Red Rum;992008 wrote:Kenton can probably throw on just about everybody. The Hillsdale & Smithville games were played in mud, which hurt all aspects of the passing game immensely. Saturday will be on turf.

That "mud" wasn't nearly as bad as everyone thought it would be. Runners and linemen were cutting and digging in just fine on both sides of the ball. Very little slipping.

However, I'll still maintain that Norwayne is probably a better all-around team than Smithville. Smithville's forte just happened to play toward Norwayne's biggest weaknesses. It was a key fitting a lock.

thePITman;992327 wrote:A co-worker is a Norwayne fan and having someone get tickets for him on Wednesday. If we can know by Wednesday, I can have him get our tickets, then pay him back, and everyone can pay me back.

I'm game.

O-Trap;992399 wrote:That "mud" wasn't nearly as bad as everyone thought it would be.

Who's everyone?

I realize you're a Smithville homer and badly want to think the playing surface didn't influence that game, I was also there and I think it did.

The playing surface effected Smithville more than Norwayne. They were the ones pulling guards and tackles all night, while running a mis-direction based offense. Norwayne did just fine throwing the ball, Smithville's defense did better. Believe it or not, Smithville had some damn good athletes too. The ones down the road 5 miles in Creston are not out of the world compared to others in the area.

It is all irrelevent now, because this game is on turf.

Mr. Russell;992475 wrote:The playing surface effected Smithville more than Norwayne.

I disagree 100%

Mr. Russell;992475 wrote: Norwayne did just fine throwing the ball

I didn't think you could make a more foolish statement than the one above, but congrats!! You did it.

Mr. Russell;992475 wrote: Believe it or not, Smithville had some damn good athletes too.

I agree, I never said they didn't.
It seems you're a little sensitive.

Mr. Russell;992475 wrote:It is all irrelevent now, because this game is on turf.

Yep, and I'm glad you repeated it back to me:laugh:



Everyone-
Sorry I got off topic. It won't happen again (on this thread)



OTrap & Mr Russell-
You guys want to argue about all this? fine with me. Take it over to the WCAL thread.
I'll give you the non-homer truth all day long.

Mr. Russell;992475 wrote:The playing surface effected Smithville more than Norwayne. They were the ones pulling guards and tackles all night, while running a mis-direction based offense. Norwayne did just fine throwing the ball, Smithville's defense did better. Believe it or not, Smithville had some damn good athletes too. The ones down the road 5 miles in Creston are not out of the world compared to others in the area.

It is all irrelevent now, because this game is on turf.

i attended the smithville-norwayne game and the field was not 100% but it was not nearly as bad as people are saying. It wasnt that bad where norwayne could not do what they are use to. I remember a few dropped passes and some big sacks which was the difference maker IMO. Smithville was the real deal this year when they wanted to be and i would take them over just about every team norwayne has played in the playoffs besides maybe girard.

I don't think Adam struggled throwing the ball Red Rum. Watch the game film again. That I have seen 5 times.

11/17 passing is pretty good, I'd say. Granted, you'd expect him to throw more often, but they didn't run that many plays on the whole game, which was, of course, a result of a game plan to keep them off the field. They didn't stop the run well, but I'd bet that had more to do with the bigger, stronger line across from them. They had a few lapses in discipline with some crucial, yet unnecessary, penalties that lengthened Smithville's drives or hurt their own. Late in the game, Norwayne's lone opportunity in the second half ended when a Smithie put a helmet on the ball and forced a fumble, much like what happened late in the Girard game.

... or it was a fluke resulting from a field that was wet, but as firm as a dry field (I was on it at the end of the game, and the parking field was worse than the playing field).

When your line is significantly larger and stronger, and your team is more disciplined, you can beat teams that are better than you, and it's not a fluke. It's leveraging your strengths against the opponent's weaknesses.

And that, my friend, is the unadulterated truth. Homer status be darned, as fans across the spectrum of Wayne County teams agreed after the game, that game was won by the team with the right gameplan, the stronger line, and the most discipline. Same thing that later carried Norwayne over Orrville (who, in my opinion, had the better skill athletes overall).

I've been laying low and reading and it appears that not much has changed. Smithville fans are still living under the illusion that they are as good as Norwayne. You got lucky and caught Norwayne on a very off night on an extremely crappy football field. The video didnt help them either. Obviously Mr Russell has a kid on the team and Otrap bleeds green all the way. As has been pointed out on here on several occasions, thedemoralizer and Red Rider Nation hate Norwyne. Why dont all of you guys make your move to another thread and talk to each other. This thread was posted to celebrate Norwayne and Kenton. IMO if you dont have anything positive to say...move on.

oldwildcat I appreciate your confidence but Norwayne has scored as many points as you have this year and it wasnt by accident (59 in last weeks blowout). There is no way you are going to blow them out like that. Again, that's my opinion. Good luck to Norwayne

My opinion of the Norwayne loss at Smithville has more to do with the coaching match up than the field conditions. The Godfather saw an opportunity to take advantage of a couple of factors, worked his gameplan around those, and won. The young Norwayne staff didn't see that coming, lesson learned. Coaching for several decades will give you an advantage over a young staff. Schrock knew what he needed to do, prepared his kids to do it, and they played up to his expectations. Blaming the loss on anything else is fooling yourself. Would Norwayne win 9 times if they played 10 games a year? Maybe but probably not, a wiley old coach like Schrock would know how to win more than just one game.

footballnut;992757 wrote:Smithville fans are still living under the illusion that they are as good as Norwayne.

You apparently haven't been paying attention. I've been saying the whole time that Smithville is not as good as Norwayne, but that their forte plays to Norwayne's Achilles heel, enabling them to play with Norwayne.

However, I suppose my carefully chosen words are only worthwhile if someone is willing to listen. Of the three co-champs, I'd say Smithville overachieved the most, and was probably 3rd out of the 3. However, to suggest that an eventual 8-2 team and playoff qualifier winning over a 9-1 team and playoff qualifier (who is still playing) is a fluke, ESPECIALLY having seen the game, is silly.

I'd honestly say the same if it had been the other way around, as well. I'm not so unrealistic as to suggest that Smithville was the best team in the WCAL, and I haven't been this whole year. Not sure why my one view that Smithville won the game because of better gameplanning, line physicality, and clock management makes me a green-spectacled homer.

Also, I'm not sure why you're so dead-set on taking pot shots before telling people to carry this elsewhere, but in the spirit of not ruining another good thread with just such an argument, I'll move the comments on this elsewhere.

After seeing the Smithies play both Norwayne and Hillsdale, I would say the Smithies were the #2 team behind Norwayne. I truly think Norwayne would prevail on turf (but it is high school in Ohio and the game is supposed to be played in all conditions). That being said, the field, the coaching, the moon and the stars were all in the Smithies favor that night. That night, in those conditions, with that game plan the Smithies were the better team. However, in the Hillsdale game Smithville was flagged with several questionable calls that really seemed to take away their momentum and the game kind of snowballed out of control. If there was a do over, I think the Smithies would have a much better chance of beating Hillsdale than Norwayne.

O-Trap;992793 wrote:You apparently haven't been paying attention. I've been saying the whole time that Smithville is not as good as Norwayne, but that their forte plays to Norwayne's Achilles heel, enabling them to play with Norwayne.

However, I suppose my carefully chosen words are only worthwhile if someone is willing to listen. Of the three co-champs, I'd say Smithville overachieved the most, and was probably 3rd out of the 3. However, to suggest that an eventual 8-2 team and playoff qualifier winning over a 9-1 team and playoff qualifier (who is still playing) is a fluke, ESPECIALLY having seen the game, is silly.

I'd honestly say the same if it had been the other way around, as well. I'm not so unrealistic as to suggest that Smithville was the best team in the WCAL, and I haven't been this whole year. Not sure why my one view that Smithville won the game because of better gameplanning, line physicality, and clock management makes me a green-spectacled homer.

Also, I'm not sure why you're so dead-set on taking pot shots before telling people to carry this elsewhere, but in the spirit of not ruining another good thread with just such an argument, I'll move the comments on this elsewhere.

Smithville won 19-14. Fact.
Smithville lost in the 1st round of the playoffs in DV. Fact.
Norwayne is in the State Championship game in DIV. Fact.

That's True and that's all that really matters

thePITman;992886 wrote:Smithville won 19-14. Fact.

Norwayne is in the State Championship game in DIV. Fact.
Smithville lost in the 1st round of the playoffs in DV. Fact.

footballnut;992757 wrote:I've been laying low and reading and it appears that not much has changed. Smithville fans are still living under the illusion that they are as good as Norwayne. You got lucky and caught Norwayne on a very off night on an extremely crappy football field. The video didnt help them either. Obviously Mr Russell has a kid on the team and Otrap bleeds green all the way. As has been pointed out on here on several occasions, thedemoralizer and Red Rider Nation hate Norwyne. Why dont all of you guys make your move to another thread and talk to each other. This thread was posted to celebrate Norwayne and Kenton. IMO if you dont have anything positive to say...move on.

oldwildcat I appreciate your confidence but Norwayne has scored as many points as you have this year and it wasnt by accident (59 in last weeks blowout). There is no way you are going to blow them out like that. Again, that's my opinion. Good luck to Norwayne

Dang I'm starting to like you. That's not good.

Mr Russell-

First off, Smithville won the game, nobody is trying to take that away from them, definitely not me. Go back and check.

Football is a game played in many different weather conditions (as you know). The Smithies were fired up that night and they defeated Norwayne.

after that, our views differ

The field was muddy and this heavily played into the hands of a power running team and the conditions were poor for a team that passes alot. It effected the QB but the real problem was footing for receivers which threw off the timing of those bread & butter pass routes that Norwayne exploited Brookfield & Orrville with time after time.

I saw Smithville play 4 times this year. In every game I watched, the Smithie DBs bit on play action, played way off the ball, and often let the receivers get behind them. They were the biggest single weakness on a fine Smithville team. I realize you don't agree with this but take off the emerald glasses for a moment and look again.

I think the league overall was down this year. The "Up" teams (SMV,NOR,HILL) didn't get the competition they usually do in league play. This hurt Hillsdale and Smithville the most. In Smithvilles case, their defensive backfield was not ready for prime time when it was needed. I'm not sure what the cause of this was as they had fine athletes back there. Maybe the line was so dominant they didn't get tested enough, I don't know. What I do know is a 3 win Husky team should not be passing all over playoff participant Smithville.

If the field conditions would have been the same at Wynford as they were for the Norwayne game the outcome may have been different. The dry field really let Wynford expose the Smithie defensive backfield with that big play receiver. just my opinion.

In closing, I want to tell you again...Smithville has a fine team with excellent athletes and they were better than Norwayne on that night.
Your insinuation that the playing conditions that night favored Norwayne and hurt Smithville is simply "nuts". That is my major point of contention.

OTrap-

Parking conditions were worse than the playing field?

if that's the unadulterated truth, you belong in politics.




That's my take.

Let it fly

I was never any good with politics. I tick too many people off.

I walked on the field after the game. Stood near the center of the field for quite a bit. I know what the field was like.

I also had the misfortune of walking to my car through the Jr. High practice field, which doesn't have near the drainage that the field does. It was okay, sans a few mud puddles and shoe traps (shoe actually came off once). Not lovely by any stretch, but we're not talking a quagmire either, except for the few spots.

The field had the consistency of natural clay (before it dries). Not the same as turf, to be sure, so I'm not saying it was the same. But again, the offense was not on the field much anyway. Not sure that would have changed much on any surface.

Merely out of curiosity, I'd like to know how Norwayne's points-per-possession in that game compared to, say, Girard. Granted, they scored more points against Girard, but they also had more possessions.

I don't know how to find a drive summary for the games, but I might be willing to bet that it wasn't that much different between Girard and Smithville. They just didn't have the ball much against Smithville.

You guys need some unadulterated truth & facts......

I just so happen to have a few....

1. Smithville was far to one dimensional to make it beyond week 11.

2. They still were a "hell of a team" and will be remembered as such

3. Red Rum is a troll and will be remembered as such

4. Otrap & Mr Russell are giant Smithville Homers and thus incapable of giving a real review of a Smithie game.

5. A tailgate WITHOUT ALCOHOL is not a tailgate. It's a romper room gathering.

6. Pitmans girlfriends van has a chattering in the left front wheel area.



Question.........Who is stupid enough to steal a Minivan?

Answer......Miyagi

6 weeks ago = irrelevant



Hope this helps!

Lets just say this....Norwayne is playing fantastic football right NOW......they had some miscues in the Smithville game -dropped TD pass- Wallace fumble on final drive, correct Miyagi if he is wrong but didnt he lose his footing on that play and fumble, not because of a hit ? And coaches did not make any adjustments at halftime, don't think they were prepared because this was the first time they had to deal with a close game..............but if Norwayne plays like they did last Fri against the Johnnys it doesn't matter what kind of field they are playing on, they beat Smithville.they are just playing that good of ball right now

You guys want some unadulterated truth & facts......

Here ya go.....

1. Smithville beat Norwayne 19-14.

2. The field was muddy

3. Smithville was far to one dimensional to advance beyond week 11.

4. They still were "a hell of a team" and will be remembered as such.

5. Red Rum is a troll and will be remembered as such.

6. O-Trap & Mr. Russell are giant Smithville homers and thus can't give unbiased reviews on Smithie games.

7. A tailgate WITHOUT ALCOHOL is not a tailgate. It's a romper room convention.

8. Red Rider Nation will change his name to.......foot in mouth.

9. Miyagi will change his name to.......infractions tab at capacity.

Mr Miyagi;993025 wrote:Lets just say this....Norwayne is playing fantastic football right NOW......they had some miscues in the Smithville game -dropped TD pass- Wallace fumble on final drive, correct Miyagi if he is wrong but didnt he lose his footing on that play and fumble, not because of a hit ? And coaches did not make any adjustments at halftime, don't think they were prepared because this was the first time they had to deal with a close game..............but if Norwayne plays like they did last Fri against the Johnnys it doesn't matter what kind of field they are playing on, they beat Smithville.they are just playing that good of ball right now

You may be correct on the fumble. I defer to someone who has watched replays of the game.

I'm curious what I've said that makes me such a homer. That Smithville was NOT the best team in the league this year? That their one-dimensional offense killed them in the playoffs (hard to come back when each drive takes so much time)? Is it that I've gushed more about Norwayne that I have about Smithville this year (because they are the better team)? Is it based on the notion that I've said this year's top WCAL teams (Smithville included as well as Hillsdale) could compete with Orrville? Heck, I've even said Hillsdale would have matched up better against Wynford than the Smithie did.

With all that in mind, does the single opinion that it's not a fluke when a less talented team with the right skill set beats a more talented team make me a homer, simply because the team I cheer for was the winner of that scenario?

Miyagi thinks it may be all the "Emerald City " comments you have made in the past LOL:laugh:

Truth be told, you are a Smithville homer. You played there, you brag about The Godfather, you is a homer.

Mr Miyagi;993068 wrote:Miyagi thinks it may be all the "Emerald City " comments you have made in the past LOL:laugh:

It's been called that for decades by fans, though. Honestly, I picked that up when I was younger from fans who just referred to it that way.

I can't imagine it would be any different than anyone who uses an endearing nickname for a.city, field, or team. At least it wasn't intended to be any different.