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sleeper's avatar

sleeper

Legend

27,879 posts
Apr 27, 2012 11:43 AM
He's an omnipotent being who cannot create a rock in which he cannot lift.

He's also "perfect". Yet, he needs worship. Fail.
Apr 27, 2012 11:43am
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queencitybuckeye

Senior Member

7,117 posts
Apr 27, 2012 11:44 AM
Skyhook79;1154813 wrote:There is no evidence of intelligent life on any other planet.
No, but simple statistics tell us the odds of the trillions of planets and billions similar to this one all being devoid of life is a number very close to zero.
Apr 27, 2012 11:44am
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Con_Alma

Senior Member

12,198 posts
Apr 27, 2012 11:44 AM
sleeper;1155013 wrote:Aka, cop out. It must be nice to just declare whatever you need to; avoiding having to accept that your beliefs collapse under any critical scrutiny.
Why is it a cop out? I need not declare anything. I am confident that my belief would not collapse under your's or anyone else's scrutiny.
Apr 27, 2012 11:44am
sleeper's avatar

sleeper

Legend

27,879 posts
Apr 27, 2012 11:44 AM
cruiser_96;1155015 wrote:I do not think recognizing the fact that we are contingent beings is hoodwinking people. I think it's recognizing that we are contingent beings.

The fact that we are (I assume we all agree on this) and the fact that "nothing can turn into something" seems to be an impossiblilty should at a minimum expose the fact something happened. No?
Sure. I think science is working on a solution to creating something from nothing. The sad part is, if we ever discover that, believers will try to warp it with crap like "Oh so that's how God did it".

So delusional and so helpless. Their minds are corrupted.
Apr 27, 2012 11:44am
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Con_Alma

Senior Member

12,198 posts
Apr 27, 2012 11:45 AM
sleeper;1155016 wrote:He's an omnipotent being who cannot create a rock in which he cannot lift.

He's also "perfect". Yet, he needs worship. Fail.
He doesn't "need" worship. Need is a human trait. why would you assume He possess such a thing?
Apr 27, 2012 11:45am
sleeper's avatar

sleeper

Legend

27,879 posts
Apr 27, 2012 11:45 AM
Con_Alma;1155019 wrote:Why is it a cop out? I need not declare anything. I am confident that my belief would not collapse under your's or anyone else's scrutiny.
You are declaring that God does not have to adhere to our rules of known physics. It's a cop out and it most definite does collapse under scrutiny.
Apr 27, 2012 11:45am
sleeper's avatar

sleeper

Legend

27,879 posts
Apr 27, 2012 11:46 AM
Con_Alma;1155021 wrote:He doesn't "need" worship. Need is a human trait. why would you assume He possess such a thing?
Is jealousy a human trait, because that's all the first commandment deals with is jealousy. Or is it the second, either way, you'll just use another cop out, so what's the point anyway?
Apr 27, 2012 11:46am
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Con_Alma

Senior Member

12,198 posts
Apr 27, 2012 11:47 AM
sleeper;1155022 wrote:You are declaring that God does not have to adhere to our rules of known physics. It's a cop out and it most definite does collapse under scrutiny.
I didn't say he doesn't adhere to physics. I am saying you don't know that an omnipotent being can be impacted by the laws of physics.
Apr 27, 2012 11:47am
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Con_Alma

Senior Member

12,198 posts
Apr 27, 2012 11:49 AM
sleeper;1155024 wrote:Is jealousy a human trait, because that's all the first commandment deals with is jealousy. Or is it the second, either way, you'll just use another cop out, so what's the point anyway?
Of course jealousy is a human trait....a trait which God may or may not possess. To assume God, unless referring to Christ, has all of the traits a human has is nothing more than an assumption.

Christ felt all that we as humans felt.
Apr 27, 2012 11:49am
sleeper's avatar

sleeper

Legend

27,879 posts
Apr 27, 2012 11:49 AM
Con_Alma;1155025 wrote:I didn't say he doesn't adhere to physics. I am saying you don't know that an omnipotent being can be impacted by the laws of physics.
Prove it.
Apr 27, 2012 11:49am
sleeper's avatar

sleeper

Legend

27,879 posts
Apr 27, 2012 11:50 AM
Con_Alma;1155028 wrote:Of course jealousy is a human trait....a trait which God may or may not possess. To assume God, unless referring to Christ, has all of the traits a human has is nothing more than an assumption.

Christ felt all that we as humans felt.
So Christ is God, but has human traits, but need cannot be a human trait attributed to God?

Sounds logical. :rolleyes:
Apr 27, 2012 11:50am
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Con_Alma

Senior Member

12,198 posts
Apr 27, 2012 11:51 AM
sleeper;1155029 wrote:Prove it.
I have no reason to but I'll try.

Since you nor anyone else have not ever provided evidence that any omnipotent being is impacted by the rues of physics it's safe to hypothesize that we know not if they do.
Apr 27, 2012 11:51am
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Con_Alma

Senior Member

12,198 posts
Apr 27, 2012 11:52 AM
sleeper;1155032 wrote:So Christ is God, but has human traits, but need cannot be a human trait attributed to God?

Sounds logical. :rolleyes:
God may or may not have human traits. God in Christ did.
Apr 27, 2012 11:52am
sleeper's avatar

sleeper

Legend

27,879 posts
Apr 27, 2012 11:53 AM
Con_Alma;1155033 wrote:I have no reason to but I'll try.

Since you nor anyone else have not ever provided evidence that any omnipotent being is impacted by the rues of physics it's safe to hypothesize that we know not if they do.
Correct. We do not "know". Just like you don't know if an omnipotent being even exists. You don't know, but you claim you know. Pretty broken logic.
Apr 27, 2012 11:53am
sleeper's avatar

sleeper

Legend

27,879 posts
Apr 27, 2012 11:53 AM
Con_Alma;1155035 wrote:God may or may not have human traits. God in Christ did.
God/Christ/Holy Spirit = same thing. They are only different when its convenient for you.
Apr 27, 2012 11:53am
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Con_Alma

Senior Member

12,198 posts
Apr 27, 2012 11:53 AM
sleeper;1155037 wrote:God/Christ/Holy Spirit = same thing. They are only different when its convenient for you.
They are not the same thing. They are three in one.
Apr 27, 2012 11:53am
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Con_Alma

Senior Member

12,198 posts
Apr 27, 2012 11:54 AM
sleeper;1155036 wrote:Correct. We do not "know". Just like you don't know if an omnipotent being even exists. You don't know, but you claim you know. Pretty broken logic.
I know He exist. I know not everything about him.

It is not logic that provides such belief. Didn't we agree on that already?
Apr 27, 2012 11:54am
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Con_Alma

Senior Member

12,198 posts
Apr 27, 2012 12:03 PM
Raw Dawgin' it;1155014 wrote:you just made his point...
When Stephen Hawking, George Ellis, and Roger Penrose extended the equations for general relativity to include space and time, the results showed that time has a beginning - at the moment of creation (i.e., the Big Bang).[SUP][/SUP] In fact, if you examine university websites, you will find that many professors make such a claim - that the universe had a beginning and that this beginning marked the beginning of time. Such assertions support the Bible's claim that time began at the creation of the universe.

God has no need to have been created, since He exists either outside time (where cause and effect do not operate) or within multiple dimensions of time (such that there is no beginning of God's plane of time). Hence God is eternal, having never been created. Although it is possible that the universe itself is eternal, eliminating the need for its creation, observational evidence contradicts this hypothesis, since the universe began to exist a finite ~13.7 billion years ago.
Apr 27, 2012 12:03pm
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enigmaax

Senior Member

4,511 posts
Apr 27, 2012 12:04 PM
sleeper;1155008 wrote:Like I said, religion is akin to a cult.
This is the funny thing. It isn't "akin to", it is. It is moderately humourous to see the negative connotation my hardcore Christian friends attach to the term "cult" and to hear them try to rationalize why they aren't one. Apparently it is only a cult if someone else doesn't believe you are right. Oh wait...
Apr 27, 2012 12:04pm
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Con_Alma

Senior Member

12,198 posts
Apr 27, 2012 12:06 PM
I have never, tried to rationalise away from reliion being a cult. If a cult is what you or anyone wish to defined Christianity as, so be it.
Apr 27, 2012 12:06pm
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enigmaax

Senior Member

4,511 posts
Apr 27, 2012 12:07 PM
Con_Alma;1155048 wrote:I have never, tried to rationalise away from reliion being a cult. If a cult is what you or anyone wish to defined Christianity as, so be it.
Please note, I did not say "to hear Con_Alma...".
Apr 27, 2012 12:07pm
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Con_Alma

Senior Member

12,198 posts
Apr 27, 2012 12:09 PM
enigmaax;1155050 wrote:Please note, I did not say "to hear Con_Alma...".
Please note....I didn't assume you did. Just as you offered your opinion, I did mine as it relates to Christianity and cults.
Apr 27, 2012 12:09pm
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enigmaax

Senior Member

4,511 posts
Apr 27, 2012 12:10 PM
Con_Alma;1155021 wrote:He doesn't "need" worship. Need is a human trait. why would you assume He possess such a thing?
Is "want" a human trait? Does God possess that? What about love? How about anger? Is vengeance a human act in response to a certain human emotion? Was God mad when he flooded the earth and was that an act of vengeance?
Apr 27, 2012 12:10pm
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enigmaax

Senior Member

4,511 posts
Apr 27, 2012 12:12 PM
Con_Alma;1155051 wrote:Please note....I didn't assume you did. Just as you offered your opinion, I did mine as it relates to Christianity and cults.
You didn't offer your opinion as to how Christianity is related to a cult. You said we could have our opinion. Is your opinion that Christianity is a cult?
Apr 27, 2012 12:12pm
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Con_Alma

Senior Member

12,198 posts
Apr 27, 2012 12:13 PM
enigmaax;1155052 wrote:Is "want" a human trait? Does God possess that? What about love? How about anger? Is vengeance a human act in response to a certain human emotion? Was God mad when he flooded the earth and was that an act of vengeance?
I thought I addressed this.

Of course want, love anger and vengeance are human traits. I don't know what God does or does not posses as they relate to such traits. I don't guess that he does or does not posses certain ones.

There are indications in the Bilbe that He did and does express love, anger, vengeance.
Apr 27, 2012 12:13pm