G
Gblock
Mar 14, 2012 8:44am
http://gma.yahoo.com/orlando-watch-shooting-probe-reveals-questionable-police-conduct-032002155--abc-news.html
I've been following this case a little bit. A very tragic situation. Im not sure if its murder, but certainly the guy should have been arrested and charged with something Imo. Walking down the sidewalk is not suspicious to me, he had no reason to even approach this kid.
I've been following this case a little bit. A very tragic situation. Im not sure if its murder, but certainly the guy should have been arrested and charged with something Imo. Walking down the sidewalk is not suspicious to me, he had no reason to even approach this kid.
S
Steel Valley Football
Posts: 4,548
Mar 14, 2012 8:54am
Wannabe cop should go to jail.
Fly4Fun
Posts: 7,730
Mar 14, 2012 9:31am
That story paints a really ugly picture.
Seems like the kid got assaulted then shot for being black while walking in a white neighborhood.
Seems like the kid got assaulted then shot for being black while walking in a white neighborhood.
G
Gblock
Mar 14, 2012 9:34am
who does neighborhood watch at 800 at night? i could see if this was 2am or something but sheesh go to get some skittles and get shot
justincredible
Posts: 32,056
Mar 14, 2012 9:40am
You're 28 years old and you can't subdue an unarmed 17 year old that you outweigh by 100 pounds? He should be arrested and charged with murder or manslaughter (not sure of the legal difference).
There is no reason the guy should've even got out of his car. If you thought something was suspicious just tail him for a bit until he reaches his destination. If he breaks in, call the real cops. If he doesn't, go back to pretending to be important.
There is no reason the guy should've even got out of his car. If you thought something was suspicious just tail him for a bit until he reaches his destination. If he breaks in, call the real cops. If he doesn't, go back to pretending to be important.
justincredible
Posts: 32,056
Mar 14, 2012 9:42am
Good point. This must be one uptight community. Or this dude was looking for trouble. I guess he found it, even though he was 100% responsible for creating it.Gblock;1115822 wrote:who does neighborhood watch at 800 at night? i could see if this was 2am or something but sheesh go to get some skittles and get shot
Raw Dawgin' it
Posts: 11,466
Mar 14, 2012 9:46am
"If your friend planned the crime ahead of time, it’s murder. You see, most of the world’s legal systems distinguish between cold-blooded killings, crimes of passion, and accidental (but still unlawful) deaths. In America, “murder” applies to carefully pre-planned deaths, such as a mafia hit. “Voluntary manslaughter,” on the other hand, is what’s committed when, for example, a husband catches his wife in bed with a tennis pro and snaps.justincredible;1115826 wrote:You're 28 years old and you can't subdue an unarmed 17 year old that you outweigh by 100 pounds? He should be arrested and charged with murder or manslaughter (not sure of the legal difference).
There is no reason the guy should've even got out of his car. If you thought something was suspicious just tail him for a bit until he reaches his destination. If he breaks in, call the real cops. If he doesn't, go back to pretending to be important.
A third category, “involuntary manslaughter,” covers situations in which the death is neither pre-planned nor intentional. For instance, convincing your buddy that riding his bike off a cliff would be a totally rad idea."
Fly4Fun
Posts: 7,730
Mar 14, 2012 9:50am
Also, from the facts in that article. I have a hard time believing that self-defense would work here. He approached a non-adult merely because he was walking in the rain with his hood up (isn't that the point?) He gets in a scuffle with the kid and then eventually shoots the kid. Even assuming the kid started the fight (which is questionable at best), the force allowed in self-defense is not just whatever you want. There had to have been an subjective and objective belief of imminent death or serious bodily injury.
It'd be hard case to make that a kid (not a full grown adult, but 17 year old boy), 100lbs lighter, completely unarmed would pose that kind of threat.
It'd be hard case to make that a kid (not a full grown adult, but 17 year old boy), 100lbs lighter, completely unarmed would pose that kind of threat.
LJ
Posts: 16,351
Mar 14, 2012 9:52am
Ridiculous. The neighborhood watch guy started everything by chasing the kid. He then had to catch up with the kid and create some sort of threat for them to start fighting.
If nothing else, it's Manslaughter.
If nothing else, it's Manslaughter.
THE4RINGZ
Posts: 16,816
Mar 14, 2012 9:54am
Sad.
LJ
Posts: 16,351
Mar 14, 2012 9:56am
Because of stand your ground and castle doctrines, it's harder and harder for an instigator to prove self defense. Because these laws allow you to protect yourself in any means ness., someone who instigates a situation isn't going to get the benefit of the doubt.Fly4Fun;1115835 wrote:Also, from the facts in that article. I have a hard time believing that self-defense would work here. He approached a non-adult merely because he was walking in the rain with his hood up (isn't that the point?) He gets in a scuffle with the kid and then eventually shoots the kid. Even assuming the kid started the fight (which is questionable at best), the force allowed in self-defense is not just whatever you want. There had to have been an subjective and objective belief of imminent death or serious bodily injury.
It'd be hard case to make that a kid (not a full grown adult, but 17 year old boy), 100lbs lighter, completely unarmed would pose that kind of threat.
FatHobbit
Posts: 8,651
Mar 14, 2012 9:59am
That watch captain needs to go to jail.
justincredible
Posts: 32,056
Mar 14, 2012 10:21am
Ok, that makes sense. Dude should be charged with voluntary manslaughter.Raw Dawgin' it;1115831 wrote:"If your friend planned the crime ahead of time, it’s murder. You see, most of the world’s legal systems distinguish between cold-blooded killings, crimes of passion, and accidental (but still unlawful) deaths. In America, “murder” applies to carefully pre-planned deaths, such as a mafia hit. “Voluntary manslaughter,” on the other hand, is what’s committed when, for example, a husband catches his wife in bed with a tennis pro and snaps.
A third category, “involuntary manslaughter,” covers situations in which the death is neither pre-planned nor intentional. For instance, convincing your buddy that riding his bike off a cliff would be a totally rad idea."
hasbeen
Posts: 6,504
Mar 14, 2012 11:01am
Why does the neighborhood watch guy have a gun?
justincredible
Posts: 32,056
Mar 14, 2012 12:42pm
Yeah, pretty sure a cell phone to call the actual cops is all he actually needed.pnhasbeen;1115914 wrote:Why does the neighborhood watch guy have a gun?
Mooney44Cards
Posts: 2,754
Mar 14, 2012 1:45pm
He actually called 911, who allegedly informed him to wait for the police to arrive. I don't know if its in the article posted (I didn't read it), but I read an article about a week ago about this and it mentioned that.justincredible;1115982 wrote:Yeah, pretty sure a cell phone to call the actual cops is all he actually needed.
G
Gblock
Mar 14, 2012 1:48pm
http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/14/justice/florida-teen-shooting/index.html?hpt=us_c1
not sure how current this pic is but i was expecting him to look more dangerous than this.
not sure how current this pic is but i was expecting him to look more dangerous than this.
mcburg93
Posts: 3,167
Mar 14, 2012 1:54pm
The kid should not of took off running this would not have been a problem if that don't happen. As soon as he took off running it put it in the shooters head that the kid was doing something wrong. Nothing good was gonna come out of this with the kid running. I'm surprised the guy didn't shoot first before wrestling with the kid.
ZWICK 4 PREZ
Posts: 7,733
Mar 14, 2012 1:55pm
lol wut?mcburg93;1116043 wrote:The kid should not of took off running this would not have been a problem if that don't happen. As soon as he took off running it put it in the shooters head that the kid was doing something wrong. Nothing good was gonna come out of this with the kid running. I'm surprised the guy didn't shoot first before wrestling with the kid.
Mooney44Cards
Posts: 2,754
Mar 14, 2012 2:01pm
'Merica! Where running is proof of guilt! *sips from Budweiser tall boy*mcburg93;1116043 wrote:The kid should not of took off running this would not have been a problem if that don't happen. As soon as he took off running it put it in the shooters head that the kid was doing something wrong. Nothing good was gonna come out of this with the kid running. I'm surprised the guy didn't shoot first before wrestling with the kid.
DeyDurkie5
Posts: 11,324
Mar 14, 2012 2:02pm
seriously? if you see a guy running, are you going to shoot him?mcburg93;1116043 wrote:The kid should not of took off running this would not have been a problem if that don't happen. As soon as he took off running it put it in the shooters head that the kid was doing something wrong. Nothing good was gonna come out of this with the kid running. I'm surprised the guy didn't shoot first before wrestling with the kid.
Fab1b
Posts: 12,949
Mar 14, 2012 2:03pm
Mcburg the kid shouldn't have taken off running? A bigger man he doesn't know (not a law enforcement person) gets out of his car and starts to come at him?? I expect him to do 2 things, either stay and fight or get the hell out of there which it appeared he tried to do but was caught leading to the fight (defending himself agains the watch captain) and the shooting. This watch captain was 100% wrong based on the facts in article!
justincredible
Posts: 32,056
Mar 14, 2012 2:05pm
So it's the kids fault? Give me a break. :rolleyes:mcburg93;1116043 wrote:The kid should not of took off running this would not have been a problem if that don't happen. As soon as he took off running it put it in the shooters head that the kid was doing something wrong. Nothing good was gonna come out of this with the kid running. I'm surprised the guy didn't shoot first before wrestling with the kid.
LJ
Posts: 16,351
Mar 14, 2012 2:05pm
shaking my mother fucking headmcburg93;1116043 wrote:The kid should not of took off running this would not have been a problem if that don't happen. As soon as he took off running it put it in the shooters head that the kid was doing something wrong. Nothing good was gonna come out of this with the kid running. I'm surprised the guy didn't shoot first before wrestling with the kid.
Fab1b
Posts: 12,949
Mar 14, 2012 2:07pm
McBurg remember this was not a cop in a marked cop car, this was a civilian in a civilain car. Hell the kid could have assumed this was a pedo after him!