dlazz;738590 wrote:This argument is crap. Europeans don't drive half as much as we do.

And who's fault is that? I don't fill my car up but once every 2 weeks.

Don't drive as much then.

You people don't live in reality. There are millions and millions of Americans who live paycheck to paycheck, can't afford to "don't drive", can't afford to up and move "closer to work", can't afford to buy a "new car". Wow, I've never seen such a sympathetic group of people. I love all the answers. Don't drive, buy a new car, move, etc. etc. etc. Fucking wow.

Oh, let's coddle those who live paycheck to paycheck then?

I am not out making hundreds of thousands of dollars. I am not the one who put themselves in a position to work "paycheck to paycheck." I understand that some others don't put themselves in that position, but I would venture to say MOST do. I bet I could also look at what those people who are living "paycheck to paycheck" are spending their paychecks on too: cigarettes, alcohol, name brand foods and clothes, tattoos, music, video games, etc. Cut some costs, I bet their "paycheck to paycheck" life wouldn't be as bad.

I am up for lowering gas prices, I'd love it. I'd also love better public transportation...but you don't see that happening anytime soon do you? Better get used to high gas prices, unless we want to start another Civil/Revolutionary War over something like this, nothing is going to change anytime soon.

OSH;738597 wrote:And who's fault is that? I don't fill my car up but once every 2 weeks.

Don't drive as much then.

It's nobody's fault, they just have smaller countries. They don't HAVE to drive 60 miles to work.

dlazz;738608 wrote:It's nobody's fault, they just have smaller countries. They don't HAVE to drive 60 miles to work.

Most people don't "HAVE" to do anything. Yes, there are some extenuating circumstances that require people to be stuck somewhere...but there's usually other options. Another reason why people move here, we have luxuries and freedoms that aren't offered in other countries. Like being able to choose the career paths we take.

majorspark;738589 wrote:Damn you? That is why I ask. If gas goes to $5 you will have to make some changes. You may not like what changes you will need to make. You will get by and I am sure end up quite successful at some point.

Yeah but 'getting by' sucks. My situation now is, at times, shitty. So it's going to really suck once I have to make additional changes in order to adapt. Ramen noodles and Easy Mac for dinner most nights, here I come haha

OSH;738606 wrote:Oh, let's coddle those who live paycheck to paycheck then?

I am not out making hundreds of thousands of dollars. I am not the one who put themselves in a position to work "paycheck to paycheck." I understand that some others don't put themselves in that position, but I would venture to say MOST do. I bet I could also look at what those people who are living "paycheck to paycheck" are spending their paychecks on too: cigarettes, alcohol, name brand foods and clothes, tattoos, music, video games, etc. Cut some costs, I bet their "paycheck to paycheck" life wouldn't be as bad.

I am up for lowering gas prices, I'd love it. I'd also love better public transportation...but you don't see that happening anytime soon do you? Better get used to high gas prices, unless we want to start another Civil/Revolutionary War over something like this, nothing is going to change anytime soon.

You talking about P2P people spending their money on alcohol and cigs reminds me of something from last night. I was at the grocery and no lie, some guy was trying to sell his food stamps for cash so he could use them for alcohol. Mind you he had a kid with him. When he asked me, I just looked down and shook my head. This is the first time I had ever seen it for my own eyes, but have heard others talk about it. Some people are just plain sorry and unbelievable.

tk421;738602 wrote:You people don't live in reality. There are millions and millions of Americans who live paycheck to paycheck, can't afford to "don't drive", can't afford to up and move "closer to work", can't afford to buy a "new car". Wow, I've never seen such a sympathetic group of people. I love all the answers. Don't drive, buy a new car, move, etc. etc. etc. Fucking wow.

What do you propose be done? Have the government subsidize gas prices? Price controls? Tax the shit out of big oil? They will be more than happy to do that. Go to war with OPEC? Cut the onerous regulation of the oil and gasoline industry? Cut the gas tax?I doubt you are going to see less intervention by government in the free market so unless you want more? What are you going to do? The free market does not have a big heart. Its survival and profit. Most of the time and in the long run it benefits the masses. But there can be spikes and periods of time than forced financial adjustments will have to be made in order to survive

Its not being unsympathetic. I wish the price of gas was going down. Right now the market is driving it up. That is reality. Without intervention from government you will be forced to adjust to that reality whether you like it or not. The market will eventually come around. The financially weak will learn some lessons and we will come out better in the end. Don't expect the bailout package like all those too big to fail companies got a few years back.

I live paycheck to paycheck but I also work full time and got to school full time. This gas situation is killing me because in between my house, job, and school, it is about at least 100 bucks in gas a week. I can't afford to move, I can't afford an new car, I am not going to change schools because I am graduating soon, I am not going to change jobs because I can advance in the one I am at with a degree. Right now I am just holding my breath because if gas gets to $5 something has to change and it will not be good for me.

majorspark;738628 wrote:What do you propose be done? Have the government subsidize gas prices? Price controls? Tax the shit out of big oil? They will be more than happy to do that. Go to war with OPEC? Cut the onerous regulation of the oil and gasoline industry? Cut the gas tax?I doubt you are going to see less intervention by government in the free market so unless you want more? What are you going to do? The free market does not have a big heart. Its survival and profit. Most of the time and in the long run it benefits the masses. But there can be spikes and periods of time than forced financial adjustments will have to be made in order to survive

Its not being unsympathetic. I wish the price of gas was going down. Right now the market is driving it up. That is reality. Without intervention from government you will be forced to adjust to that reality whether you like it or not. The market will eventually come around. The financially weak will learn some lessons and we will come out better in the end. Don't expect the bailout package like all those too big to fail companies got a few years back.

Exactly. There isn't a good way for the govt to interevene and do anything about this. People can cry all they like, but the only solutions are personal.

Yes, because people bitching about paying $1-2 more for gas have the free income to just up and fucking move. Posts like this piss me off. If I can't afford to buy $5 gas, how the fuck am I going to buy a new car or move to a new house?

I'm sorry to piss you off, but every person who didn't have their head in the sand knew this has been coming for the past 20 years....plenty of time to buy a house close to your place of employment or a fuel efficient vehicle. I don't really mean to piss you off, I was just trying to point out things that can be done now and IN THE FUTURE (when feasible). Be aware of things that waste gas...like underinflated tires and warming your car up on a cold winter morning.... running out to the store for single items.... driving a couple of blocks when you could walk. We and our parents really are to blame for doing nothing to decrease our dependence on oil...the writing has been on the wall since the Arab oil embargo. Our political leadership has failed us over and over.
Hindsight is 20/20...but in reality all it would have took is a little courage. We should have slapped a dollar a gallon tax on gasoline back in the 80's to fund Social Security instead of raising the payroll tax to a high level. We should have passed laws to forbid utilities from burning oil to make electricity. American car companies are a 5 years behind Japan in Hybrid vehicles.
Face it...we were stupid and greedy, and now we are paying for our shortsightedness.


I understand that for many people it's hard to move and they can't afford to buy a new vehicle...but at the very least, we've had two years to anticipate this. Nothing in the market has changed that would have suggested that this wouldn't happen again the next time the market got 'tight'. China is still sucking it up, speculators are still at work. Cheap sources of oil are not available to replace supply line constrictions.
Let me say it again...The era of cheap oil is OVER. It's been OVER.

Gas prices kill the business I operate. I am responsible for The company bottom line. Our cost to operate and The customer cost to get to our business is going to be a tough, tough element to battle.

Maybe my employer will make a job change for me.

We could significantly drive down the price of oil/gas by making those wishing to speculate in gas/oil take possession at the end of the month the way it was until the early 90's when Goldman got the law changed.

It used to be that you had to have a commercial interest (airlines, plastics, ag....people who actually use the stuff) to speculate in oil. Once the investment banks were allowed in though it all went to hell as they just roll their positions over while never actually taking possession of a single barrel. That is how you get something like 6-10 times the amount of barrels of oil that exist in the world traded on a daily basis.

Also, it would help to siginificantly increase margin requirements for those wishing to speculate, as they are a fraction for commodities of what they are for equities. It is too cheap to speculate in oil right now, and only encourages hedge funds and Wallstreet to make bigger bets because it is easier to lever up. If they had to put down half up front (as you have to do with stocks) we would see far less activity in that market by people who have no vested commercial interest in being there (I.E legitimate hedgers).

The gas/oil price problem begins and ends with our governments subservience to the financial services industry in that they will never take the steps to reign them in as is needed to get that market back under control.

Supply and Demand have little to nothing to do with the price of a given commodity anymore, and as long as things like oil/gas/corn and other essentials are allowed to be asset classes at the mercy of an irrational market instead of priced based on supply demand fundamentals we are going to see these wild volatile swings in prices.

tk421;738602 wrote:You people don't live in reality. There are millions and millions of Americans who live paycheck to paycheck, can't afford to "don't drive", can't afford to up and move "closer to work", can't afford to buy a "new car". Wow, I've never seen such a sympathetic group of people. I love all the answers. Don't drive, buy a new car, move, etc. etc. etc. Fucking wow.

Who's fault is it that they live paycheck to paycheck?

closer26;738162 wrote:iknow i don't post much, but sleeper your being pretty dumb here. No one claimed it should be free, but clearly the major companies can still make quite a profit at $3.50 a gallon as opposed to $4.00 a gallon like it is nearing now , and you can't really argue that. It's just a frustating situation and I think everyone has the right to want to vent. But I rest my case, whoever contradicts you obviously needs to get a life or a job, because obviously no one on here has either of those things.

That's not how free enterprise works. Which is defended like no other by the people who I usually hear bitching about gas prices and oil companies.

I'm not like sleeper since I think people are entitled to bitch if they want but "they can still make a profit at xxx price" is a terrible argument.

dlazz;738608 wrote:It's nobody's fault, they just have smaller countries. They don't HAVE to drive 60 miles to work.

Neither do we, but we decided to say "fuck public transportation and fuck living in cities, everyone can live spread out in suburban communities" so now we all drive way too much and finally we're starting to not be able to afford it.

charliehustle14;738438 wrote:
3) I really wish all of the citizens would collectively say 'fuck this shit' and do something about it. No one buy gas on a particular day. Or just blockade every gas station on a particular day. The reason the prices always find their way back up is because the oil companies know we're so embedded to our 'slave to the grind' lives that we won't do shit about it. If gas is $5 and I need gas to get to my shitty 9-5 job or else my family and myself might not be able to eat, then god damn we'll bend over, spread our ass cheeks, and pay the $5.

I always laugh at the "let's all not buy gas on a particular day, that'll show the oil companies, they lose so much money". Wrong! It'll hurt the independent owners of gas stations. The gas has already been purchased. The oil companies have made their money on the gas people wouldn't be buying. And as someone pointed out, people would just buy twice as much the next day.

It's funny how little people understand about economics. Bitch all you want, the American demand for gas has caused the price to go up.

tk421;738602 wrote:You people don't live in reality. There are millions and millions of Americans who live paycheck to paycheck, can't afford to "don't drive", can't afford to up and move "closer to work", can't afford to buy a "new car". Wow, I've never seen such a sympathetic group of people. I love all the answers. Don't drive, buy a new car, move, etc. etc. etc. Fucking wow.

Not my fault someone lives paycheck to paycheck and hasn't figured out how to save money. There is hundreds of ways to cut costs on small budgets, people just choose not to. They'd rather bitch and complain instead of do something about the problem. Laziness IMO.

charliehustle14;738624 wrote:Yeah but 'getting by' sucks. My situation now is, at times, shitty. So it's going to really suck once I have to make additional changes in order to adapt. Ramen noodles and Easy Mac for dinner most nights, here I come haha

Did it for 12 months. You do what you have to. Sure we'd all love to live the good life, but in lean times, those who deserve most to live the good life understand how to make due.

sleeper;738793 wrote:Who's fault is it that they live paycheck to paycheck?

This isn't always a fault issue. I lost my job, and though I got off unemployment as quickly as possible, my wife and I were still living paycheck to paycheck.

But guess what? That's life sometimes. It's not fun, and it's really stressful, but you do what you have to do to get by. If it means cutting your own hair and eating Mac n Cheese for dinner most nights, that's what you do.

We all want to be able to provide a quality life. However, not one of us is owed that life.

So, if gas becomes $5 a gallon, and you complain, I don't blame you, because it sucks. However, you'd better not have cable. You'd better not have a gas-guzzler. You'd better not eat out. You'd better not have a lot of friends over. You'd better not be buying alcohol or tobacco. You'd better be looking for other forms of income.

If you're not, then you're obviously not feeling the pressure as much as you try to lead on.

I don't mind the grumbling. It's part of the market. Eventually, something will give, and the rest will have to adapt. I know several people who are buying Teslas to avoid this from now on. It's a hefty investment ... but it will save them in the long-run, and it will grant them peace of mind. As far as I'm concerned, they're making a wise choice. I know another gentleman who lives near me who just sold his truck and bought a used motorcycle because of the gas mileage. The cash he got from selling the truck more than covered the bike, so he had leftover cash, plus he's spending less on gas each week.

Paycheck to paycheck sucks ... but sometimes it's surprising what little you can live on. And at that point, you realize why you have no business complaining.

dlazz;738512 wrote:sleeper is a jackass, but he's right about the "not buying gas for a day" thing. People would just buy twice the gas the following day.

Yet I get about 2-4 Facebook updates a day telling me this is the solution.

Shoot I'm 18 and drive 30 mins to work a night for 5 hour shifts and I can't say I mind it too much. In all honesty I blow about 13 gallons a week so I'm losing with these prices about $11 more a week. That's like an extra hours pay...thats it! Besides you're tax refunds should cover any additional hikes on gas. Idk just at the end of the day I guess ya have to realize that even though gas shoots up the amount we pay a week on food is so small compared to other countries that it makes no difference, our lifestyle really won't change that much. Btw, no way does it hit $5 a gallon

sleeper;738295 wrote:McDonalds.

Thanks. Never thought of that. Don't be such a dick. If McDonald's was a viable option for supporting my family, I would have already been working there.

vball10set;738131 wrote:and like 2008, people will pay it--but unlike 2008, they won't bitch (as loud)...it's amazing how accepting we become when force-fed

Exactly...a few years ago this was all because of the evil George W. Bush. Whats the excuse now? Liberals cant complain that it is the presidents fault now because they have their boy in office now. You know...the guy who has done NOTHING while in office except put on a show of picking the NCAA basketball tournament.

sleeper;738328 wrote:Find a different job. Ask for higher reimbursement for business travel expenses. Car pool. Take a bus. Walk. If these options don't work for you, that is your problem, not the publics. Gas is a luxury that we take for granted, it won't always be there. QQ
Like I said, no amount of bitching is going to fix anything or solve anything. In reality, the only thing you can do is not buy gas if you don't think its price is fair. If enough people did that, it would lower the demand of oil and cause the price to drop to a range in which people would start buying again. Clearly, the reason oil is as high as it is, is because people are willing to pay that price.
You should start your own oil company. Apparently its easy money and you think you can provide oil at a cheaper costs than the market.

Because finding a different job that will be enough to support a family is that easy. You can ask for higher reimbursement all you want, but the company doesn’t have to pay it. Car pool or take a bus for a person who travels for business? Is there another group of people going to your personal meeting? Walk 100s of miles to get to these places?
Not buying gas will not solve anything. The prices of the gas/oil that the companies have already bought will continue to go up to make up for the loss of people not buying gas. Eventually, people will be forced to buy gas so that they can get to work and NOT LOSE THEIR JOB. Then, the gas prices will go down slightly (but just back to where they were before people stopped buying gas), before they get back to their increase. Prices wont drop simply because they don’t have to. They know that we will eventually be forced to buy it again. Our society uses gas. Period. Is that unfortunate? Maybe…it isn’t good to be completely dependent on anything…but we pretty much are. The gas companies have done a pretty good job making sure that the car companies haven’t gone completely electric or to other options…so we have to keep buying their product. Not everyone can move closer to work or take public transportation. Some people work in cities that don’t have room for family housing. Some people work out in rural areas that don’t have public transportation. It is unrealistic for people to just up and get a new job as well. Not buying gas just is not an option in our society no matter how cool it sounds to screw over the oil companies that way.

sleeper;738357 wrote:Even if we opened up this entire country to people drilling oil, it wouldn't do a heck of a lot to the price of oil. We have oil here, sure, but we don't have endless amounts.

Between Alaska, off-shore oil, and the oil recently discovered under the Dakotas the US has enough oil to fuel itself without any foreign dependency for over 80 years at a minimum. You cant tell me that we cant figure something out during that time. The Dakotas oil alone is enough for 30+ years.

tk421;738547 wrote:Yes, because people bitching about paying $1-2 more for gas have the free income to just up and fucking move. Posts like this piss me off. If I can't afford to buy $5 gas, how the fuck am I going to buy a new car or move to a new house?

This

BCBulldog;739014 wrote:Thanks. Never thought of that. Don't be such a dick. If McDonald's was a viable option for supporting my family, I would have already been working there.

Something is better than nothing, though.

I don't understand the paycheck to paycheck argument. Don't we all have to budget our monthly expenses? I budget many things like two teens college funds and my own retirement. I even have savings, but aren't we all supposed to budget and live within our means? So technically, don't we all live paycheck to paycheck? How many of us would enjoy missing a paycheck?

$4 gas is the only thing that disrupts my monthly budget, but I will never drive a Prius or Smartcar or risk my life on a motorcycle. I like my Durango, my son has an incredible school and friend group, so moving is out of the question for at least 4 years. Changing jobs in my case would be dumb and a step down. So I adjust my budget, begrudgingly.

Point being we live day to day....the vast majority live paycheck to paycheck or monthly budget to monthly budget.