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mhs95_06
Posts: 8,167
Jul 30, 2013 12:02am
Leake's ERA is better because his line-up navigation skills have been better this year, but that doesn't mean he'd be better in the playoffs.Azubuike24;1480059 wrote:Leake:
Hits/9 - 8.63
WHIP - 1.19
BAA - .255
K:BB Ratio - 2.6:1
Bailey:
Hits/9 - 8.34
WHIP - 1.16
BAA - .247
K:BB Ratio - 4.31:1
Numbers don't lie. Bailey, overall, has been better than Leake. Leake's vastly overachieving this year and I'm not sure any Reds fan can disagree with me. His ERA, is simply a statistical anomaly right now.
Azubuike24
Posts: 15,933
Jul 30, 2013 12:03am
...and I've said it since opening day. You can't afford to throw two junkballers in the playoffs. Maybe, you can afford to have Leake OR Arroyo, but not both. You would also, ideally, have a lefty as well.mhs95_06;1480062 wrote:I agree with Azubuike on the need for power pitchers in the play-offs. The tendency for the hitters in these more important games seems to me to be that they get smarter, going oppo etc, not taking so many wild swings which is to the detriment of finesse pitchers, and they get more tentative which makes them not able to catch up as well to power pitchers rather than finesse pitchers.
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sportchampps
Posts: 7,361
Jul 30, 2013 12:05am
Lmao Votto
SportsAndLady
Posts: 35,632
Jul 30, 2013 12:05am
"Numbers don't lie"
Yet you're starting the 5-10, 3.77 ERA Homer Bailey (who is not all mentally there) instead of the 10-4, 2.65 ERA who was mentally prepared for the big leagues straight out of college.
Yeah, okay
Yet you're starting the 5-10, 3.77 ERA Homer Bailey (who is not all mentally there) instead of the 10-4, 2.65 ERA who was mentally prepared for the big leagues straight out of college.
Yeah, okay
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mhs95_06
Posts: 8,167
Jul 30, 2013 12:06am
Joey Votto has a very poor base running concept!
Azubuike24
Posts: 15,933
Jul 30, 2013 12:07am
I'm arguing the merit of ERA. I'm stating there are a half-dozen other numbers Bailey is even or superior in that are equally or more important.SportsAndLady;1480067 wrote:"Numbers don't lie"
Yet you're starting the 5-10, 3.77 ERA Homer Bailey (who is not all mentally there) instead of the 10-4, 2.65 ERA who was mentally prepared for the big leagues straight out of college.
Yeah, okay
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sportchampps
Posts: 7,361
Jul 30, 2013 12:07am
He's from Canada give him a break
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sportchampps
Posts: 7,361
Jul 30, 2013 12:07am
Should have 2 on 1 down
SportsAndLady
Posts: 35,632
Jul 30, 2013 12:08am
So how many runs allowed over the course of a season per 9 innings has little merit?Azubuike24;1480070 wrote:I'm arguing the merit of ERA. I'm stating there are a half-dozen other numbers Bailey is even or superior in that are equally or more important.
Haha you are literally just making shit up to support your argument.
"Numbers don't lie" "ERA has little merit" "my guy has a better k:walk ratio"
I mean are you listening to the stuff you're saying?
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mhs95_06
Posts: 8,167
Jul 30, 2013 12:09am
That is why this should be Bronson's last season with the Reds, unless he agrees to less money and understands that he probably won't pitch in the playoffs.Azubuike24;1480065 wrote:...and I've said it since opening day. You can't afford to throw two junkballers in the playoffs. Maybe, you can afford to have Leake OR Arroyo, but not both. You would also, ideally, have a lefty as well.
Azubuike24
Posts: 15,933
Jul 30, 2013 12:11am
Yep, and in the playoffs, it's win or go home. You don't have 30 "solid" performances to bank on.
Maybe our argument is futile, because there are supporters on both sides. I just think the only shot this team has is to play the upside and roll with your best shot at getting a dominating pitching performance.
We both know that games that are 3-2, 4-3, etc...that come down to clutch hitting and the little things late in the game, the Reds will lose. I mean, does their extra innings and 1-run record not support that? Same with their record against above .500 teams.
Maybe our argument is futile, because there are supporters on both sides. I just think the only shot this team has is to play the upside and roll with your best shot at getting a dominating pitching performance.
We both know that games that are 3-2, 4-3, etc...that come down to clutch hitting and the little things late in the game, the Reds will lose. I mean, does their extra innings and 1-run record not support that? Same with their record against above .500 teams.
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sportchampps
Posts: 7,361
Jul 30, 2013 12:12am
Cingrani latos cueto leake should be the playoff pitchers dusty will go cueto latos bailey arroyo
Azubuike24
Posts: 15,933
Jul 30, 2013 12:13am
Lets hear the others on the forum chime in, and see how many are in agreement with what I'm saying. I'm not saying you're completely wrong, but I do think dismissing everything except ERA, especially when I'm talking about a single start, do or die situation, and you're talking about a 100+ game span.SportsAndLady;1480073 wrote:I mean are you listening to the stuff you're saying?
Ironman92
Posts: 49,363
Jul 30, 2013 12:14am
Azubuike24;1480078 wrote:Yep, and in the playoffs, it's win or go home. You don't have 30 "solid" performances to bank on.
Maybe our argument is futile, because there are supporters on both sides. I just think the only shot this team has is to play the upside and roll with your best shot at getting a dominating pitching performance.
We both know that games that are 3-2, 4-3, etc...that come down to clutch hitting and the little things late in the game, the Reds will lose. I mean, does their extra innings and 1-run record not support that? Same with their record against above .500 teams.
What's it take in the playoffs? 7 inn and 4 or fewer hits? Homer has done that 3 times this year.....Leake has done it 6 times and despite how it seems this game he's 3 outs from a 7th.
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sportchampps
Posts: 7,361
Jul 30, 2013 12:14am
Era trumps all
Azubuike24
Posts: 15,933
Jul 30, 2013 12:15am
Bailey owns Latos in every single category...sportchampps;1480079 wrote:Cingrani latos cueto leake should be the playoff pitchers dusty will go cueto latos bailey arroyo
People don't realize how great of a season Homer is having...despite the ERA.
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sportchampps
Posts: 7,361
Jul 30, 2013 12:15am
His game management is the xfactor
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sportchampps
Posts: 7,361
Jul 30, 2013 12:16am
Homer is great every other game
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sportchampps
Posts: 7,361
Jul 30, 2013 12:17am
When Bailey is on he's got just filty stuff the problem is at this point in his career he just doesn't have it night in and night out. If he gets consistently he could be a cy young contender.
Ironman92
Posts: 49,363
Jul 30, 2013 12:18am
Azubuike24;1480083 wrote:Bailey owns Latos in every single category...
People don't realize how great of a season Homer is having...despite the ERA.
Then Homer's karma sucks and I don't want bad karma out there over Latos or Leake.
Azubuike24
Posts: 15,933
Jul 30, 2013 12:18am
Regardless, in the end, I hope I'm 100% wrong and both Arroyo and Leake, if they have to pitch in the playoffs, prove me wrong.
Ironman92
Posts: 49,363
Jul 30, 2013 12:19am
Mike Leake 7 inn , 4 hits, 0 runs
2.59 era
2.59 era
SportsAndLady
Posts: 35,632
Jul 30, 2013 12:21am
Azubuike24;1480083 wrote:Bailey owns Latos in every single category...
People don't realize how great of a season Homer is having...despite the ERA.
Yet you don't say this about leake! You're COMPLETELY biased against leake it's fucking silly.
So homer gives up fewer hits..what a season! His era is a full point above leakes yet leake can't be trusted and homer can.
I cannot take this conversation seriously. It's mind-boggling.
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mhs95_06
Posts: 8,167
Jul 30, 2013 12:25am
Please send Leake out to face Evereth!
Terry_Tate
Posts: 7,606
Jul 30, 2013 12:26am
Homer Bailey WAR - 3.2
Mike Leake WAR - 1.2
Case closed.
Mike Leake WAR - 1.2
Case closed.