Viking;655500 wrote:Do you and your grandma beat off a lot of teams?!? Be careful before you go blind!

This is coming for the dude that tells people to find Jesus and that he is praying for them. What a joke. Your credibility continues to plummet.

RedBlackAttack;655885 wrote:What are you talking about? They beat St. Xavier the last time they played, Cinci Withrow the last two times they have played (including one at Withrow) and Trotwood-Madison in Cincinnati the last time they played. Highlands has acquitted themselves quite well against Ohio powers on the road recently.

How can you possibly spin a team that has done all of that as a sort of creampuff for Big Red? The last time they played DeSales was 2005 and Highlands lost four games that year (including a couple to KY teams). Obviously, they have been a different animal in the last four seasons. Are you really going to go back five seasons to find a bad loss to an Ohio team and ignore all of the big wins they have had against some of the best Ohio powers in the intervening years?

Side-note: We pounded that DeSales team in the 2005 state final. I guess by your rationale, they aren't worth playing, either.

I answered everything here in my previous post. Oh, and I never said they weren't worth playing.

Withrow sucks...to even think about using them as rationale is silly. I suggest you not go there.

Highlands' record against teams that can remotely be considered Ohio "powers" is a whopping 2-17. And "on the road" is a 15 minute bus ride for 80% of those games.

I've stipulated that they're a good team. I simply take issue with using them to prop up the "meat grinder" position. They're on the level of the "championship level" WV/NY/DC teams you guys play. Again, I've been watching them for 15+ years...but I have no idea what I'm talking about.

fish82;656182 wrote:I have no idea what I'm talking about.

glad we agree

there's probably less than 5 D3 programs in the state that could or even would play the schedule Big Red plays. I don't see anyone else lining up to play Highlands, Gateway, McKeesport, Woodland Hills, and any other quality big school programs i'm forgetting.

Check their records, D1 recruits, NFL players, whatever you want to check. I don't know much about Highlands, but the PA schools are quality teams. Those of you that think Ohio is king for high school football should open your eyes. The good QuadA Pennsylvania teams are right there with the perennial big schools in Ohio for talent. News flash--- a state line has no effect on quality of football players. Unless your team plays the best teams (probably not), and unless you step up a couple classes and win repeatedly (probably not), just buzz off. It gets old.
Would you shut up if Big Red did what most schools do and try to beat up local teams in their same division? Big Red would be 10-0 and you would just say, step up and play someone. Usually I don't even give this crap the respect of a response but I got some free time..... Can't wait to hear all of the same people with all of the same silly responses.

fish82;655489 wrote:Withrow? Really? Please tell me you aren't serious.

Their arguably best team ever beat an average at best X team...and you really want to hump that? Knock yerself out. Do you wanna take a stab at their all-time record against Ohio teams? :rolleyes:

It's a fun matchup, and their kids will get a kick out of playing at Harding. (I'm going out on a limb and assuming you're not coming to NKY) But they're no better than the usual OOS cupcakes you guys play. I've been watching them for 15+ years...there's a chance I might know a thing or two about them.

But hey, congrats for adding them to your devastating "meat grinder" schedule. I'll just sit here and chuckle.

The only reason I mentioned Withrow was to show they have played Ohio schools and won in the past 4 years. You're a joke, "...average at best X team"! Average in what respect? Average in terms of Previous St. X teams? If that's the case, that still places them in the top echelons of Ohio teams! Or maybe you're talking about Average Division I team? Well considering they made it to the regional finals in arguably the hardest region in Ohio tells you that they're an above average Division I team. So how exactly was St. X just an average team? Out of curiosity, how do you think Big Red would have done against that 2009 St. X team; how do you think a majority of division III teams would have done against that average St. X team?

You can downplay this team all you want, but it doesn't take away from the fact they've won 4 state championships in the past 4 years! They won the State Championship game by a score of 50 - 0 and have 55 Juniors and Sophomores coming back next year! And when you schedule a team like that right before Youngstown Ursuline, that indeed does make it a "grinder" of a schedule!

2002sunset;656357 wrote:glad we agree

there's probably less than 5 D3 programs in the state that could or even would play the schedule Big Red plays. I don't see anyone else lining up to play Highlands, Gateway, McKeesport, Woodland Hills, and any other quality big school programs i'm forgetting.

I've always agreed that the PA teams are legit. Can you find where I've posted otherwise? Note though, that I also don't see anyone else lining up to play Brooke, Morgantown, or the NY/DC Sisters of the Poor, unless they're trying to just fill a slot on the schedule. Funny how that works, huh?

2002sunset;656357 wrote:Check their records, D1 recruits, NFL players, whatever you want to check. I don't know much about Highlands, but the PA schools are quality teams.

No, you don't know much about Highlands. I guess we can agree on that too.
And while the PA teams may be good, using the number of D1s/NFLers as a measuring stick is a pretty flawed argument. There are plenty of 5-5 teams in Cincy sending 4-5 kids to D1 every year, for example.

2002sunset;656357 wrote:Those of you that think Ohio is king for high school football should open your eyes. The good QuadA Pennsylvania teams are right there with the perennial big schools in Ohio for talent. News flash--- a state line has no effect on quality of football players. Unless your team plays the best teams (probably not), and unless you step up a couple classes and win repeatedly (probably not), just buzz off. It gets old.

While a state line might not have an effect on the quality of players, (I agree FWIW) it most certainly does have an effect on the quality of teams. While the OH/PA line might be even, the OH/WV or OH/KY lines are not even close. Also FWIW, my team plays in Region 4...so we play a couple good teams on occasion. No one on par with Brooke or Morgantown though....that's for sure! :rolleyes:

2002sunset;656357 wrote:Would you shut up if Big Red did what most schools do and try to beat up local teams in their same division? Big Red would be 10-0 and you would just say, step up and play someone. Usually I don't even give this crap the respect of a response but I got some free time..... Can't wait to hear all of the same people with all of the same silly responses.

I've said at least 100 times here...I fully get the scheduling issues that Big Red has. Requiring 7 home games and a lack of opponents willing to step up locally takes its toll, and my hat's off to the staff for putting together a 10-game schedule each year. Just stop pumping it as some kind of ball-busting schedule, when other schools play harder schedules without the need to thump their chests over it.

Bigred1995;656432 wrote:The only reason I mentioned Withrow was to show they have played Ohio schools and won in the past 4 years. You're a joke, "...average at best X team"! Average in what respect? Average in terms of Previous St. X teams? If that's the case, that still places them in the top echelons of Ohio teams! Or maybe you're talking about Average Division I team? Well considering they made it to the regional finals in arguably the hardest region in Ohio tells you that they're an above average Division I team. So how exactly was St. X just an average team? Out of curiosity, how do you think Big Red would have done against that 2009 St. X team; how do you think a majority of division III teams would have done against that average St. X team?

You can downplay this team all you want, but it doesn't take away from the fact they've won 4 state championships in the past 4 years! They won the State Championship game by a score of 50 - 0 and have 55 Juniors and Sophomores coming back next year! And when you schedule a team like that right before Youngstown Ursuline, that indeed does make it a "grinder" of a schedule!

Their all-time record against teams anywhere close to an Ohio "power" is 2-17. They're a good team playing in a watered-down division in a 2nd tier football state. I'd imagine that Big Red would have been thrashed by both X and the Birds in 2009, since as I stated, it was by far their best and most talented team ever at Highlands. Why the hell do you think they went out of their way to schedule X that year?

I'm done here. I'll leave you to your chest-thumping with this....if the Red doesn't beat this team by at least 20, then you're not going to see the 2nd round of the playoffs for the 2nd straight year. Print that, and tack it on your bulletin board for future reference.

fish82;656457 wrote:Their all-time record against teams anywhere close to an Ohio "power" is 2-17. They're a good team playing in a watered-down division in a 2nd tier football state. I'd imagine that Big Red would have been thrashed by both X and the Birds in 2009, since as I stated, it was by far their best and most talented team ever at Highlands. Why the hell do you think they went out of their way to schedule X that year?

I'm done here. I'll leave you to your chest-thumping with this....if the Red doesn't beat this team by at least 20, then you're not going to see the 2nd round of the playoffs for the 2nd straight year. Print that, and tack it on your bulletin board for future reference.

Where do you see me "chest-thumping"? I was merely pointing out that having this team scheduled where they are scheduled, may go against what Reno said about not having as tough of a schedule as the previous year. You're the one making things into what they're not! We get it, you think this team is a cupcake, but you still haven't explained to me how you think St. X was merely an average team that year, nor did you explain your logic in bringing up a 2006 DeSales team! It seems to me that your only goal is to trivialize Big Red's schedule regardless of who is on it!

Bigred1995;656580 wrote:Where do you see me "chest-thumping"? I was merely pointing out that having this team scheduled where they are scheduled, may go against what Reno said about not having as tough of a schedule as the previous year. You're the one making things into what they're not! We get it, you think this team is a cupcake, but you still haven't explained to me how you think St. X was merely an average team that year, nor did you explain your logic in bringing up a 2006 DeSales team! It seems to me that your only goal is to trivialize Big Red's schedule regardless of who is on it!

1. It was 2005, not 2006. DeSales was winning handily in the 4th quarter, and HHS got a couple late TDs to make it close, did they not?

2. The GCL was nothing special in 2009. X departed in the 2nd round to Elder, who got waxed by Iggy in the finals. Their defense was solid, but their offense was absolutely nothing special. They were never any threat to win Region 4. Again, this team lost to Highlands' best team ever.

3. I'm not trying to "trivialize" anything. I'm merely countering the assertion that adding HHS somehow makes the 2011 schedule any better than your typical schedule...very few of which would qualify as "grinders" over the past 10 years.

fish82;656657 wrote:1. It was 2005, not 2006. DeSales was winning handily in the 4th quarter, and HHS got a couple late TDs to make it close, did they not?

It was actually both 2005 & 2006. In 2005 the game was in KY, while 2006 it was in Cbus. In the 2006 game Desales beat them by a score of 30 -25, and in 2005 they beat them by a score of 48 -22, but like RBA already pointed out, in 2005, Big Red beat Desales, by a score of 28-7. So using your logic, it wouldn't make any sense for Big Red to schedule Desales because back in 2005 Big Red beat DeSales "like a piñata"! How does that make any sense?

fish82;656657 wrote: 2. The GCL was nothing special in 2009. X departed in the 2nd round to Elder, who got waxed by Iggy in the finals. Their defense was solid, but their offense was absolutely nothing special. They were never any threat to win Region 4. Again, this team lost to Highlands' best team ever.

Again, you're only partially right! In 2009 X loses to Elder in the second round by a score of 14-17. Elder then loses to Hilliard Davidson by a score of 24-20. Davidson, as we all know (or should have known) goes on to beat Glenville, (not Iggy) by a score of 17-16! No one got "waxed" in that playoff run! You're thinking about 2008, but in 2009 Glenville beat Iggy by a score of 30-13!
I think it's funny that you try to add some sort of credibility of your knowledge about this team because you have been, "...watching them for 15+ years...there's a chance I might know a thing or two about them.", but you can't get simple things like when they played, who they played or the score of the games, correct and those things can be easily found, which leads me to believe the only reason you entered this thread is to trivialize Big Red's schedule!

fish82;656657 wrote: 3. I'm not trying to "trivialize" anything. I'm merely countering the assertion that adding HHS somehow makes the 2011 schedule any better than your typical schedule...very few of which would qualify as "grinders" over the past 10 years.

You may not see it as trivializing it, but when you totally ignore a team winning 4 consecutive state championships, beating 2 very good Ohio teams in the process, down grading one of those Ohio teams to average, and going all the way back to 2005 & 2006 to find an Ohio team that dominated them, you're trivializing Big Red's schedule! I'm actually surprised that you didn't bring up the fact that they lost to Colerain in 2008 by a score of 33-18 and try to tell us that Colerain was an average team that year!

And I never said it was any better, I was just pointing out that it's staring to have the makings of being just as tough as this previous year, giving us practically no time from one week to the next to heal any potential injuries! Having two multi-state championship caliber teams back to back weeks is a grinder!

Bigred1995;656775 wrote:It was actually both 2005 & 2006. In 2005 the game was in KY, while 2006 it was in Cbus. In the 2006 game Desales beat them by a score of 30 -25, and in 2005 they beat them by a score of 48 -22, but like RBA already pointed out, in 2005, Big Red beat Desales, by a score of 28-7. So using your logic, it wouldn't make any sense for Big Red to schedule Desales because back in 2005 Big Red beat DeSales "like a piñata"! How does that make any sense?

Really? The BR/DS game was 0-0 a the half and 15-7 going into the 4th quarter. Hardly like a pinata. On the other hand, the HHS game was 30-10 when the 2nd team came in.

Bigred1995;656775 wrote:Again, you're only partially right! In 2009 X loses to Elder in the second round by a score of 14-17. Elder then loses to Hilliard Davidson by a score of 24-20. Davidson, as we all know (or should have known) goes on to beat Glenville, (not Iggy) by a score of 17-16! No one got "waxed" in that playoff run! You're thinking about 2008, but in 2009 Glenville beat Iggy by a score of 30-13!
I think it's funny that you try to add some sort of credibility of your knowledge about this team because you have been, "...watching them for 15+ years...there's a chance I might know a thing or two about them.", but you can't get simple things like when they played, who they played or the score of the games, correct and those things can be easily found, which leads me to believe the only reason you entered this thread is to trivialize Big Red's schedule!

Because of a couple of dates being off by a year? Okay, Sparky...if you say so. And my mistake that you just burned me oh so badly on, actually serves to reinforce my main point that the GCLS was nothing special in 2009. So thanks for that!

Bigred1995;656775 wrote:You may not see it as trivializing it, but when you totally ignore a team winning 4 consecutive state championships, beating 2 very good Ohio teams in the process, down grading one of those Ohio teams to average, and going all the way back to 2005 & 2006 to find an Ohio team that dominated them, you're trivializing Big Red's schedule! I'm actually surprised that you didn't bring up the fact that they lost to Colerain in 2008 by a score of 33-18 and try to tell us that Colerain was an average team that year!

Can you read? Seriously dude...your "schedule paranoia" is really setting in again. "Totally ignore?" Where? When? If you could be a little more of a drama queen, that would be awesome. For the FOURTH TIME on this thread...they are a good team. Yes, they're a 4-time state champ. In Kentucky. Surely you see the difference.

Oh, and Colerain dominated that game, sorry...they could have scored 50 had they not gone into coast mode. Kinda like your "dominating" 13-3 win over Massy, huh? Goes both ways, Amigo.

Bigred1995;656775 wrote:And I never said it was any better, I was just pointing out that it's staring to have the makings of being just as tough as this previous year, giving us practically no time from one week to the next to heal any potential injuries! Having two multi-state championship caliber teams back to back weeks is a grinder!

"Just as tough as the previous year." Yeah, that 2010 schedule was a real ball buster. And I'm sorry, if you have any injuries going into Ursuline, then you need a new conditioning coach. HHS will be the least physical team you play in 2011.

I stand by my statement...if you win this game by less than 20, you'll be one and done again. Mark it.

One quick question though...kind of on a different tack...will the 2012 game be played in Ft. Thomas? (That's rhetorical. I know the answer.)

fish82;656457 wrote:Their all-time record against teams anywhere close to an Ohio "power" is 2-17. They're a good team playing in a watered-down division in a 2nd tier football state. I'd imagine that Big Red would have been thrashed by both X and the Birds in 2009, since as I stated, it was by far their best and most talented team ever at Highlands. Why the hell do you think they went out of their way to schedule X that year?

I'm done here. I'll leave you to your chest-thumping with this....if the Red doesn't beat this team by at least 20, then you're not going to see the 2nd round of the playoffs for the 2nd straight year. Print that, and tack it on your bulletin board for future reference.

Who here is 'chest-thumping,' out of curiosity? I came on this site just to see what was up with the 2011 Big Red schedule. I open up this thread and, what do I find? A thread inundated with people who clearly dislike our program and are in here only to take shots at our schedule (past and present).

Do you really think that the fact that we are now going back-and-forth about the Big Red schedule is due to Steubenville people and not those that immediately jumped on this thread, peppering us with questions about 'how many home games' and 'will you beat any Ohio teams this year'?

We've had our debates in the past on various websites... Hell, I feel like I almost know you personally from our conversations over the past decade. I know that you are intelligent. Now, that said, I ask you... Were Big Red people not put on the defensive immediately in this thread? And, isn't it the same thing in every thread that even remotely mentions our program?

Then, somehow it becomes Big Red people 'chest-thumping,' when in actuality, they were simply defending the program against unprompted attacks.

The last note on Highlands... It is pretty clear that they are experiencing a 'Golden Age' for their football program. We can bring up statistics on how they've done all-time against Ohio programs, but the fact remains that they've been pretty damned good in the last four years.

We aren't playing them during a series of down years, but coming off of four straight championships. It is a quality opponent and I think that is relatively obvious. Gateway is an excellent opponent, if that is indeed true. Throw in Massillon and Ursuline (if those games do happen) and the schedule would stack up against anyone in Division III. We really shouldn't have to go to such lengths to prove that we have a quality schedule.

Last year's was actually too difficult (imo), yet all we hear is that we didn't beat an Ohio team. I'm just not really sure what people want.

RedBlackAttack;656920 wrote:Who here is 'chest-thumping,' out of curiosity? I came on this site just to see what was up with the 2011 Big Red schedule. I open up this thread and, what do I find? A thread inundated with people who clearly dislike our program and are in here only to take shots at our schedule (past and present).

Do you really think that the fact that we are now going back-and-forth about the Big Red schedule is due to Steubenville people and not those that immediately jumped on this thread, peppering us with questions about 'how many home games' and 'will you beat any Ohio teams this year'?

We've had our debates in the past on various websites... Hell, I feel like I almost know you personally from our conversations over the past decade. I know that you are intelligent. Now, that said, I ask you... Were Big Red people not put on the defensive immediately in this thread? And, isn't it the same thing in every thread that even remotely mentions our program?

Then, somehow it becomes Big Red people 'chest-thumping,' when in actuality, they were simply defending the program against unprompted attacks.

The last note on Highlands... It is pretty clear that they are experiencing a 'Golden Age' for their football program. We can bring up statistics on how they've done all-time against Ohio programs, but the fact remains that they've been pretty damned good in the last four years.

We aren't playing them during a series of down years, but coming off of four straight championships. It is a quality opponent and I think that is relatively obvious. Gateway is an excellent opponent, if that is indeed true. Throw in Massillon and Ursuline (if those games do happen) and the schedule would stack up against anyone in Division III. We really shouldn't have to go to such lengths to prove that we have a quality schedule.

Last year's was actually too difficult (imo), yet all we hear is that we didn't beat an Ohio team. I'm just not really sure what people want.

Fine. For you, I'll retract the "chest thumping" crack. I still think "meat grinder" is silly.

The only Div. III teams that will play a tougher schedule than Big Red are Mooney and maybe DeSales. If that doesn't give us a "meat grinder" schedule, then I would like to know what does.

FairwoodKing;657014 wrote:The only Div. III teams that will play a tougher schedule than Big Red are Mooney and maybe DeSales. If that doesn't give us a "meat grinder" schedule, then I would like to know what does.

Watterson
Benny
Walsh, depending on the year
SVSM, depending on the year
1/2 the NBC, depending on OOC games

And for lower than D3 - 1/2 the MAC teams

Also throw in Alter some years.

Off the top of my head.

fish82;657071 wrote:Watterson
Benny
Walsh, depending on the year
SVSM, depending on the year
1/2 the NBC, depending on OOC games

And for lower than D3 - 1/2 the MAC teams

Also throw in Alter some years.

Off the top of my head.

What is going on with joeeitel? Not having that site around is really hurting some of my debating skills.

I disagree that half of the NBC schools play a tougher schedule than us... Or half of the MAC teams. I'd like to see those schedules for comparative purposes, but don't really feel like seeking them out.

I'd be surprised if there was another public school -- Division III or below -- that plays a tougher schedule than us. Equally as difficult? Maybe a handful of publics, but not many. The only schools that have an undoubtedly more difficult schedule are those handful of parochials that we are all quite familiar with.

RedBlackAttack;657079 wrote:What is going on with joeeitel? Not having that site around is really hurting some of my debating skills.

I disagree that half of the NBC schools play a tougher schedule than us... Or half of the MAC teams. I'd like to see those schedules for comparative purposes, but don't really feel like seeking them out.

I'd be surprised if there was another public school -- Division III or below -- that plays a tougher schedule than us. Equally as difficult? Maybe a handful of publics, but not many. The only schools that have an undoubtedly more difficult schedule are those handful of parochials that we are all quite familiar with.

I know right? I hope he brings it back up soon...it's screwing with my mojo as well.

And yes, if you narrow it down to just publics, Steuby fares much better. As far as the NBC/MAC...tougher? Maybe not, but equal most years, IMO. MAC teams are playing 2-3 state champions or finalists each year in their own league. The NBC was down this past season, but in recent years, playing West Branch, South, Louisville et al each season is pretty formidable. Without Eitel, I can't verify some of the OOC games, but I think some of them have played some beefy OOC schedules most years.

And as far as Highlands, I will say this...as far as the tradition/history angle goes for both teams, it's a pretty cool matchup.

Woodland hills has more current players in the NFL than any other HS team in the country ..Its assinine how we get attacked every frigging year ..Its only cause our haters want our schedule so hard that we end up 5-5 or worse and we have almost fell into this trap ...Nodody said crap when we were winniong back to back state titles and plaing all these out of state schools .. but last year we lose 2 Ohio teams in the last minute IC and Buhctel .. IC cause they renigged on contract and Buhctel so we both could be in the WPIAL classic ... We are not as deep as many D-1 teams but we can field a first team that can match 99% D-1 teams ... Lets not keep falling into these traps .. Our enemies want our schedule so stacked against us .. I say we tone it back down a peg .. or until we have a real deep class comong in

Fish 82 You dont know Jack about Steubenville football dont act like you do .. Reading the papers and Internet doesnt qualify you ...Listen to Us Big Red guys on here and you will learn the truths about Big Red football ..

fish82;657071 wrote:Watterson
Benny
Walsh, depending on the year
SVSM, depending on the year
1/2 the NBC, depending on OOC games

And for lower than D3 - 1/2 the MAC teams

Also throw in Alter some years.

Off the top of my head.

yea depending on what year is right ... I think our schedule last year was probably the toughest reg season schedulein D-3 .. but thats all coffee shop talk its conjecture and we all have our opinions... We have prooven ourselves against the Columbus teams time and again .. I think most years Columbus teams are overrated ..

You can judge a schedule by the points they garner come playoff time if you like ... That is one way to settle an argument ... Look at our points everytime we go 10-0 reg season and match those up with all Ohio teams ... I have and we are in the top 1% of all schools even last year going 8-2 in reg season gave us a home game ... we are good ... Lets ignor these haters .. I enjoy the new fresh very good teams we have been getting .. Next year we just have to take care of business in the first round ... we cant lose to a dover team at home again ... that aint gonna fly ... I also hope we kick a field goal next time its 4th and 4 at the 4 ... we went for it twice last year on 4th and goal at the 4 .. In Massillon which cost us and Dover which would have been like an extra point to put it in Overtime at our house just some thoughts

Thinthickbigred;657216 wrote:Fish 82 You dont know Jack about Steubenville football dont act like you do .. Reading the papers and Internet doesnt qualify you ...Listen to Us Big Red guys on here and you will learn the truths about Big Red football ..

You're starting to get a little obsessed with me. You're making me uncomfortable...please stop it.

Thinthickbigred;657218 wrote:You can judge a schedule by the points they garner come playoff time if you like ... That is one way to settle an argument ... Look at our points everytime we go 10-0 reg season and match those up with all Ohio teams ... I have and we are in the top 1% of all schools even last year going 8-2 in reg season gave us a home game ... we are good ... Lets ignor these haters .. I enjoy the new fresh very good teams we have been getting .. Next year we just have to take care of business in the first round ... we cant lose to a dover team at home again ... that aint gonna fly ... I also hope we kick a field goal next time its 4th and 4 at the 4 ... we went for it twice last year on 4th and goal at the 4 .. In Massillon which cost us and Dover which would have been like an extra point to put it in Overtime at our house just some thoughts

Be careful, fish is trying to embrace you!

Viking;657267 wrote:Be careful, fish is trying to embrace you!

Are the votes still there? Passage assured?

The current proposal concerning the playoffs will pass. The commissioner is for it and will see that it passes.

Serious question,
Since there was a time when steuby was going to join the ecol big school division, the openings for them and those opponents would have remained on the schedule. Has their been any attempt or consideration of playing any of those teams as an OOC opponent?
I know we are under contract with Carrolton to continue the week 1 Thursday night opener this season, but personally would love to see a tradition of a Dover/steuby week one opener starting a new tradition for both schools. I think that opening the season against each other would avoid the "likely to meet later in the season" argument.