Yesterday, the Hilliard school district "gave up their raises" and apparently Westerville teachers came to an agreement with their contract.

My question is, do teachers get paid too little, just right, or too much?

Discuss.

They get paid exactly what the market is willing to pay them.

BTW, the average teacher salary in Ohio is $57,000.

Here is a website to look up teacher salaries:
http://ohiocasb.org/about/data

Con_Alma;501085 wrote:They get paid exactly what the market is willing to pay them.

Now that is an interesting point of view.

By market you mean taxpayers? How can a school district operate in the red, yet say they are paying market worth?

Are schools not paid by property taxes? If property values have decreased by 6% over the last few years, should teachers pay not also be decreased?

I voted "paid just right". I'm entering a Masters program in Special Education next fall so I might be a bit biased.

now Im stuck looking through our district's pay wages....its pretty crazy how much some of the people who work as counselors who dont do anything all day make over 80k a year

I think they are overpaid in Ohio to be honest. There are way more teachers than jobs, so one would think the salaries should be lower to drive people to other careers. The discrepency between school districts is the most alarming thing about the salaries.

osudarby08;501094 wrote:now Im stuck looking through our district's pay wages....its pretty crazy how much some of the people who work as counselors who dont do anything all day make over 80k a year

I found that website a few years back, and spent quite a bit of time on it. I remembered some of the teachers and people I know who complained about the money they make, but once I saw what it was I was really surprised.

Personally, I think the perception is that teachers are making like $40k a year, when that just isn't true.

thedynasty1998;501089 wrote:... If property values have decreased by 6% over the last few years, should teachers pay not also be decreased?

Salaries of teachers or any government employee does not necessarily have a direct correlation to property tax values. There is some but the correlation variation certainly isn't one.

A school's budget is made up of more than salaries from an expense side and property tax receipts from an income side. In addition. the labor market including that of the private sector and even the supply and demand of teachers from other states to some degree influence the cost or price of hiring a teacher.

thedynasty1998;501089 wrote:...

By market you mean taxpayers? How can a school district operate in the red, yet say they are paying market worth?

By the market I mean the labor market.

A teacher's service has value no matter the income level of a school district. The district's ability to pay isn't the same things as the value of the services provided by the teacher.

If you replace your question with the following it might make more sense.

How can you say the plumber charged the market price for fixing the toilets when the school district had no more money left to pay him?

Some teachers in my district are sub 40k to 45k if they are relatively inexperienced. Others are making 70-80k if they have been teaching for 20+ years.

i think its fair pay for 10 months of work and all the other benefits they get (holidays, their vacation/sick time, etc).

Con_Alma;501105 wrote:By the market I mean the labor market.

A teacher's service has value no matter the income level of a school district. The district's ability to pay isn't the same things as the value of the services provided by the teacher.

If you replace your question with the following it might make more sense.

How can you say the plumber charged the market price for fixing the toilets when the school district had no more money left to pay him?

Exactly.

There are some school districts in Ohio that flourish and do very well for themselves. These are the school districts in cities and towns who realize the benefit of having a great public school system and support it by passing such and such levy to support it. But do not make the mistake of assuming that all teachers in Ohio are paid well. Most are barely above the level of being able to have children and get by. Starting in at $20,000 average in Northwestern Ohio for districts that I'm aware of, and I'm aware of a lot. Don't make the mistake of thinking an Olentangy or Hillard paycheck for a teacher is average in this state.

Ability to pay and the agreement to pay at a certain rate are two different things. The actual market value of any given teacher's services are what they agree to sell them for when the price matches that which a district agrees to pay.

The Dispatch had an article about teachers salaries on August 16th, 2009, and here are some of the key points:

While 60 percent of schools are getting a cut in state aid over the next two years, and the rest will see annual increases of less than 1 percent, pay raises for teachers top 5 percent in some districts once all the automatic pay bumps are included.

"Teachers are not getting pay raises, and some districts delayed negotiations pending the outcome of the state budget," said William Leibensperger, vice president of the Ohio Education Association.
He cautioned against shortchanging teachers.
"There is an undeniable correlation between teacher salaries and resources given to teachers and student achievement," he said.

A Dispatch analysis of contracts last school year found that raises for teachers in nearly every Franklin County district would average 5.9 percent to 8.8 percent per year over their first 10 years on the job, thanks to automatic step increases and base salary hikes.......
Meanwhile, the average wage and salary increase for nongovernment employees in the 12-month period ending in June was 1.8 percent, according to the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics. Raises in 2010 are not expected to top 2 percent, according to federal estimates.

-Jim Siegel and Catherine Candisky, Columbus Dispatch

As a comparison to a first year teacher - first year enlisted Army & Navy recruits earn $1,365/ mo. Are we as a Nation proud of that fact?

It depends a lot on the district, but I would say that at this moment most probably make too much. It's not necessarily that their salaries are too high, but their mandatory raises are. We're in a recession, which means we're experiencing deflation, but their salaries are going up far faster than the cost of living. While their raises may be 5.5%, it's actually more when you consider the slow rate of growth for the cost of living and the fact that the value of the dollar has gone down in recent years.

Paid way too much, on average. Especially ccrunner.

Tiernan;501134 wrote:As a comparison to a first year teacher - first year enlisted Army & Navy recruits earn $1,365/ mo. Are we as a Nation proud of that fact?

Did the enlisted get educations that can be in the hundreds of thousands of dollars?

They aren't paid too much but they do tend to act like they're not paid enough way too much. when one is complaining about making $50k a year when you only work 9 months and have every holiday and day with bad weather off then there is a problem.

I'm a teacher (there's an assembly right now, before you say anything ). I have buddies that work on an assembly line that make more than I do. I'm more educated. Is that OK? I'm OK with it. I think that I am paid "just right" for what I do. I don't demand any more money, but I think that being paid less wouldn't necessarily be fair either.

ernest_t_bass;501141 wrote:I'm a teacher (there's an assembly right now, before you say anything ). I have buddies that work on an assembly line that make more than I do. I'm more educated. Is that OK? I'm OK with it. I think that I am paid "just right" for what I do. I don't demand any more money, but I think that being paid less wouldn't necessarily be fair either.

Says the teacher who spends 90% of his day on OhioChatter.com (probably hooking up with students)....

They get 3 months off out of the year. I voted "paid just right." Then I saw that the average salary was $57,000 per year. That's high for working 75% of the year. I would think around $40-45K is about what the median should be for teachers.

Teachers get paid too much.

i think it is ok after around your 12th year of teaching....before that it is a struggle to make ends meet to try to support a family buy a home etc.....if you pay any less than what your paying now you will not be able to attract and retain quality teachers. the best and brightest will go into other occupations. I think that teachers are working harder than ever. I know just like when i was in school we all can think of teachers who weren't very good or only taught so they could coach. these days teachers are feeling the pressure from the not only the community but are under tighter scrutiny on a daily basis from administration, who themselves are being pressured from the superindentdents office.

I also see better trained teachers who are able to use technology in a variety of ways in the classroom. I am now doing consulting work for public schools and i see lots of amazing lessons on a daily basis that really blow me away. No longer are lessons being taught with pencil and paper. I recommend that if you havent visited a school in a while you will be really surprised at how much work is put in to some of these activities and learning experiences and how much the students are engaged with rigorous and relevant assignments...

just one example i saw in a science class was students making their own usb/flash drive or something like that out of legos...it was either that or a charger that plugged into a usb cause it had some type of crank. but the point is the lesson was awesome and the teacher spent several hundred dollars out of her pocket to buy the supplies...

jmog;501111 wrote:
i think its fair pay for 10 months of work and all the other benefits they get (holidays, their vacation/sick time, etc).

I agree with this

ernest_t_bass;501141 wrote:I'm a teacher (there's an assembly right now, before you say anything ). I have buddies that work on an assembly line that make more than I do. I'm more educated. Is that OK? I'm OK with it. I think that I am paid "just right" for what I do. I don't demand any more money, but I think that being paid less wouldn't necessarily be fair either.

This. I think that both people that complain about teachers getting paid too much and teachers that whine about not getting enough are ridiculous. Teacher salaries now are pretty fair when everything is considered. Sure you start off low but you build up very regularly and have some semblance of job security and retirement which is more than most can say. But yes, having an education should usually mean higher pay.

Tiernan;501134 wrote:As a comparison to a first year teacher - first year enlisted Army & Navy recruits earn $1,365/ mo. Are we as a Nation proud of that fact?

So they make less than $17,000 a year, but don't they have their housing and food payed for? I'm asking because I honestly don't know, but if they do then $17,000 a year seems like plenty.