TedSheckler;1456689 wrote:If he was not part of any sanctioned neighborhood watch, then he did nothing wrong.

So then he wasn't neighborhood watch, and was out playing cop. Which is it?

He was out protecting neighbor's property. Not a crime and totally ok to be walking around looking for suspicious activity after a bunch of break-ins. He saw someone suspicious and called the cops. He was following him until the cops were to get there because, "they always get away", which is a good enough reason to watch someone.

TedSheckler;1456699 wrote:He was out protecting neighbor's property. Not a crime and totally ok to be walking around looking for suspicious activity after a bunch of break-ins.

Yes, without a gun.

He saw someone suspicious and called the cops.

The right move

He was following him until the cops were to get there because, "they always get away", which is a good enough reason to watch someone.

The wrong move to follow him. He had no reason to follow him. What was he going to do if the guy ran before the cops got there? Catch him and make a citizens arrest? It was not his place to get that involved.

LJ;1456704 wrote:Yes, without a gun.

He was legally carrying. Remember, he wasn't part of any sanctioned neighborhood watch, as you say.

LJ;1456704 wrote:The wrong move to follow him. He had no reason to follow him. What was he going to do if the guy ran before the cops got there? Catch him and make a citizens arrest? It was not his place to get that involved.

I forgot, you wrote the handbook on the proper way on when and how to follow a suspicious subject. Got it.

TedSheckler;1456712 wrote:He was legally carrying. Remember, he wasn't part of any sanctioned neighborhood watch, as you say.



I forgot, you wrote the handbook on the proper way on when and how to follow a suspicious subject. Got it.

His getting involved escalated the situation to the point of someone dying did it not? That is exactly why citizens are always told to not get involved in a situation where they are not 100% sure of what is going on. In other words, citizens should never follow someone around just because in their mind, they are being "suspicious". The is no "when" or "how", it should be "never"

ccrunner609;1456674 wrote:Or what if this POS kid was out doing hood rat shit and was going to rob or steal stuff. What if this wanna be tough kid was out playing thug and assaulted somebodyt hat didnt have a gun?

Why if you weren't a stone racist?

TedSheckler;1456677 wrote:George Zimmerman was a neighborhood watch volunteer who was looking for the unknown subject that he called the cops on. He wasn't playing cop.

You absolutely do not know this for a fact.

TedSheckler;1456699 wrote:He was out protecting neighbor's property. Not a crime and totally ok to be walking around looking for suspicious activity after a bunch of break-ins. He saw someone suspicious and called the cops. He was following him until the cops were to get there because, "they always get away", which is a good enough reason to watch someone.

You do not know this.

LJ;1456716 wrote:His getting involved escalated the situation to the point of someone dying did it not?

No, I'm pretty sure TM beating on GZ is what got him killed. Don't bring Skittles to a gun fight.

LJ;1456661 wrote:I lost any objectivity...

That was the only factual statement in your post.

TedSheckler;1456735 wrote:No, I'm pretty sure TM beating on GZ is what got him killed. Don't bring Skittles to a gun fight.

No, I am pretty sure Zimmerman following Martin around is what escalated the whole situation.

queencitybuckeye;1456732 wrote:You do not know this.

queencitybuckeye;1456731 wrote:You absolutely do not know this for a fact.

Yes I do.

http://www.documentcloud.org/documents/326700-full-transcript-zimmerman.html

gut;1456736 wrote:That was the only factual statement in your post.

Oh really? So he didn't get out of his car with a gun? Didn't follow someone? Someone didn't die because of it?

Oh right, just mouthing off, got it.

LJ;1456738 wrote:No, I am pretty sure Zimmerman following Martin around is what escalated the whole situation.

Escalated, sure. Got him killed? No.

TedSheckler;1456739 wrote:Yes I do.

http://www.documentcloud.org/documents/326700-full-transcript-zimmerman.html

No, you know what someone SAID. Not the same as knowing what happened. I wonder why you choose to accept it as fact.

LJ;1456740 wrote:Oh really? So he didn't get out of his car with a gun? Didn't follow someone? Someone didn't die because of it?

Oh right, just mouthing off, got it.

You think he's going to leave his car with the gun in it? And, no, I don't think it's been established he was following/stalking Martin. Nor does it follow that someone died because of it - might Martin's choice to jump a guy with a concealed carry that got him killed, which is not equivalent to what you said.

Sorry, your post contained two facts, not one. My bad.

You admitted you lost objectivity, and it's clear in numerous of your posts. I have no idea why you continue to pretend otherwise.

gut;1456751 wrote:You think he's going to leave his car with the gun in it? And, no, I don't think it's been established he was following/stalking Martin. Nor does it follow that someone died because of it - might Martin's choice to jump a guy with a concealed carry that got him killed, which is not equivalent to what you said.

Sorry, your post contained two facts, not one. My bad.

You admitted you lost objectivity, and it's clear in numerous of your posts. I have no idea why you continue to pretend otherwise.

It has been established that he was following Martin. He said so himself, in the reenactment, and in the police call. And my point is that he should not have left the car at all. Leaving the gun in it has nothing to do with anything, and not a point that anyone has tried to make.

I also never pretended to be objective about it.

LJ;1456661 wrote:I lost any objectivity when

...when you made up false accusations against Zimmerman.

Originally Posted by LJ
Typically something like this I would say that Martin and Zimmerman both got caught up in the wrong situation at the wrong time. The problem I have though is that Zimmerman has been arrested before for "playing cop" and chasing people. The guy was out looking for trouble, and I honestly hope the jury sees that.

LJ;1456753 wrote: And my point is that he should not have left the car at all.

He has every legal right in the world to exit his car in a public place. You're blaming him for someone's death when it's yet to be shown he did anything remotely illegal.

Travon Martin is dead, most likely, because HE chose to confront Zimmerman. Until proven otherwise, that is the operating assumption/fact.

I think Zimmerman was reckless and irresponsible. But, I'm sorry, that is not a crime. We are not talking something that would even begin to approach gross negligence.

Didn't zimmermans lawyers already say tthey would not be using stand your ground defense?

Gblock;1456806 wrote:Didn't zimmermans lawyers already say tthey would not be using stand your ground defense?

I think they opted not to have the hearing before the trial, but can still use that defense in court.

BUT, of course you'll have to ask LJ to be sure.

Martin was a wanna be thug

Trueblue23;1457496 wrote:Martin was a wanna be thug

So was Zimmerman lol

6 woman jury. 5 white, 1 hispanic.
Judge is still being ridiculous to the defense. All of a sudden a state witness has to give 'perpetual' testimony before trial because he will be absent. That takes everything he/she says out of context for possible cross exam. Other hearings today being rejected, biased toward the state not addressing an issue raised in prior hearing, and now allowing the state to call him names like 'vigilante' and 'wannabe cop'.

Tough to call this one, but the judge has long been manipulating as much as possible for the state. Hell, the hearing to allow 'experts' on voice recognition is still being heard. Naturally they are not allowing the defense time to prepare for the state's claims while forcing the opinion down the jury's throat. The book says he walks but the actions by the state say they are playing dirty to win a conviction. I think the state will have some witness that are willing to say whatever it takes.

Martin was beating the crap out of Zimmerman, and according to Florida law there should not be any charge in this case . This case is nothing but political. The networks made this a race issue and just like the OJ simpson jury nulification ,this case is a travisty. This is total reverse race discrimination against what the media is calling a white hispanic. Only because Zimmerman doesnt fit the stero-typical Florida hispanic make-up. Zimmerman does not talk with a broken accent. This country is no better than China when the government circumvents state laws because of political pressure.