hasbeen;1372113 wrote:Another reason not to do it this way: separate ourselves from basketball!

I will accept your point about homework prior to the dual. Where do they make up the lost sleep?
I don't like extending events into the later evening hours. Especially when the reasoning is to make it better for the fans.

Lousy basketball teams are still putting more fans (and students) in the stands than wrestling are you sure we can be any more different than we already are? They have structure- 5:00 Freshman, 6:00 JV, & 7:15 Varsity. Wrestling has 2 x 4 meets where fans travel to schools they do not even wrestle. Start times are sporatic depending on IF there are even any JV matches. Dual Team scores are impossible to follow since there are two matches running at the same time usually with ample forfeits and usually not enough quality table help to keep the crowd up to date on the team scores. If there are JV matches then it is a crap shoot on what time the varsity starts because there could be one or there could be 10.

What lost sleep? Kids home around 10:00ish. Put them to bed.

iGranby;1372124 wrote:PC wins here. By quite a few, especially if they win (and it is very possible) at 120, and 126. Just my guess, crazier things have happened though.

i think it will be a good match, but i like lieb in a minor d vs. terry.

@126 scott did not wrestle for watkins last week. they fielded a JV kid who managed not to get pinned by a timchenko looking for bonus points for the dual lol. moral victory?? lol. anyway, if scott's back in the lineup he should be tough.

i know it's maybe going out on a limb, and no disrespect to the pick central studs, but i think lancia will pin yarger or boudarant depending on where he goes.

sunkle wins of course.

honestly, not sure on the other weights. was just looking to create some debate and discussion during what is understandably a week of little suspense

It will be a good #7 vs #2 duel , with good possible match ups of lieb vs terry , scott vs hogue, holter vs Piecynzski, and Lancia vs Yarger/ Bondurant depending on where Lancia goes.

Lancia goes where he wants. Just ask Chuck Norris.

ptown3;1372233 wrote:It will be a good #7 vs #2 duel , with good possible match ups of lieb vs terry , scott vs hogue, holter vs Piecynzski, and Lancia vs Yarger/ Bondurant depending on where Lancia goes.

assuming everyone's healthy on both sides i think this is the most interesting first-round matchup from regions 5 and 6

accordign to the marion elgin thread, holter was 138 where he was runner up i think.

who does pick central have at 132? WM's bankes is pretty solid and fun to watch.

if he's wrestling WM has a big kid at 220 or heavy who's entertaining as well.

rassler;1372129 wrote:Lousy basketball teams are still putting more fans (and students) in the stands than wrestling are you sure we can be any more different than we already are? They have structure- 5:00 Freshman, 6:00 JV, & 7:15 Varsity. Wrestling has 2 x 4 meets where fans travel to schools they do not even wrestle. Start times are sporatic depending on IF there are even any JV matches. Dual Team scores are impossible to follow since there are two matches running at the same time usually with ample forfeits and usually not enough quality table help to keep the crowd up to date on the team scores. If there are JV matches then it is a crap shoot on what time the varsity starts because there could be one or there could be 10.

What lost sleep? Kids home around 10:00ish. Put them to bed.

The key to more fans wouldn't be making the event longer.

The issue isn't how hard the duals are to follow, it is that wrestling isn't mainstream so the scoring is different. The average Joe wouldn't follow regardless of how many duals are going on.

We're beginning to get off topic, but my whole point is I don't see the benefit in extending the length of the day.

bump_and_run;1372157 wrote:i think it will be a good match, but i like lieb in a minor d vs. terry.

@126 scott did not wrestle for watkins last week. they fielded a JV kid who managed not to get pinned by a timchenko looking for bonus points for the dual lol. moral victory?? lol. anyway, if scott's back in the lineup he should be tough.

i know it's maybe going out on a limb, and no disrespect to the pick central studs, but i think lancia will pin yarger or boudarant depending on where he goes.

sunkle wins of course.

honestly, not sure on the other weights. was just looking to create some debate and discussion during what is understandably a week of little suspense

I gotchya. No hate or disrespect intended on my end or anything, I'm not even affiliated with either team, other than when I was in my novice days, just a fan of debate & discussion as well. haha.

I like Hogue to win at 26, Scott is no slouch though.
Lancia's safest bet in my mind would lye in Yarger, witch in no way is really "safe". Mind you he was a district semi-finalist last season, even though he isn't exactly having an amazing year thus far. Bounarant is very athletic, and talented, that can be said for almost all of Allen's team though. Regardless, I dont think Lancia is going to pin either of them.

The real question is the Sophomore Lieb and Freshman Terry. I've seen them both, I give the advantage on the mat to Lieb, on their feet to Terry.

hasbeen;1372276 wrote:The key to more fans wouldn't be making the event longer.

The issue isn't how hard the duals are to follow, it is that wrestling isn't mainstream so the scoring is different. The average Joe wouldn't follow regardless of how many duals are going on.

We're beginning to get off topic, but my whole point is I don't see the benefit in extending the length of the day.

Last post in this regard...... and if you disagree then we will have to agree to disagree.

Wrestling is not mainstream because the wrestling community has done a poor job of promoting itself and that problem is compounded by the fact that we continue to confuse the general public (particularly the student bodies) with events that present themselves as mass chaos instead of a polished event.

I am in sales. Every year I am given my expectations for growth by my boss. His requirement is to keep our current customers. He figures if you lose one, then you have to find at least two to grow. His second rule is to solicit new markets and customers. The wrestling community has done neither.

My father has been a wrestling fan/coach/wrestler/parent/grandparent for 60 years. Loves and lived the sport. He is so frustrated he will not attend any matches unless I take him. He loves to speculate on individual and team outcomes. When the 2 x 4 format was introduced and the ridiculous individual pool tournaments became popular and the confusion they created, we lost a wrestling fan and he is not alone. We wanted to watch Pick Central and Lancaster wrestle at Grove City. We could not find ANYWHERE including on this forum at what time the match was taking place so we didn't go. The point is, we are losing current customers through our own fault. If we can not retain "the low laying fruit" so to speak, how on earth do you expect to attract new "customers".

I get the whole, it's a school night thing, but boys and girls basketball deal with this issue multiple times during a week all season long. I can't image one or two days out of the entire season being that taxing on our student athletes. They should have no excuses as the schedule allows for ample planning. Again, another opportunity for a life lesson in planning.

Pennsylvania has had a dual team championship since 1999 and when it started it received as much if not more critizism than the current Ohio version. Are there bugs? Sure. Will they fix them? I would like to think so. I do know that this is one of the best changes to promote the sport in a very long time and I hope it takes off despite some of the initial problems.

rassler;1372008 wrote:Why not? I think it is a great idea. It will give the general public a chance to actually follow the teams and the tournament. Having two mats running at the same time takes away from each dual. Plus planning specific start times is a huge bonus for the general public. May not mean much in the first round since it looks like a lot of one sided match ups but as the tournament progresses it will even make it better. It really is no different than the hs basketball teams playing their JV games at 6:00 and following them with the Varsity game about 20 minutes after its conclussion.

I agree with your comments. It's great for fans to get to watch 2 dual meets rather than trying to watch 2 mats wrestling at once. 1 night of the kids getting home at 10pm won't hurt most kids. Many of them would be watching TV or gaming if not traveling home from the meet. We need all the help we can get in Central Ohio, attracting more fans to our sport. I'd love to see these gyms full of school support!

Formats and schedules may attract the fringe fan but in the end wrestling is not for everyone. I love duals. I love team competition in conferences. I love the State dual championships. In the end the same fans of wrestling will be the ones who make this sport what it is.

There's not going to be some rush of new fans over the next 10 years no matter what is addressed. It's O.K. The sport will remain great. It will remain an institution in my house. I love the purity of it athletically. I'm glad it's not turning fad glitzy. It's wrestling and it's exactly how I like it.

Very well said! We really do need a central media hot spot where as much information as possible is posted and updated on a regular basis! A perfect example is you trying to find out what time the Pick. Central Lancaster match started, last week! I tried to find results from the Lancaster Pick. North match, last week and could find nothing posted, anywhere! I just wanted to see how they matched up at each weight and the final dual score. No luck. Information is such an important thing for us to grow the success of this sport in Central Ohio. Cruizer is doing a great job in helping - especially posting his video's.

Con_Alma;1372353 wrote:Formats and schedules may attract the fringe fan but in the end wrestling is not for everyone. I love duals. I love team competition in conferences. I love the State dual championships. In the end the same fans of wrestling will be the ones who make this sport what it is.

There's not going to be some rush of new fans over the next 10 years no matter what is addressed. It's O.K. The sport will remain great. It will remain an institution in my house. I love the purity of it athletically. I'm glad it's not turning fad glitzy. It's wrestling and it's exactly how I like it.

Right there! You said it all brother! It's wrestling. It's never going to be mainstream or "status qua"! People think were nuts and will never understand! Two guys just pushing each other and beating the Crap out of each other. They don't understand why we do it, unless they too have done it and had that passion for it! That feeling you get when you and a guy just totally destroy each other and leave it all on the mat. When your hand is raised after 6 long hard fought minutes of glory, or if your hand isn't raised and it eats at you so bad that you pour your whole heart and soul, blood sweat and tears into it just so that the next time you can be the victor and have your hand raised! It is addicting! It is a way of life for us that basketball players, or one sport athletes, or baseball players, or a lot of people will never understand! Until you yourself do it, or have a son that does it and you see how much of a passion it is for him! It is the best sport in the world! No matter what if it gets huge with the general public or not, I will always love this sport more than I love everything except my kids, my Corps, and the lord above!

iGranby;1372280 wrote:I gotchya. No hate or disrespect intended on my end or anything, I'm not even affiliated with either team, other than when I was in my novice days, just a fan of debate & discussion as well. haha.

I like Hogue to win at 26, Scott is no slouch though.
Lancia's safest bet in my mind would lye in Yarger, witch in no way is really "safe". Mind you he was a district semi-finalist last season, even though he isn't exactly having an amazing year thus far. Bounarant is very athletic, and talented, that can be said for almost all of Allen's team though. Regardless, I dont think Lancia is going to pin either of them.

The real question is the Sophomore Lieb and Freshman Terry. I've seen them both, I give the advantage on the mat to Lieb, on their feet to Terry.

Central is tough from 106-126 and 145-170 especially. Solid all the way through besides a hole or two that could hurt them in a dual format if they go farther in the state duals. I don't know much about the Watkins line up besides the studs that have been mentioned in the previous posts. Terry gets better and better every match being a freshman and being in the practice room with Allen. Hogue, Piecynski, Yarger, Bondurant, and Sunkle all have experience at the district level and have all won matches at that level. I think it will be a close dual, but I believe that Central has a better lineup all the way through and will win the match. Watkins is a young and upcoming team that will be interesting to watch for the next couple years.

Westland and GroveCity already wrestled this year at the Westland Duals. Grove City won, but it was closer than the score refected.

Tjones85;1372607 wrote:Westland and GroveCity already wrestled this year at the Westland Duals. Grove City won, but it was closer than the score refected.

i will stick with my call for an upset and say westland wins by a few points here.

Darby is hosting tonight and will run 2 mats simultaneously.

that is not what the backets asy to do at pickerington central ,i was told we have one mat and then the other dual will start 20 min after the 1st

why did lancaster drop out

theviking;1372918 wrote:that is not what the backets asy to do at pickerington central ,i was told we have one mat and then the other dual will start 20 min after the 1st

why did lancaster drop out

just read the rules more closely. they say when two "rounds" (not "duals") are held at a location they must be split by 20 min. but in darby's case, both the duals being wrestled tonight are the same round, so that should be fine. http://www.ohsaa.org/sports/wr/boys/wrrglts-team.pdf I guess if other teams aren't doing that it's because the person who made up the brackets didn't understand the rules or simply decided running one after the other would make for a better show.

Darby started the same time as us and I believe they were done wrestling by the time we got to 152 - and we started at 106

nykc;1373604 wrote:Darby started the same time as us and I believe they were done wrestling by the time we got to 152 - and we started at 106

Thats what happens when there is nothing but pins and FFs in every match but 2.

You guys look tough. Should be a dandy next week with some good matchups!

I am looking forward to it as well. Going to be two tough squads battling it out.

Really looking forward to a possible Ackley/Valenti match-up

That would be a good one!