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believer
Posts: 8,153
Sep 18, 2013 6:44pm
Come to think of it you are right. When Ohio State loses the point will indeed be moot.SportsAndLady;1502820 wrote:And believer please, shut the fuck up.
If anyone thinks there's going to be multiple undefeated teams this year please look at the last couple years. It's not happening. OSU goes undefeated they're in the BCSNCG.
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Fly4Fun
Posts: 7,730
Sep 18, 2013 8:31pm
So much anger so early in the season. It's like so many people here aren't even going to enjoy the season but worry and be negative about everything.
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SportsAndLady
Posts: 35,632
Sep 18, 2013 8:33pm
Fly4Fun;1503326 wrote:So much anger so early in the season. It's like so many people here aren't even going to enjoy the season but worry and be negative about everything.
It's exactly what its like F4F!!!!!!!
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rydawg5
Posts: 2,639
Sep 18, 2013 8:36pm
It is tough when I'm at work today and a co-worker says we should "stay with the hot hand" - Don't people understand you are basically saying that you would pick about 80 other quarterbacks over Braxton Miller when using this logic? Portland State's QB had great numbers against California, with Portland State's Players! Can you imagine what this QB would do with OSU talent on offense? Maybe he should transfer to OSU so HE can start over Braxton. I mean, he is a hot hand.
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Rotinaj
Posts: 7,699
Sep 19, 2013 8:46am
No, just no.rydawg5;1503333 wrote:It is tough when I'm at work today and a co-worker says we should "stay with the hot hand" - Don't people understand you are basically saying that you would pick about 80 other quarterbacks over Braxton Miller when using this logic? Portland State's QB had great numbers against California, with Portland State's Players! Can you imagine what this QB would do with OSU talent on offense? Maybe he should transfer to OSU so HE can start over Braxton. I mean, he is a hot hand.
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Wally
Posts: 481
Sep 19, 2013 2:07pm
About Millers arm strength:
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1546433-braxton-millers-qb-coach-says-he-has-rare-arm-talent-and-hes-right
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1546433-braxton-millers-qb-coach-says-he-has-rare-arm-talent-and-hes-right