Humor me -- a question about the upcoming BCS title game (and a look back)

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BigAppleBuckeye's avatar

BigAppleBuckeye

Senior Member

2,935 posts
Dec 2, 2011 1:31 PM
OK, humor me for a moment. I am hearing consistently that even if LSU loses the SEC title game, that they will play Alabama for the national championship. LSU boasts the best overall resume, and Alabama claims it deserves a shot after losing to the #1 team in America by 3 points. For the record, by way, I do think these two teams are the best in the country.

That being said, in another season, which of these teams should have made the title game?

TEAM A: 12-1 ... loss was to the #11 team in America on the road. Also had narrow wins (1 TD or less) over 3 unranked teams
TEAM B: 12-1 ... loss was by 3 points on the road to the #1 team in America (sound familiar Alabama?), won every game by 2+ TDs except 2

Who made the title game? (scroll down if you haven't figured out this scenario yet)


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Team A, the 2006 Florida Gators, made the title game over Team B, the Michigan Wolverines. My point is, Michigan only lost to the #1 team in America by 3 points and didn't get a rematch ... why is Alabama a lock to do so? And yes, I know both OSU and Michigan got smoked in their bowl games, this is more of a selection question, and thought it would spark some interesting debate.
Dec 2, 2011 1:31pm
DeyDurkie5's avatar

DeyDurkie5

Senior Member

11,324 posts
Dec 2, 2011 1:48 PM
because of the nuthugging the sec gets. we've got big fast strong black men, so we automatically get in over any other conferance. It's racism more than anything.
Dec 2, 2011 1:48pm
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enigmaax

Senior Member

4,511 posts
Dec 2, 2011 2:44 PM
BigAppleBuckeye;997991 wrote:OK, humor me for a moment. I am hearing consistently that even if LSU loses the SEC title game, that they will play Alabama for the national championship. LSU boasts the best overall resume, and Alabama claims it deserves a shot after losing to the #1 team in America by 3 points. For the record, by way, I do think these two teams are the best in the country.

That being said, in another season, which of these teams should have made the title game?

TEAM A: 12-1 ... loss was to the #11 team in America on the road. Also had narrow wins (1 TD or less) over 3 unranked teams
TEAM B: 12-1 ... loss was by 3 points on the road to the #1 team in America (sound familiar Alabama?), won every game by 2+ TDs except 2

Who made the title game? (scroll down if you haven't figured out this scenario yet)
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Team A, the 2006 Florida Gators, made the title game over Team B, the Michigan Wolverines. My point is, Michigan only lost to the #1 team in America by 3 points and didn't get a rematch ... why is Alabama a lock to do so? And yes, I know both OSU and Michigan got smoked in their bowl games, this is more of a selection question, and thought it would spark some interesting debate.
How many ranked teams/winning teams did each beat? What was the overall record of oppenents beaten? There are a lot of other things to consider.

I say this all over the place, but comparing one loss doesn't mean anything because that only showed what your team couldn't do on one day. I'm more concerned with what your team could do over the course of the entire season.

For example, Michigan beat three teams with a winning record all season and less than half of their conference had a winning record overall. Also, while you were talking about unranked teams and close calls, Michigan beat Ball State by 8 points two weeks before losing to Ohio State.
Dec 2, 2011 2:44pm
sleeper's avatar

sleeper

Legend

27,879 posts
Dec 2, 2011 2:48 PM
This is an argument that SEC fans do not want to touch. If Alabama deserves a rematch, then so did Michigan.
Dec 2, 2011 2:48pm
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enigmaax

Senior Member

4,511 posts
Dec 2, 2011 2:59 PM
sleeper;998084 wrote:This is an argument that SEC fans do not want to touch. If Alabama deserves a rematch, then so did Michigan.
The two don't really have anything to do with each other.
Dec 2, 2011 2:59pm
ernest_t_bass's avatar

ernest_t_bass

12th Son of the Lama

24,984 posts
Dec 2, 2011 3:04 PM
enigmaax;998096 wrote:The two don't really have anything to do with each other.
How is that?
Dec 2, 2011 3:04pm
sleeper's avatar

sleeper

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27,879 posts
Dec 2, 2011 3:13 PM
enigmaax;998096 wrote:The two don't really have anything to do with each other.
They are the exact same thing. If anything Michigan had a better argument because at least they lost on the road.
Dec 2, 2011 3:13pm
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enigmaax

Senior Member

4,511 posts
Dec 2, 2011 3:15 PM
ernest_t_bass;998103 wrote:How is that?
Alabama isn't being compared to Michigan. Michigan was compared to Florida and Alabama is being compared to Oklahoma State or whoever.

Also, people get hung up on the "rematch", as though the only reason Michigan didn't make the title game was because people didn't want a rematch. And since that is the case, then no other team should ever deserve a rematch. Each year has to be judge based on the facts of that year, not random other years.

A similar thing happens when talking about awards. A player that has comparable or better stats than last year's Heisman winner or a winner from ten years ago doesn't automatically deserve this year's Heisman because you aren't considering the competition that player has in this year's Heisman race.
Dec 2, 2011 3:15pm
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enigmaax

Senior Member

4,511 posts
Dec 2, 2011 3:21 PM
sleeper;998109 wrote:They are the exact same thing. If anything Michigan had a better argument because at least they lost on the road.
If you were trying to pick between Michigan and Alabama in some fantasy match-up or something, maybe you'd have a point. What Michigan did or didn't do in 2006 has absolutely nothing to do with what Alabama has or will do in 2011. It's a pointless comparison.

If it is valid, then you would also have to think about useless points like, the Big XII champ always loses title games to the SEC, so their champ doens't deserve to be in the title game.
Dec 2, 2011 3:21pm
Scarlet_Buckeye's avatar

Scarlet_Buckeye

Senior Member

5,264 posts
Dec 2, 2011 3:45 PM
BigAppleBuckeye;997991 wrote:OK, humor me for a moment. I am hearing consistently that even if LSU loses the SEC title game, that they will play Alabama for the national championship. LSU boasts the best overall resume, and Alabama claims it deserves a shot after losing to the #1 team in America by 3 points. For the record, by way, I do think these two teams are the best in the country.

That being said, in another season, which of these teams should have made the title game?

TEAM A: 12-1 ... loss was to the #11 team in America on the road. Also had narrow wins (1 TD or less) over 3 unranked teams
TEAM B: 12-1 ... loss was by 3 points on the road to the #1 team in America (sound familiar Alabama?), won every game by 2+ TDs except 2

Who made the title game? (scroll down if you haven't figured out this scenario yet)


.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
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Team A, the 2006 Florida Gators, made the title game over Team B, the Michigan Wolverines. My point is, Michigan only lost to the #1 team in America by 3 points and didn't get a rematch ... why is Alabama a lock to do so? And yes, I know both OSU and Michigan got smoked in their bowl games, this is more of a selection question, and thought it would spark some interesting debate.

Because no one wanted to see OSU vs UM 4 weeks later. People are okay, however, with seeing LSU vs Alabama more than 8 weeks later.
Dec 2, 2011 3:45pm
C

cats gone wild

Senior Member

2,651 posts
Dec 2, 2011 3:50 PM
Its clearly obvious, without a doubt, that LSU and Bama are the top 2 teams. People werent for sure on Mich and their coach didnt try hard to push them in.
Dec 2, 2011 3:50pm
Heretic's avatar

Heretic

Son of the Sun

18,820 posts
Dec 2, 2011 3:52 PM
The real answer is simple.

Alabama's loss came early in the season and they won the rest of their games to get that #2 spot.

Michigan's came in their final game, giving them no opportunity to rebound and move back up.


It's not who you lose to, it's when you lose. And it's always better to have that loss earlier in the year than late in it.
Dec 2, 2011 3:52pm
C

cats gone wild

Senior Member

2,651 posts
Dec 2, 2011 3:54 PM
Heretic;998158 wrote:The real answer is simple.

Alabama's loss came early in the season and they won the rest of their games to get that #2 spot.

Michigan's came in their final game, giving them no opportunity to rebound and move back up.


It's not who you lose to, it's when you lose. And it's always better to have that loss earlier in the year than late in it.
truth, truth
Dec 2, 2011 3:54pm
Pick6's avatar

Pick6

A USA American

14,946 posts
Dec 2, 2011 3:59 PM
Heretic;998158 wrote:The real answer is simple.

Alabama's loss came early in the season and they won the rest of their games to get that #2 spot.

Michigan's came in their final game, giving them no opportunity to rebound and move back up.


It's not who you lose to, it's when you lose. And it's always better to have that loss earlier in the year than late in it.
Not necessarily. Many people are claiming LSU is a lock no matter the outcome of the Georgia game. #2 team loses to #1 team by 3 points (OSU/Michigan) and the #2 drops. In LSU's hypothetical case, if they lose to the #11 or 10 team, whatever Georgia is, they will stay in the top 2. Make's 0 sense.
Dec 2, 2011 3:59pm
sleeper's avatar

sleeper

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27,879 posts
Dec 2, 2011 4:02 PM
cats gone wild;998154 wrote:Its clearly obvious, without a doubt, that LSU and Bama are the top 2 teams. People werent for sure on Mich and their coach didnt try hard to push them in.
Houston, Oklahoma State say otherwise. It's not obvious, I don't think Alabama is a top 2 team so there is a doubt.
Dec 2, 2011 4:02pm
Scarlet_Buckeye's avatar

Scarlet_Buckeye

Senior Member

5,264 posts
Dec 2, 2011 4:02 PM
Heretic;998158 wrote:The real answer is simple.

Alabama's loss came early in the season and they won the rest of their games to get that #2 spot.

Michigan's came in their final game, giving them no opportunity to rebound and move back up.


It's not who you lose to, it's when you lose. And it's always better to have that loss earlier in the year than late in it.

Reps.

Not sure why people cannot understand/grasp this point. Teams are supposed to get better.
Dec 2, 2011 4:02pm
sleeper's avatar

sleeper

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27,879 posts
Dec 2, 2011 4:03 PM
The only way a rematch should be considered if there are no undefeated or other 1 loss teams. Alabama had their chance at a title, and they should only be given another chance if there are no teams tied or above them.

/thread
Dec 2, 2011 4:03pm
sleeper's avatar

sleeper

Legend

27,879 posts
Dec 2, 2011 4:03 PM
Scarlet_Buckeye;998172 wrote:Reps.

Not sure why people cannot understand/grasp this point. Teams are supposed to get better.
Fallacy. Teams also can get worse too.
Dec 2, 2011 4:03pm
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enigmaax

Senior Member

4,511 posts
Dec 2, 2011 4:21 PM
Heretic;998158 wrote:The real answer is simple.

Alabama's loss came early in the season and they won the rest of their games to get that #2 spot.

Michigan's came in their final game, giving them no opportunity to rebound and move back up.


It's not who you lose to, it's when you lose. And it's always better to have that loss earlier in the year than late in it.
Scarlet_Buckeye;998172 wrote:Not sure why people cannot understand/grasp this point. Teams are supposed to get better.
In 2000, Florida State lost after Washington. In 2001, Nebraska lost its last regular season game. In 2003, Oklahoma lost its conference championship game. Michigan didn't drop the week after they lost in 2006. In 2007, LSU lost its last regular season game (after Virginia Tech, Georgia, etc. had lost their second games). USC lost a couple weeks before Oklahoma and six weeks before Texas in 2008 and ended up behind them in the BCS standings (also lost two days before Florida who ended up in the title game). Oklahoma State is still in the running despite losing its last game two weeks ago.

The idea that when you lose is the overriding factor is a huge myth.
Dec 2, 2011 4:21pm
Heretic's avatar

Heretic

Son of the Sun

18,820 posts
Dec 2, 2011 4:51 PM
enigmaax;998194 wrote:In 2000, Florida State lost after Washington. In 2001, Nebraska lost its last regular season game. In 2003, Oklahoma lost its conference championship game. Michigan didn't drop the week after they lost in 2006. In 2007, LSU lost its last regular season game (after Virginia Tech, Georgia, etc. had lost their second games). USC lost a couple weeks before Oklahoma and six weeks before Texas in 2008 and ended up behind them in the BCS standings (also lost two days before Florida who ended up in the title game). Oklahoma State is still in the running despite losing its last game two weeks ago.

The idea that when you lose is the overriding factor is a huge myth.
If you're going to bust my myths, then I'm going to bust you up. How do you like that?

Dec 2, 2011 4:51pm
G

gport_tennis

Senior Member

1,796 posts
Dec 2, 2011 4:56 PM
Who has the better wins between Oklahoma state and Alabama. I thought I seen ok state had 5 wins over top 25 and bam had 2. I care more about who you beat than who beats you. If that's true then ok state should go above bama assuming they win out
Dec 2, 2011 4:56pm
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enigmaax

Senior Member

4,511 posts
Dec 2, 2011 5:01 PM
Heretic;998240 wrote:If you're going to bust my myths, then I'm going to bust you up. How do you like that?
I'm an internet pussy, so I'm just going to tattle on you. Hey, you're a mod, right? Could you ban yourself for threatening me, but don't tell yourself that I'm the one who told you about it.
Dec 2, 2011 5:01pm
C

cats gone wild

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2,651 posts
Dec 2, 2011 5:05 PM
Dont talk back to snoop dog.
Dec 2, 2011 5:05pm
darbypitcher22's avatar

darbypitcher22

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8,000 posts
Dec 2, 2011 5:15 PM
A lot of people want to see the rematch, but I'd like to see Oklahoma State's skill people against LSU's defense. Could be a fun matchup
Dec 2, 2011 5:15pm
Little Danny's avatar

Little Danny

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4,288 posts
Dec 2, 2011 5:33 PM
darbypitcher22;998278 wrote:A lot of people want to see the rematch, but I'd like to see Oklahoma State's skill people against LSU's defense. Could be a fun matchup
+1.

Justin Blackmon is a beast. Will LSU's shutdown corner be able to stop their passing attack?
Dec 2, 2011 5:33pm