So with Mattis and General Kelly out the door...McMaster and Gary Cohn long gone all the adults have left. 

And Trump - credit where it is due- realizes he blew it appointing Powell to the Fed. 

2019 is gonna be a wild ride. 

https://twitter.com/rob_bennett/status/1075976638142259200?s=20

pretry much how I feel about the border wall 

posted by geeblock

https://twitter.com/rob_bennett/status/1075976638142259200?s=20

pretry much how I feel about the border wall 

Well, he's right in a general sort of way.

Where I disagree with him is that only one side needs to "get a grip" and to stop empty promises. There would never be an ex-dem or ex-pub if both sides weren't equally guilty of everything.

posted by BoatShoes

So with Mattis and General Kelly out the door...McMaster and Gary Cohn long gone all the adults have left. 

 

Agreed!

posted by QuakerOats

 

 

And now on to the spending bill and border/national security.  Glad Donald is sticking to his guns today; hopefully The People will actually win, instead of The Swamp..

What the hell happened to Mexico paying for the wall?  Wasn't that his entire mantra for about 2 years on the campaign trail?  

Is there actually any evidence that a border wall will take care of all these supposed "bad ombres" currently pouring into our country?  Call me crazy, but is it even imaginable that Ricardo the Rapist and Diaz the Drug Dealer will find other ways in?  I mean these guys are apparently so raging to get in and harm our women and children, and there are so many of them.  Do we actually think a wall is going to keep them out?  That wall in China turned out to be a bust.

posted by Dr Winston O'Boogie

What the hell happened to Mexico paying for the wall?  Wasn't that his entire mantra for about 2 years on the campaign trail?  

 

Is there actually any evidence that a border wall will take care of all these supposed "bad ombres" currently pouring into our country?  Call me crazy, but is it even imaginable that Ricardo the Rapist and Diaz the Drug Dealer will find other ways in?  I mean these guys are apparently so raging to get in and harm our women and children, and there are so many of them.  Do we actually think a wall is going to keep them out?  That wall in China turned out to be a bust.

Same thing as "getting to keep your doctor", huh?

As for the wall......just a few years ago Shumar and others wanted to pass legislation where a border wall was paid for.  $5 billion is a drop in the bucket in regards to federal spending.  Just build the damn thing.  The benefits far out way the damage.

posted by geeblock

https://twitter.com/rob_bennett/status/1075976638142259200?s=20

pretry much how I feel about the border wall 

Generally, I feel the same way, as well.  The campaign was practically built on the mantra that we were going to build a wall, and Mexico was going to pay for it.

Now, we're getting ready to "shut down the government" (which is a dumb thing to call it) over paying for the wall ourselves.
 

posted by CenterBHSFan

Well, he's right in a general sort of way.

Where I disagree with him is that only one side needs to "get a grip" and to stop empty promises.

Agreed.

Obama:

• If you like your plan/policy/doctor, you can keep it. - Wasn't able to do that.
• Promised to end ME wars and bring troops home. - Troops are still there after his two terms. Nothing ended.
• Claimed he had ALREADY ordered the closing of Guantanamo Bay. - Still open.
• Promised to make government more transparent. - Mass illegal surveillance uncovered during his administration.
• Promised to move toward a decrease in nuclear armament. - Number of neclear weapons increased to the cost of over $1T.

Trump:

• Promised to get a wall built, with Mexico paying for it. - Now, he's just going to make us pay for it.
• Promised to prioritize a "full repeal" of the ACA. - Since then, he's just wanted it replaced.
• Promised the never infringe on the right of people to keep and bear arms. - Moves on a ban on bumpstocks.
• Promised to pursue legal action against Clinton. - Actually came out and said "we don't care about that," and "that played great during the campaign."

More than anything else, it sounds like the voting public is the party that most needs to get its shit together by not voting for this shit anymore.  Fat chance of that actually happening, though.

posted by Spock $5 billion is a drop in the bucket in regards to federal spending.  Just build the damn thing.  The benefits far out way the damage.

Not a huge fan of this logic. My wife and I counsel a couple who have been bad with money. One of the most important points that we repeat is that we aren't in better financial shape than they are because of anything big, it's because we consistently make smart $5 and $10 decisions. I would far prefer my share of that $5 billion be in my pocket. That would be a smart decision on "small" amounts of money.

Man, Trump's stock market (he took credit for it when it was high, so it is his when it goes low), is down for the year. It was the worst year in a decade, so thanks Trump. 

Also, shutting down part of the government for a $5 billion wall is so fucking stupid. If it passes, Republicans cannot say jack shit anymore about the federal debt. 

posted by ptown_trojans_1

Man, Trump's stock market (he took credit for it when it was high, so it is his when it goes low), is down for the year. It was the worst year in a decade, so thanks Trump. 

Also, shutting down part of the government for a $5 billion wall is so fucking stupid. If it passes, Republicans cannot say jack shit anymore about the federal debt. 

Let me type out Spock’s response for him: “stocks we’re down when obama was presedent too!”

posted by friendfromlowry

Let me type out Spock’s response for him: “stocks we’re down when obama was presedent too!”

Got the bad grammar and everything. Spot on.  

posted by Spock

Same thing as "getting to keep your doctor", huh?

 

As for the wall......just a few years ago Shumar and others wanted to pass legislation where a border wall was paid for.  $5 billion is a drop in the bucket in regards to federal spending.  Just build the damn thing.  The benefits far out way the damage.

Obama isn’t president. So what about Mexico paying. It was the cheerleading focus of all his rallies.  

Research your our point about Schumer a little. What you’re saying is not true. Regardless, this was Trump’s promise. 

posted by Dr Winston O'Boogie

Obama isn’t president. So what about Mexico paying. It was the cheerleading focus of all his rallies.  

 

Research your our point about Schumer a little. What you’re saying is not true. Regardless, this was Trump’s promise. 

No one would disagree.  The wall is a Trump promise.  Most of the country is for this.  History will write this chapter as a loss for the Dems.  

posted by Dr Winston O'Boogie

Research your our point about Schumer a little. What you’re saying is not true. Regardless, this was Trump’s promise. 

Perhaps you can share your own research...."wanted" a "wall" may not be 100% accurate if we're playing semantics, but he voted for additional border fencing.

https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2017/apr/23/mick-mulvaney/fact-check-did-top-democrats-vote-border-wall-2006/

LOL at the equivocations and qualifications Politifact makes to declare that statement "half-true".

posted by Spock

No one would disagree.  The wall is a Trump promise.  Most of the country is for this.  History will write this chapter as a loss for the Dems.  

The wall ... paid for by Mexico ... was a Trump promise.

Why are you ignoring the bolded part?

And history will write this chapter as a loss for everybody in America.  Not just the Democrats.

posted by Spock

No one would disagree.  The wall is a Trump promise.  Most of the country is for this.  History will write this chapter as a loss for the Dems.  

Keep telling yourself that.  I and most Americans don't want to pay for his fucking wall. I dont want to waste $5 billion on a boondoggle of a project. 

Now, if we want to look at cheaper, more tech savvy and realistic options, then we can talk. But, $5 billion, fuck no. 

I don't care about the wall myself. There's a vid I saw last year where people south of the border, when asked about it, said they were good climbers and dug really good tunnels. A wall might stop one way but not another way. However, to act as if spending $5 billion on something stupid is a deciding factor? Yeah, it's a huge amount of money to us but people in DC throw that around like its Monopoly money. And on worse things. We've have threads about useless and wasteful spending a multitude of times over the years. It all comes down to how each of us would rather have that money spent in different ways. 

https://www.cnsnews.com/mrctv-blog/curtis-kalin/top-20-worst-ways-government-wasted-your-tax-dollars

https://www.forbes.com/pictures/ejde45i/175-million-on-an-unused-monkey-house-and-other-structures/#129c24ab7d95

https://www.businessinsider.com/government-wastes-money-2010-12

The list above is from various years and from different leaning sites and those were only the top three listed when I did a google search. Those are just the "outside of normal" whacky. The normal whacky spending is worse than that and we all know it. But we really need to just admit that people in DC fart 5 billion out on their lunch break. 

posted by ptown_trojans_1

Keep telling yourself that.  I and most Americans don't want to pay for his fucking wall. I dont want to waste $5 billion on a boondoggle of a project. 

Now, if we want to look at cheaper, more tech savvy and realistic options, then we can talk. But, $5 billion, fuck no. 

oh shit......someone in DC all of a sudden cares about other peoples money???  GTFOH.  The national debt is what?  We spend billions weekly over seas trying to nation build and you dont have a problem with that do you?  At least this money is nation building at home.

Speaking of the wall, I must admit that this surprises me: 

https://twitter.com/Ocasio2018/status/1076509651104133122

Next time we have a gov shutdown, Congressional salaries should be furloughed as well. It’s completely unacceptable that members of Congress can force a government shutdown on partisan lines & then have Congressional salaries exempt from that decision. Have some integrity.

https://www.breitbart.com/video/2018/12/22/schumer-trump-running-undoubtedly-the-most-chaotic-presidency-ever/

Good I am glad that Shumar thinks that its crazy.......more like its "needed".

posted by Spock

oh shit......someone in DC all of a sudden cares about other peoples money???  GTFOH.  The national debt is what?  We spend billions weekly over seas trying to nation build and you dont have a problem with that do you?  At least this money is nation building at home.

Shit man. If we want to spend $5 billion how about we spend it on the following

New roads, water infrastructure, power grid, the VA and numerous others long term needs. 

Or, we could maybe slightly the border security more and not spend more money we honestly do not have. Again, if the Republicans vote for this wall, they can not lecture Ds anymore about fiscal responsibility. 

posted by Spock

https://www.breitbart.com/video/2018/12/22/schumer-trump-running-undoubtedly-the-most-chaotic-presidency-ever/

 

Good I am glad that Shumar thinks that its crazy.......more like its "needed".

I get crazy and chaotic, shaking things up ok. 

But, is there anything Trump has said or done that would suggest he knows how to fix and stop the chaos?

Chaos only works when there is a return to a new normal. What is that new normal? 

Trump is just breaking shit without any plan to put it back together. 

posted by ptown_trojans_1

Shit man. If we want to spend $5 billion how about we spend it on the following

New roads, water infrastructure, power grid, the VA and numerous others long term needs.

Or how about we cut $100B from defense, do all the above and have money left over?

posted by gut

Or how about we cut $100B from defense, do all the above and have money left over?

There are many areas to cut, so sure.