Duke @ Ohio State

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reclegend22's avatar

reclegend22

Cool Hand Luke

8,772 posts
Nov 28, 2011 5:02 PM
As for Aaron Craft, he is a very good defender, but he's nowhere near the best anyone has ever seen at this level -- especially if you group in swing players. At Duke alone, Shane Battier, Grant Hill and Billy King were far superior in their positioning and instincts -- and Battier was a three-time national defender of the year. As for pure guards, there have been a multitude of incredibly gifted defenders over the years. Off the top of my head, I can think of Michael Flowers, Chris Paul, Chris Duhon, Aaron Miles, Juan Dixon, Steve Blake, Pepe Sanchez, Jacque Vaughn, Earl Boykins, Stacey Augmon, Gary Payton, Mookie Blaylock, among many others.
Nov 28, 2011 5:02pm
Laley23's avatar

Laley23

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Nov 28, 2011 7:11 PM
reclegend22;991720 wrote:As for Aaron Craft, he is a very good defender, but he's nowhere near the best anyone has ever seen at this level -- especially if you group in swing players. At Duke alone, Shane Battier, Grant Hill and Billy King were far superior in their positioning and instincts -- and Battier was a three-time national defender of the year. As for pure guards, there have been a multitude of incredibly gifted defenders over the years. Off the top of my head, I can think of Michael Flowers, Chris Paul, Chris Duhon, Aaron Miles, Juan Dixon, Steve Blake, Pepe Sanchez, Jacque Vaughn, Earl Boykins, Stacey Augmon, Gary Payton, Mookie Blaylock, among many others.
Battier is the best Ive seen. Hell, he is still doing it in the NBA.

The top 5 defenders Ive seen in college ball (not big men):
1. Battier
2. Payton (not while at Oregon St. But I have seen footage, full games, etc on rerun)
3. Artest
4. Jason Hart
5. Dane Fife (homer pick, but at the same time he was awesome)/Charlie Bell

Craft could easily crack this list by the end of year 4.
Nov 28, 2011 7:11pm
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DeyDurkie5

Senior Member

11,324 posts
Nov 28, 2011 8:00 PM
ccrunner609;991925 wrote:Like rankings have anything to do with teams like OSU and Duke........if ranking meant anything UNLV shouldnt of even played UNC the other day.

BTW Duke is now a top 5 team so I guess under your premis OSU is now in alot of trouble.

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/rankings/_/year/2012/week/4/seasontype/2
basically what i was getting at was why are you predicting a dominate win for duke? You have no basis for that at all, besides being retarded(which you are) and being a homer(which you clearly are)
Nov 28, 2011 8:00pm
reclegend22's avatar

reclegend22

Cool Hand Luke

8,772 posts
Nov 28, 2011 8:04 PM
Laley23 wrote:5. Dane Fife (homer pick, but at the same time he was awesome)/Charlie Bell
I actually almost listed Dane Fife in that slew of names I mentioned (which, by the way, were just random names I thought of who were known as very good defenders in college. I obviously never saw Blaylock and Payton play live either, but based on ESPN classic and reputation they are known as two of the better defenders in the game's history). Fife was a really good defender at Indiana and did a very good job on limiting Jason Williams in that nightmare tournament game at Rupp in 2002. Williams, the national player of the year and arguably the most explosive scorer in college over the last 15 years, was just 2 of 8 from three and had just 12 points over the game's first 39 and a half minutes. Of course, that would-have-been four-point play after Fife's foul on Williams with four seconds left could have erased all of that and handed Fife a lifetime sentence as the Hoosierland's Scott Norwood, but such is life. Ugh.

That Indiana team is, imo, along with Duke of 2001, the best three-point shooting team I've ever seen. No one comes close.
Nov 28, 2011 8:04pm
reclegend22's avatar

reclegend22

Cool Hand Luke

8,772 posts
Nov 28, 2011 8:08 PM
By the way, I still fucking hate Tom Coverdale. That leprechaun bastard doesn't score a field goal the entire freaking night and then hits a Philip "Hot Sauce" Champion reverse scoop layup with under a minute to play to give Indiana the lead. Oh well.
Nov 28, 2011 8:08pm
Laley23's avatar

Laley23

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Nov 28, 2011 9:06 PM
reclegend22;992047 wrote:By the way, I still fucking hate Tom Coverdale. That leprechaun bastard doesn't score a field goal the entire freaking night and then hits a Philip "Hot Sauce" Champion reverse scoop layup with under a minute to play to give Indiana the lead. Oh well.
lol, its ok. Jared Odle was the bane of my dads and mine existence for 3 years. Dude was Michael Jordan in that game. Especially early in the second half.

I know you might not want to watch this, because it has Hoosier bias in the editing. But its a really cool video made like 8 years ago for this game. It does have Duke highlights as well. Todd Leary on color the last minute is hysterical. The AJ Moye block of Boozer, when he comes weakside from nowhere is, imo, the greatest play of the tournament. At least, the most under-appreciated.

[video=youtube;e5F_YIblAvw][/video]
Nov 28, 2011 9:06pm
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DeyDurkie5

Senior Member

11,324 posts
Nov 28, 2011 9:23 PM
ccrunner609;992072 wrote:Dominate win? read post #3 you fucking tard. 4 point win.......you are trying way to hard.
LOL
Nov 28, 2011 9:23pm
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Ironman92

Administrator

49,363 posts
Nov 28, 2011 9:40 PM
My two favorite teams.

You're a dumbass Ironman!

Hope this helps.

OSU 79
Duke 68
Nov 28, 2011 9:40pm
reclegend22's avatar

reclegend22

Cool Hand Luke

8,772 posts
Nov 28, 2011 9:48 PM
Laley23 wrote:lol, its ok. Jared Odle was the bane of my dads and mine existence for 3 years. Dude was Michael Jordan in that game. Especially early in the second half.

I know you might not want to watch this, because it has Hoosier bias in the editing. But its a really cool video made like 8 years ago for this game. It does have Duke highlights as well. Todd Leary on color the last minute is hysterical. The AJ Moye block of Boozer, when he comes weakside from nowhere is, imo, the greatest play of the tournament. At least, the most under-appreciated.
I've seen that video before, and I admit that it's done really well. I'm sure it's as chilling for IU fans as it is tormenting for me. The point in that video when I turned it off, however, is when the theme song for the movie Hoosiers started playing in the background. All I could think about his Ollie in a Tom Coverdale jersey.

Although I always turn it off right after Jason Williams makes that final three, I still watch that game from time to time just because of how electric the atmosphere was in Rupp that night, and because my favorite announcer of all-time, Dick Enberg, is at the call. What makes that loss hurt even more, however, is the fact that I was encircled in a sea of Hoosier red on the Hunnington Level at the Schott while watching the final 10 minutes of that game unravel for Duke. I was, of course, decked out in blue and they -- and my anti-Duke friends -- let me have it.
Nov 28, 2011 9:48pm
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Laley23

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Nov 28, 2011 10:29 PM
Dick Enberg. A Hoosier Grad of course!

Got to her him speak at a small (25 students) gathering at IU. He was amazing. Telling stories about he and Al McGuire, Wimbledon, Indiana, etc. Was scheduled for 1 hour and went on for 2.5. His voice is so soothing that the time flew by. Guy is hysterical!

After it was done, my roommate and I who is also a broadcaster went up to him. He talked to us for a good 20 minutes and gave lots of pointers and advice. I still use everything he told me (that I could remember) all the time. Most important, people are watching, play by play isnt really play by play, but more they want to here you say what they are all yelling in their heads. Followed closely by, and this is an exact quote, "if you say the number and then the name people know your full of shit and didnt know the player. Simple take the time to look at the roster and say only the name." Basically, pausing for 3 seconds to look seems like a long time to the broadcaster cause he is in a bit of a panic he wont find it. But to the listener, they dont even notice the lapse.
Nov 28, 2011 10:29pm
reclegend22's avatar

reclegend22

Cool Hand Luke

8,772 posts
Nov 28, 2011 11:17 PM
Laley23 wrote:**** Enberg. A Hoosier Grad of course!

Got to her him speak at a small (25 students) gathering at IU. He was amazing. Telling stories about he and Al McGuire, Wimbledon, Indiana, etc. Was scheduled for 1 hour and went on for 2.5. His voice is so soothing that the time flew by. Guy is hysterical!

After it was done, my roommate and I who is also a broadcaster went up to him. He talked to us for a good 20 minutes and gave lots of pointers and advice. I still use everything he told me (that I could remember) all the time. Most important, people are watching, play by play isnt really play by play, but more they want to here you say what they are all yelling in their heads. Followed closely by, and this is an exact quote, "if you say the number and then the name people know your full of **** and didnt know the player. Simple take the time to look at the roster and say only the name." Basically, pausing for 3 seconds to look seems like a long time to the broadcaster cause he is in a bit of a panic he wont find it. But to the listener, they dont even notice the lapse.
Lol at the quote. That is good stuff. That's awesome that you got to have such a candid conversation with Enberg, who's one of my heroes. I originally went to school for broadcasting -- and did some radio and online color for high school games with a friend of mine while in college -- but eventually switched over to the corporate communications side of journalism at BG. Enberg was a big reason I ever got interested in broadcasting. I know it's a time-worn cliche, but Enberg really did have golden pipes. I was deeply saddened when I heard he had decided to leave the game. He was the soul of the tournament.

And his voice was indeed soothing. He could spend an entire game reciting a list of victims of the Holocaust and it'd probably be one of the all-time great calls.
Nov 28, 2011 11:17pm
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darbypitcher22

Senior Member

8,000 posts
Nov 29, 2011 8:48 AM
Go Bucks. Beat Dook.

Dickie V is in the house!
Nov 29, 2011 8:48am
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swamisez

Senior Member

1,990 posts
Nov 29, 2011 8:54 AM
When Dickie V goes hard on talking about OSU basketball and Urban Meyer, remember this is the same guy you loathe for talking up Duke.
Nov 29, 2011 8:54am
se-alum's avatar

se-alum

The Biggest Boss

13,948 posts
Nov 29, 2011 9:16 AM
darbypitcher22;992414 wrote:Dickie V is in the house!
Which is why I'll be watching, but listening to the radio.
Nov 29, 2011 9:16am
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osu45804

Senior Member

6,188 posts
Nov 29, 2011 9:43 AM
Can't wait for this game... The Schott should be rockin'

I absolutely cannot stand Duke, So hopefully Sully, Buford, Craft & Co. get this win!
Nov 29, 2011 9:43am
B

birddog23

Senior Member

1,086 posts
Nov 29, 2011 10:07 AM
It'll be interesting to see how many Duke fans will be in attendance for tonights game in Cbus. I just looked and saw that I could make some serious cash if I sold my two tickets but how can you pass up an opportunity like this?
Nov 29, 2011 10:07am
Automatik's avatar

Automatik

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14,632 posts
Nov 29, 2011 10:10 AM
birddog23;992499 wrote:It'll be interesting to see how many Duke fans will be in attendance for tonights game in Cbus. I just looked and saw that I could make some serious cash if I sold my two tickets but how can you pass up an opportunity like this?
DO NOT SELL!
Nov 29, 2011 10:10am
sleeper's avatar

sleeper

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27,879 posts
Nov 29, 2011 10:13 AM
Is this game going to be on ABC or something?
Nov 29, 2011 10:13am
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Automatik

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Nov 29, 2011 10:14 AM
sleeper;992505 wrote:Is this game going to be on ABC or something?
ESPN
Nov 29, 2011 10:14am
B

birddog23

Senior Member

1,086 posts
Nov 29, 2011 10:20 AM
Automatik;992503 wrote:DO NOT SELL!
Oh, no way I sell. Look for two guys about 10 rows behind OSU's bench in Duke blue.
Nov 29, 2011 10:20am
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hangonsloopy

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1,291 posts
Nov 29, 2011 10:21 AM
se-alum;992448 wrote:Which is why I'll be watching, but listening to the radio.

This.
Nov 29, 2011 10:21am
C

centralbucksfan

Senior Member

5,111 posts
Nov 29, 2011 11:21 AM
Laley23;991926 wrote:Battier is the best Ive seen. Hell, he is still doing it in the NBA.

The top 5 defenders Ive seen in college ball (not big men):
1. Battier
2. Payton (not while at Oregon St. But I have seen footage, full games, etc on rerun)
3. Artest
4. Jason Hart
5. Dane Fife (homer pick, but at the same time he was awesome)/Charlie Bell

Craft could easily crack this list by the end of year 4.
Wow, Fife is a homer pick. I watched him play, don't think he is anywhere near Craft to be honest. Similar, but I'd take Craft defensively over Fife. The others you listed, certainly. But they also had a HUGE size advantage as well.(don't know about Hart).
As far as an on the ball defender, which Craft basically is, he would be right near the top of my list having watched college ball for 30+years. And I am not sure I have seen a kid get his hands on loose balls or his ability to strip the ball as I have with Craft. As Donovan said, Craft is a difference maker defensively. You don't hear that too often.
Nov 29, 2011 11:21am
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sleeper

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Nov 29, 2011 11:46 AM
Automatik;992507 wrote:ESPN
Thanks.
Nov 29, 2011 11:46am
Laley23's avatar

Laley23

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Nov 29, 2011 12:25 PM
centralbucksfan;992649 wrote:Wow, Fife is a homer pick. I watched him play, don't think he is anywhere near Craft to be honest. Similar, but I'd take Craft defensively over Fife. The others you listed, certainly. But they also had a HUGE size advantage as well.(don't know about Hart).
As far as an on the ball defender, which Craft basically is, he would be right near the top of my list having watched college ball for 30+years. And I am not sure I have seen a kid get his hands on loose balls or his ability to strip the ball as I have with Craft. As Donovan said, Craft is a difference maker defensively. You don't hear that too often.
Hey, I admitted Fife is a homer pick! I agree Craft is better, but Ive only seen Craft for a year. I wouldnt be shocked if he ended up in my top 3 (ahead of Ron Artest). Fife was pretty fucking good though, not top 5 like I have him, but very good. Indianas all time steals leader, and I think the stat I read like 4 years ago was that 68% of those steals were on ball steals (ie, not playing the passing lane). Thats pretty remarkable. Fife struggled a bit his FR and SO year, as he was too concerned with learning Knights motion offense. But once he figured it out, he was lock-down. B1G DPOY his SR year and I think maybe JR year as well. As Rec said, shut down Jason Williams in the S16, Held Hollis Price of Oklahoma to 1/11 shooting and 6 pts in F4. Juan Dixon is really the only guy he didnt shut down during that run, and with Coverdales ankle being hurt, Fife actually spent a lot of the game on Blake, who did only score 6.

Jason Hart was a tremendous defender for Syracuse in the late 90s. I think still their all time steals leader. He was lock-down. Gary Payton style but not as good.
Nov 29, 2011 12:25pm
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namod65

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508 posts
Nov 29, 2011 12:58 PM
birddog23;992519 wrote:Oh, no way I sell. Look for two guys about 10 rows behind OSU's bench in Duke blue.
You're sitting in the student section?
Nov 29, 2011 12:58pm