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White Sox (Buehrle 2-0, 2.40) @ Indians (Talbot 0-1, 7.20)

Home ▸ Archive ▸ Pro Sports ▸ White Sox (Buehrle 2-0, 2.40) @ Indians (Talbot 0-1, 7.20)
BRF's avatar

BRF

Senior Member

8,748 posts
Apr 16, 2010 8:41 PM
Ho Ho! Talk about some unearned runs!

Go Tribe, ....from one of the "fossils"! :-)
Apr 16, 2010 8:41pm
F

Footwedge

Senior Member

9,265 posts
Apr 16, 2010 8:41 PM
Glory Days wrote:
Footwedge wrote: Well...just looked up the official box score, and they have ruled the run unearned. I would be willing to bet a six pack that that scoring ruling will be reversed.
no way they change that. that runner doesnt even get to 3rd if Choo fields it.
But you cannot assume a double play. It could be that the scorer will rule that since the other runner was held at third with one out, then he's assuming that the first runner would have stayed there as well..

I still say that they change the ruling.
Apr 16, 2010 8:41pm
Laley23's avatar

Laley23

GOAT

29,506 posts
Apr 16, 2010 8:48 PM
Footwedge wrote:

But you cannot assume a double play. It could be that the scorer will rule that since the other runner was held at third with one out, then he's assuming that the first runner would have stayed there as well..

I still say that they change the ruling.
Am I wrong with how that inning played out?

Without the error:
--Ramirez Single
--Teahen Single (Ramirez to second)
--Pierre Sacrificed (Ramirez to third, Teahen to second)
--Beckham grounded out to third (runners held)
--Quentin grounded out to third (end of inning)


How the hell is that gonna be ruled an earned run??
Apr 16, 2010 8:48pm
Glory Days's avatar

Glory Days

Senior Member

7,809 posts
Apr 16, 2010 8:50 PM
Footwedge wrote:
Glory Days wrote:
Footwedge wrote: Well...just looked up the official box score, and they have ruled the run unearned. I would be willing to bet a six pack that that scoring ruling will be reversed.
no way they change that. that runner doesnt even get to 3rd if Choo fields it.
But you cannot assume a double play. It could be that the scorer will rule that since the other runner was held at third with one out, then he's assuming that the first runner would have stayed there as well..

I still say that they change the ruling.
huh? you dont assume anything. the runner moved to second on the hit then because of the error advanced to 3rd and scored. had ramirez been on 3rd it would be a different story because he scored on the hit.
Apr 16, 2010 8:50pm
F

Footwedge

Senior Member

9,265 posts
Apr 16, 2010 8:57 PM
First off...you are assuming that the runner is held at second base on Choo's error. Obviously, the scorekeeper made the same assumption.

With that said, let's assume that the scorekeeper is right. The White Sox would bunt both runners over...down 3-1. The infield then plays DEEP. and the second run scores from 3rd....because Peralta, playing deep, throws the ball across the diamond to first base. Under this scenario, the run is earned. I say the official scorer changes his call.
Apr 16, 2010 8:57pm
Tigerfan00's avatar

Tigerfan00

Senior Member

3,427 posts
Apr 16, 2010 8:59 PM
They should let Talbot go for the complete game, hes had a damn good night.
Apr 16, 2010 8:59pm
F

Footwedge

Senior Member

9,265 posts
Apr 16, 2010 9:01 PM
Glory Days wrote:
Footwedge wrote:
Glory Days wrote:
Footwedge wrote: Well...just looked up the official box score, and they have ruled the run unearned. I would be willing to bet a six pack that that scoring ruling will be reversed.
no way they change that. that runner doesnt even get to 3rd if Choo fields it.
But you cannot assume a double play. It could be that the scorer will rule that since the other runner was held at third with one out, then he's assuming that the first runner would have stayed there as well..

I still say that they change the ruling.
huh? you dont assume anything. the runner moved to second on the hit then because of the error advanced to 3rd and scored. had ramirez been on 3rd it would be a different story because he scored on the hit.
Read my latest post. If the Sox bunt, which they most likely do (they did it anyway), then the runners are at second and third. Down 2 runs with one out. Tthe infiekd plays DEEP and not in at the cut of the grass. Now, the runner from third scores...on the grounder to Paralta.

It's not that hard to understand here.
Apr 16, 2010 9:01pm
Laley23's avatar

Laley23

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29,506 posts
Apr 16, 2010 9:01 PM
Footwedge wrote: First off...you are assuming that the runner is held at second base on Choo's error. Obviously, the scorekeeper made the same assumption.

With that said, let's assume that the scorekeeper is right. The White Sox would bunt both runners over...down 3-1. The infield then plays DEEP. and the second run scores from 3rd....because Peralta, playing deep, throws the ball across the diamond to first base. Under this scenario, the run is earned. I say the official scorer changes his call.
I get what your saying. But a scorekeeper isnt going to just say the infield wouldve been back. In cases like this, you just have to assume the inning plays out the EXACT same but with that lead runner (Ramirez in this case) a base behind where he is.
Apr 16, 2010 9:01pm
BRF's avatar

BRF

Senior Member

8,748 posts
Apr 16, 2010 9:02 PM
I am liking this "complete game" business! It's a return to the old days!!!! And Talbot has never gone past 5 innings. I hope the skipper hands him the ball for the 9th!
Apr 16, 2010 9:02pm
Glory Days's avatar

Glory Days

Senior Member

7,809 posts
Apr 16, 2010 9:03 PM
Footwedge wrote: First off...you are assuming that the runner is held at second base on Choo's error. Obviously, the scorekeeper made the same assumption.
its because he did all but stop. if he was going to 3rd on the hit, he wouldnt have had to look back into right field to see Choo miss the ball before running to 3rd. had it been a hit and run, it still would be unearned because the runner would have made it to 3rd on the hit. but he still would only have scored because of the error.
Footwedge wrote: With that said, let's assume that the scorekeeper is right. The White Sox would bunt both runners over...down 3-1. The infield then plays DEEP. and the second run scores from 3rd....because Peralta, playing deep, throws the ball across the diamond to first base. Under this scenario, the run is earned. I say the official scorer changes his call.
none of that matters. what if the next 2 batters strike out? what if the next batter pops up and then the batter after that grounds out. there is no what if. unless Ramirez would have scored on the that specific play(the example i gave with him being on 3rd and scoring on the hit, not the error), it is unearned.
Apr 16, 2010 9:03pm
Laley23's avatar

Laley23

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29,506 posts
Apr 16, 2010 9:03 PM
Talbot will be out there for the ninth unless Acta wants to get the pen some work (but it would be 1 player, so whats the point) and not let them go 3 days off.
Apr 16, 2010 9:03pm
newarkcatholicfan's avatar

newarkcatholicfan

Senior Member

3,199 posts
Apr 16, 2010 9:07 PM
I am shocked but happy to see the team playing so well in this one.
Apr 16, 2010 9:07pm
BRF's avatar

BRF

Senior Member

8,748 posts
Apr 16, 2010 9:11 PM
BRF wrote: I am liking this "complete game" business! It's a return to the old days!!!! And Talbot has never gone past 5 innings. I hope the skipper hands him the ball for the 9th!
YES! I am going to get the Glittering Wahoo out!
Apr 16, 2010 9:11pm
royal_k's avatar

royal_k

Senior Member

4,423 posts
Apr 16, 2010 9:11 PM
Ballgame!!

2 comeplete game victories in a row!
Apr 16, 2010 9:11pm
royal_k's avatar

royal_k

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4,423 posts
Apr 16, 2010 9:13 PM
Charlie Nagy and Chad Ogea were the last Tribe pitchers to go back to back complete game wins in1996.
Apr 16, 2010 9:13pm
Tigerfan00's avatar

Tigerfan00

Senior Member

3,427 posts
Apr 16, 2010 9:14 PM
Not only is it two complete games in a row but its also by the 4 and 5 rotation starters.
Apr 16, 2010 9:14pm
N

NOL fan

Senior Member

376 posts
Apr 16, 2010 9:16 PM
NOL fan wrote: yeah, though it wouldn't surprise me if they somehow won tonight, only to lose the next 2
haha, phase one complete

now prove me wrong Tribe when it comes to phase 2 and 3
Apr 16, 2010 9:16pm
F

Footwedge

Senior Member

9,265 posts
Apr 16, 2010 9:17 PM
Look guys....I'm not saying I'm right. I just offered my opinion. Obviously this scoring decision is a judgement call. In my judgement, the runner from third would have scored with the infield back.

So far, the official scorer agrees with you guys. If i was scoring it, the run is earned...because in my judgement, the runner scores on the ground ball. Why do I think he scores? Because the infield will ALWAYS PLAY DEEP in a second and third situation up 2 runs.
Apr 16, 2010 9:17pm
newarkcatholicfan's avatar

newarkcatholicfan

Senior Member

3,199 posts
Apr 16, 2010 9:17 PM
Maybe the new mgr has no faith in the blowpen whatever the case may be I like the way he has given the starters the chance to close out the game.
Apr 16, 2010 9:17pm
F

Footwedge

Senior Member

9,265 posts
Apr 16, 2010 9:19 PM
BRF wrote:
BRF wrote: I am liking this "complete game" business! It's a return to the old days!!!! And Talbot has never gone past 5 innings. I hope the skipper hands him the ball for the 9th!
YES! I am going to get the Glittering Wahoo out!
People have been clamoring for the GW, BRF. The opportunities will be far and few between.
Apr 16, 2010 9:19pm
BRF's avatar

BRF

Senior Member

8,748 posts
Apr 16, 2010 9:21 PM


[size=xx-large]BAM![/size]

[size=xx-small]psst..........let's just drop the earned/unearned "thang" and enjoy the win!!............OK?[/size]
Apr 16, 2010 9:21pm
Laley23's avatar

Laley23

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29,506 posts
Apr 16, 2010 9:22 PM
Footwedge wrote: Look guys....I'm not saying I'm right. I just offered my opinion. Obviously this scoring decision is a judgement call. In my judgement, the runner from third would have scored with the infield back.

So far, the official scorer agrees with you guys. If i was scoring it, the run is earned...because in my judgement, the runner scores on the ground ball. Why do I think he scores? Because the infield will ALWAYS PLAY DEEP in a second and third situation up 2 runs.
I mean, I agree that I think the run wouldve scored in that situation. But if Im scoring I have a hard saying that run scores mainly because it was to 3rd. The runner mightve frozen on a ball to the corner infielders regardless of if they were playing back. Likely Peralta wouldve been halfway in, if not all the way in at the corners which you see a lot of times in those situations.
Apr 16, 2010 9:22pm
Laley23's avatar

Laley23

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29,506 posts
Apr 16, 2010 9:23 PM
btw, that was a very well played game all the way around. Starters have made me eat my foot so far this year.
Apr 16, 2010 9:23pm
BRF's avatar

BRF

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8,748 posts
Apr 16, 2010 9:24 PM
Apr 16, 2010 9:24pm
Glory Days's avatar

Glory Days

Senior Member

7,809 posts
Apr 16, 2010 9:25 PM
Footwedge wrote: Look guys....I'm not saying I'm right. I just offered my opinion. Obviously this scoring decision is a judgement call. In my judgement, the runner from third would have scored with the infield back.

So far, the official scorer agrees with you guys. If i was scoring it, the run is earned...because in my judgement, the runner scores on the ground ball. Why do I think he scores? Because the infield will ALWAYS PLAY DEEP in a second and third situation up 2 runs.
i know what you are saying, but that isnt how you determine if the run is earned or not. the only thing to consider is if Choo fields the ball cleanly, would the runner on 1st have scored on that play.
Apr 16, 2010 9:25pm