Grant Hill responds to Fab 5 show....

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hoops23

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Mar 17, 2011 4:46 AM
Grant Hill knocked that response out of the park. Perfect retaliation.

I think the fact that Grant Hill and some of the other Dukies thought that they were friends with some of the Fab5 at that time had a lot to do with this response. You can tell that Hill was kind of surprised by the comments made during that documentary, as in Rose and the other members never had the courage to say it back then.

Hill said he knew something was up when Rose sent him a tweet before the documentary aired apologizing for what would be said. He also apologized on Sportsnation a day or two before I believe about comments made towards Duke...
Mar 17, 2011 4:46am
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killer_ewok

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Mar 17, 2011 8:34 AM
Jalen appeared to be sincere throughout the show. He apologized to Hill which makes me think that he felt obligated to be completely honest when telling the Fab 5 story but felt bad that Grant Hill would be hurt and embarrassed due to his honesty about how he felt back then.

Jalen doesn't strike me as the kind of guy to apologize for something if he still feels that way. He couldn't tell the Fab 5 story by sugar coating shit. Hell, he even aired out his good friend Chris Webber. Jalen is into truth telling. I can't fault him for that. Furthermore, while the Uncle Tom remarks were undoubtedly insulting, the other comments about Hill's folks were flattering if you ask me. Jalen was hurt that he didn't have that and wanted it. Really, that's saying....I hated you for having what I wanted but didn't have. That means Hill's life/background was desirable to Jalen. Again, Jalen just spoke the truth as to how he felt. My views on just about everything are much different at 33 than they were at 18.

Hill did respond appropriately IMO. I'm sure he was being honest about being proud to have never lost to the Fab 5. But let's be honest...that's a back-handed dig and Grant's damn near 40. LOL. It's probably warranted to an extent in this case but otherwise is a dick move but we're giving Grant a free pass on being honest....in his late-30's while hammering Jalen for stating how he felt.....in his late-teen's.....

Honestly, I was around around 14 when all of this stuff was going on and I felt similar about Duke. Of course now, I have great respect for them and admire them.
Mar 17, 2011 8:34am
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Manhattan Buckeye

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Mar 17, 2011 9:19 AM
"But let's be honest...that's a back-handed dig and Grant's damn near 40."

I agree it may have been a bit back-handed, but I still don't get it. It isn't as if the Michigan team didn't do anything that G'town (to Whitlock's point) or UNLV did. More people remember Larry Johnson, Stacey Augmon, Anderson Hunt and Greg Anthony then the 'Fab 5' (I swear, 99% of college basketball fans have no idea who Ray Jackson is) - and at the time Duke did something that Michigan didn't do - win two national championships. T
Mar 17, 2011 9:19am
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Prescott

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Mar 17, 2011 9:41 AM
Cause Duke hasnt changed anything to make Jalen think otherwise.Jalen was right, they dont recruit from the hood, they dont recruit one and dones.

Dahntay Jones,Sean Dockery John Wall, and Kyrie Irving.



I don't get all of the uproar about Rose's comment. It seemed clear to me that the "Uncle Tom" reference was the perception of an 18 year-old who was bitter that his mom had work hard and he had no relationship with his pro basketball father.Didn't he mention a couple of other schools who didn't recruit certain types of players?
Mar 17, 2011 9:41am
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killer_ewok

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Mar 17, 2011 9:50 AM
Manhattan Buckeye;714981 wrote:"But let's be honest...that's a back-handed dig and Grant's damn near 40."

I agree it may have been a bit back-handed, but I still don't get it. It isn't as if the Michigan team didn't do anything that G'town (to Whitlock's point) or UNLV did. More people remember Larry Johnson, Stacey Augmon, Anderson Hunt and Greg Anthony then the 'Fab 5' (I swear, 99% of college basketball fans have no idea who Ray Jackson is) - and at the time Duke did something that Michigan didn't do - win two national championships. T

I'll disagree with that. Furthermore, I noticed that quite a few of my facebook friends in their 20's (and females to boot) were posting about the Fab 5 while the show was on. My 23-year old sister-in-law now knows the story of the Fab 5. I don't think she gives a shit about those UNLV team's whether she sees the HBO documentary or not. I'm just saying that I think the Fab 5 is remembered moreso than those UNLV teams and now this generation has been exposed to the Fab 5 and they're still gaining fans a decade or so after the fact.

And let's be honest, if you're a college hoops fan of a certain age or older....you remember both the Fab 5 and the Runnin' Rebels from those times....and pretty well.
Mar 17, 2011 9:50am
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Manhattan Buckeye

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Mar 17, 2011 10:01 AM
"if you're a college hoops fan of a certain age or older....you remember both the Fab 5 and the Runnin' Rebels from those times....and pretty well.

Agreed, but Duke and UNLV were better than Michigan. And Indiana and North Carolina for that matter and even Kentucky was starting to bounce back from the Eddie Sutton-purgatory. The fab five was media hype and they were very good, but groundbreaking? Please. No one gives a shit about Ray Jackson.
Mar 17, 2011 10:01am
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Laley23

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Mar 17, 2011 10:08 AM
They werent groundbreaking on the court. They were groundbreaking off the court.

And no, people do not remember UNLV more than the Fab 5. There have been a ton of programs dedicated to the Fab 5, and not a whole lot to UNLV...which is just 1 medium which proves that point.
Mar 17, 2011 10:08am
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bigkahuna

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Mar 17, 2011 10:10 AM
The only really GREAT player that came from that team was Chris Webber. However, the term "fab 5" is remembered. Hell, I didn't know all of the names of the players, but I've always known what fab 5 was.
Mar 17, 2011 10:10am
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killer_ewok

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Mar 17, 2011 10:16 AM
Manhattan Buckeye;715009 wrote:"if you're a college hoops fan of a certain age or older....you remember both the Fab 5 and the Runnin' Rebels from those times....and pretty well.

Agreed, but Duke and UNLV were better than Michigan. And Indiana and North Carolina for that matter and even Kentucky was starting to bounce back from the Eddie Sutton-purgatory. The fab five was media hype and they were very good, but groundbreaking? Please. No one gives a shit about Ray Jackson.

I'll agree for the most part about those teams/programs being better but the Fab 5 did change the culture of college hoops. Groundbreaking? Well, I don't recall using that word but I would say that they were. The fact that they are still, to this day, garnering fans of a younger generation....says that their impact was far greater than their on-court accomplishments. And I think their on-court accomplishments were impressive though not nearly as much as many others due to lack of a championship.
Mar 17, 2011 10:16am
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Manhattan Buckeye

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Mar 17, 2011 10:16 AM
Laley23;715014 wrote:They werent groundbreaking on the court. They were groundbreaking off the court.

And no, people do not remember UNLV more than the Fab 5. There have been a ton of programs dedicated to the Fab 5, and not a whole lot to UNLV...which is just 1 medium which proves that point.

By doing what? Again, I was in college during that period....if non-basketball fans bought into it that is ok, but speaking as a college basketball fan they were a sideshow. A very good sideshow but still a sideshow. Again, no one (and I mean NO ONE) gives a shit about Ray Jackson...because he sucked.
Mar 17, 2011 10:16am
Laley23's avatar

Laley23

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Mar 17, 2011 10:25 AM
Manhattan Buckeye;715024 wrote:By doing what? Again, I was in college during that period....if non-basketball fans bought into it that is ok, but speaking as a college basketball fan they were a sideshow. A very good sideshow but still a sideshow. Again, no one (and I mean NO ONE) gives a shit about Ray Jackson...because he sucked.

You just answered your own question. Non-basketball people paid attention and new them and followed them. They may not have even been the first, but they were still the people that brought "hip-hop and gangster" to basketball because they were the ones who were famous. You dont have to know the actual players...everyone knows Fab 5. Its a term still being used all the time. They are one of the most remembered teams of all time, and they didnt win shit. Florida just went back to back and will be nothing in a few years (we barely hear about it now!). Its truly amazing how much they are known and remembered, considering how little they ever accomplished.
Mar 17, 2011 10:25am
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Manhattan Buckeye

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Mar 17, 2011 10:32 AM
"Non-basketball people paid attention and new them and followed them. "

Agreed, which is why I don't care! I remember my dorm days well....random people that didn't follow basketball kept saying "wow it is really cool that they start 5 freshman" but didn't even know their names. People that followed basketball said, "ok, they are a good team, but no Duke or Indiana". As far as hip hop and gangster, really? Its a joke, it was a media fabrication then (if it ever existed, no one put Jalen Rose in the "gangster" category) and it is even more of a joke now. If you wanted gangster, it was UNLV, not some milquetoast wannabe's in Ann Arbor. They can try to rewrite history all they want, but it is simply false. Juwan Howard has as much street cred as Justin Bieber. George Ackles or Alonzo Mourning - I wouldn't want to deal with them.
Mar 17, 2011 10:32am
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DeyDurkie5

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Mar 17, 2011 1:26 PM
Laley23;714663 wrote:by that logic, no one recruits 1 and dones.

you have to remember that ccrunner is a retard
Mar 17, 2011 1:26pm
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Laley23

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Mar 17, 2011 1:34 PM
DeyDurkie5;715241 wrote:you have to remember that ccrunner is a retard

We agree. But the public perception disagrees. The general public saw them as the hip-hop, inner city black kids, cool team to follow. Thus, they got the fame and notoriety. They were the ones that forced the big changes, even if they didnt invent them.
Mar 17, 2011 1:34pm
Laley23's avatar

Laley23

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Mar 17, 2011 1:35 PM
Manhattan Buckeye;715038 wrote:"Non-basketball people paid attention and new them and followed them. "

Agreed, which is why I don't care! I remember my dorm days well....random people that didn't follow basketball kept saying "wow it is really cool that they start 5 freshman" but didn't even know their names. People that followed basketball said, "ok, they are a good team, but no Duke or Indiana". As far as hip hop and gangster, really? Its a joke, it was a media fabrication then (if it ever existed, no one put Jalen Rose in the "gangster" category) and it is even more of a joke now. If you wanted gangster, it was UNLV, not some milquetoast wannabe's in Ann Arbor. They can try to rewrite history all they want, but it is simply false. Juwan Howard has as much street cred as Justin Bieber. George Ackles or Alonzo Mourning - I wouldn't want to deal with them.

We agree. But the public perception disagrees. The general public saw them as the hip-hop, inner city black kids, cool team to follow. Thus, they got the fame and notoriety. They were the ones that forced the big changes, even if they didnt invent them.
Mar 17, 2011 1:35pm
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reclegend22

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Mar 17, 2011 2:08 PM
If you wanted gangster, it was UNLV, not some milquetoast wannabe's in Ann Arbor. They can try to rewrite history all they want, but it is simply false. Juwan Howard has as much street cred as Justin Bieber. George Ackles or Alonzo Mourning - I wouldn't want to deal with them.
Yeah I have to lol when thinking about Juwan Howard in the same context as LL Cool J. While I agree with others that the Fab Five is most certainly the more well-known (or maybe "talked about" is the better term) of the two teams, Nevada-Las Vegas was straight nasty. As I stated in an earlier post, the Runnin' Rebels were identified in the media, and played, as "outlaws." Just look at this highlight video. THAT is intimidation and "gangster."

But Laley and Killer are right. The Fab Five most certainly did influence the hip-hop "fashion" side of the game, especially with the droopy shorts, black socks and in-your-face trash talk. They just weren't as hood as UNLV (which, I have to admit, is ironic considering that former Runnin' Rebel star Greg Anthony was also Vice President of Nevada's Young Republicans during his time on the Strip).
Mar 17, 2011 2:08pm
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enigmaax

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Mar 17, 2011 7:04 PM
reclegend22;715309 wrote:The Fab Five most certainly did influence the hip-hop "fashion" side of the game, especially with the droopy shorts, black socks and in-your-face trash talk.

Haven't read all the posts, but this sums up how they "changed" basketball. I enjoyed watching them and would've rather seen them win those title games. They still did something remarkable by being freshmen/sophomores and making two straight trips to the Finals. But other than the way some players dressed, they didn't change anything about the game of basketball. If you want to talk about their "hood" persona, fine...where are all of the "hood" teams in today's college game? I could be missing something, but I'm interested to hear what their influence on today's game is - not just the fact that people remember them (however fondly).
Mar 17, 2011 7:04pm
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Al Bundy

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Mar 17, 2011 7:35 PM
enigmaax;715736 wrote:Haven't read all the posts, but this sums up how they "changed" basketball. I enjoyed watching them and would've rather seen them win those title games. They still did something remarkable by being freshmen/sophomores and making two straight trips to the Finals. But other than the way some players dressed, they didn't change anything about the game of basketball. If you want to talk about their "hood" persona, fine...where are all of the "hood" teams in today's college game? I could be missing something, but I'm interested to hear what their influence on today's game is - not just the fact that people remember them (however fondly).
How did you miss the hood personas of Duke and Butler in the championship game last year? :)
Mar 17, 2011 7:35pm
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mallymal614

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Mar 18, 2011 9:31 AM
karen lotz;714389 wrote:What Hill fails to realize is that Rose's thoughts were those he had when he was a teenager. He responded as if those are the same thoughts he has today.

End of discussion.

But people are still trying to twist and turn the story around to make it appear that Jalen thinks this way today and that he is the same person as he was with the fab 5.
Mar 18, 2011 9:31am
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Al Bundy

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Mar 18, 2011 6:58 PM
mallymal614;716284 wrote:End of discussion.

But people are still trying to twist and turn the story around to make it appear that Jalen thinks this way today and that he is the same person as he was with the fab 5.

Some of Jalen's comments on ESPN made his current position on Duke confusing.
Mar 18, 2011 6:58pm
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Ironman92

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Mar 18, 2011 10:37 PM
The entire article Grant Hill wrote is tremndous. It is on the ESPN site under the Michael Wilbon column....which is also very well written. Much of the Hill rebuttal was left out and only included fragments of what Hill was speaking of.
Mar 18, 2011 10:37pm
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Prescott

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Mar 30, 2011 1:13 AM
"They had a heck of a run but, they didn't leave anything, they didn't establish anything there," Krzyzewski said. "The guys that I had established something that Jay Williams continued to do 10 years later -- the standards of what it meant to be a Duke basketball player."
Coach k is wrong about this. The Fab Five, as has been posted, left a lot.


I don't get all uproar about Rose's statement. He told us how he felt .It doesn't make it true. It is just his perception at the time.Would anyone prefer that he lie??
Mar 30, 2011 1:13am
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swamisez

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Mar 30, 2011 9:51 AM
Prescott;728591 wrote:Coach k is wrong about this. The Fab Five, as has been posted, left a lot.


I don't get all uproar about Rose's statement. He told us how he felt .It doesn't make it true. It is just his perception at the time.Would anyone prefer that he lie??

Fab 5 had more of an effect on basketball at large than it did at its on school. Coach K was speaking of the legacy they left at Michigan. Which according to his quote, was "they didn't leave anything, they didn't establish anything there."
Mar 30, 2011 9:51am
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Prescott

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Mar 30, 2011 10:38 AM
Fab 5 had more of an effect on basketball at large than it did at its on school.
If Fab 5 is mentioned to college basketball fans I think Michigan pops into their mind followed by the baggy shorts and the trash talking. I might be biased because I am a Big 10 fan, but that how I see the Fab 5.

BTW, According to ESPN,Jalen Rose was charged with a DUI a couple of weeks ago

http://abcnews.go.com/Sports/wireStory?id=13251743
Mar 30, 2011 10:38am