And call me crazy, but without a doubt I think Shaq was more athletic than Howard (ever has been) while he was in Orlando. He was waaaaay more smooth than Howard. His footwork put Howard's to shame. I call that stuff athletism. He made leading a fast break look very impressive for a true 7ft'er. Did he ever put a sticker high up on a backboard? Not that I know of. Do I think he could? Without a doubt. When they did tests to measure athletic ability, Shaq's were better at the NBA combine.

Shaq in the McDonalds All-American game. The Crowd and Annoucers go crazy!

jpake1 wrote: And call me crazy, but without a doubt I think Shaq was more athletic than Howard (ever has been) while he was in Orlando. He was waaaaay more smooth than Howard. His footwork put Howard's to shame. I call that stuff athletism. He made leading a fast break look very impressive for a true 7ft'er. Did he ever put a sticker high up on a backboard? Not that I know of. Do I think he could? Without a doubt. When they did tests to measure athletic ability, Shaq's were better at the NBA combine.

Well, I disagree obviously.

But as far as the combine goes, you have to remember that Howard was 17-18 when he was tested that way too...Shaq was a few years older. Those years make a big difference in a young mans life.

But regardless, my main argument on the athleticism thing is from top to bottom in the league anyways--not really at the top. There have been incredible athletes in every era. Although I do stand by what I said about Howard being more athletic than Shaq.

I know Shaq was two years older, but that's kind of a tough shit sorta thing. Shaq was also 63lbs heavier than Howard and still put up better numbers; including the vertical leap.

I think the league is more athletic now than it ever has been. I think the league is deeper than it ever has been. However, if you give me a 8 man rotation from any era, I wouldn't be putting my money on this era. Not a knock on them, just not quite yet deserving IMO.

That's fine. They certainly have more to accomplish.

But if I can make an 8 man rotation from this era, you ain't beating me.

J Kidd
Kobe
LeBron
Melo
Shaq
Howard
Wade
Duncan

I mean, I get that other eras have some strong 8 man units. But IMO, they'd run any other era off the floor--wouldn't be that close.

jackass? really? relax, man.

Not my fault you post stupid shit.

1980s:
Magic
Bird
Olajuwon
Jordan
Thomas
Wilkins
Kareem
Dr. J

80s Era 107, Current Era 92

1990s:
Hill
Jordan
Stockton
Payton
Pippen
Shaq
Malone
Ewing

Maybe a little closer but..... 90s 98, Current Era 92

You have Hakeem on the 80's team and not the 90's team? LOL

And I'll take the current 8 over those two all day long. The 80's is better than the 90's though.

haha i would like to see Dennis Rodman play today. man all the whining from todays players that would go on.

Dennis Rodman would be exactly what he was when he played. GREAT rebounder (best ever maybe), above average defender, nothing more than an average all around player.

PG Magic Johnson/ Isiah Thomas
SG Michael Jordan/ Clyde Drexler
SF Larry Bird/
PF Karl Malone/ Moses Malone
C Hakeem Olajuwon/
* I think this is the team that would beat this era. It would be real close. I just can't pick against that team.

PG John Stockton
SG Michael Jordan/ Reggie Miller
SF Scottie Pippen/ Grant Hill
PF Karl Malone
C Shaquille O'neal/ Hakeem Olajuwon
* I'm 50/50 on if this team would win a series against the guys now. I absolutely love the 2-5, I just don't know about John Stockton.

I hope they play those games in Heaven each week when I get up there.

PG: Kidd/Nash/CP3
SG: Bryant/Wade
SF: James/Melo
PF: Ducan
C: Shaq/Howard

I would throw Durant in that roster in a year or two.

devil1197 wrote: PG: Kidd/Nash/CP3
SG: Bryant/Wade
SF: James/Melo
PF: Ducan
C: Shaq/Howard

I would throw Durant in that roster in a year or two.

I'd throw him in now but we're talking 8 man rotations--not 10 like you listed. The deeper you go the bigger the advantage gets for the new era.

jpake1 wrote: PG Magic Johnson/ Isiah Thomas
SG Michael Jordan/ Clyde Drexler
SF Larry Bird/
PF Karl Malone/ Moses Malone
C Hakeem Olajuwon/
* I think this is the team that would beat this era. It would be real close. I just can't pick against that team.

PG John Stockton
SG Michael Jordan/ Reggie Miller
SF Scottie Pippen/ Grant Hill
PF Karl Malone
C Shaquille O'neal/ Hakeem Olajuwon
* I'm 50/50 on if this team would win a series against the guys now. I absolutely love the 2-5, I just don't know about John Stockton.

I hope they play those games in Heaven each week when I get up there.

Just for fun..

80's:

Magic/Isiah vs. Jason Kidd--advantage 80's, depth mainly but JKidd could hold his own. Especially because in an actual matchup, I doubt he would guard Magic.

MJ/Clyde vs. Kobe/Wade--push. Jordan is the best player but neither Kobe nor Wade is THAT far behind him and they're both better than Drexler. I want to go advantage new guys here, but Jordan deserves that respect.

Bird vs. LeBron/Melo--advantage new guys. Big time, and I love Larry Bird but I feel like this is probably the biggest advantage either team would have.

Karl/Moses vs. Ducan--advantage new guys, reason being is the depth for the new guys here is either LeBron or Melo. But this one is really close.

Hakeem vs. Shaq/Howard--advantage new guys.


90's:

Stockton vs. Kidd--advantage Kidd.

Jordan/Reggie vs. Kobe/Wade--push. Same way I feel about the 80's.

Pippen/Hill vs. LeBron/Melo--advantage new guys...big. I love Pippen and you know Grant Hill is one of my all time favorite NBA players--was my favorite in the 90's. But this isn't close at all IMO.

Malone vs. Duncan--advantage new guys. Like I said before, the sub for Duncan would be LeBron or Melo--not good for Karl Malone. That's what stopped me from saying push--even though I think Duncan is the best PF ever and not Malone, the match up of them one on one is pretty close.

Shaq/Hakeem vs. Shaq/Howard--advantage 90's.


Of course, there are more match ups to consider because we all know how a normal game would go--and some of the players present match up problems that would create different lineups (like Magic running the point--the new guys would clearly put LeBron at Point and Melo or Kobe at the 3 IMO), but I think the new era is better than any before it.

And to further that, I don't think you can go back further than the 80's and still even have a discussion about. I love Wilt and Kareem, but Shaq would have destroyed those guys. People just weren't that big and strong back then. And who from back that far is going to check LeBron, Wade, Melo or Kobe on the perimeter? NO ONE.

^^ I would take Stockton over Kidd any day of the week. Better scorer, both were/are great passers, but Stockton is a better overall player imo.

Back to the original topic, those Bulls teams that Jordan played on certainly could have won multiple championships in the past decade, no doubt about it. Some teams could have stood their ground with them for sure people forget how good those Bulls teams really were from top to bottom.

And SQ, it brings a big smile to my face that Grant Hill is one of your favorite players. I loved him when he was a Piston (still do now) and felt so bad that he couldn't stay healthy in Orlando.

KnightXC1 wrote: ^^ I would take Stockton over Kidd any day of the week. Better scorer, both were/are great passers, but Stockton is a better overall player imo.

Back to the original topic, those Bulls teams that Jordan played on certainly could have won multiple championships in the past decade, no doubt about it. Some teams could have stood their ground with them for sure people forget how good those Bulls teams really were from top to bottom.

And SQ, it brings a big smile to my face that Grant Hill is one of your favorite players. I loved him when he was a Piston (still do now) and felt so bad that he couldn't stay healthy in Orlando.

I understand taking Stockton as the better player--I have no argument against that. But matched up against each other? I think you're crazy. Remember, we're assuming all players on the list are being considered when they're at their best in their given era. Jason Kidd had a few years where he was just out of this world.

You probably love the fact that I used to walk in to the Gund every year with this jersey on too:



Haha, not anymore. Got to see my favorite player play in Cleveland--then he got his top spot taken and I got to sit in the same arena and watch my new favorite player single handedly destroy the Pistons dynasty.

Magic/Isiah vs. Jason Kidd-- advantage 80's BIIIG TIME. Give me Showtime any day of the week and twice on Sunday over Jason Kidd. I would take Isiah over Kidd any day of the week.

MJ/Clyde vs. Kobe/Wade--advantage 80's. New era has better depth, but a backup could only play so many minutes in a game. Give me Jordan for 39M and the Glyde for 9 and I take them over Kobe/Wade every single time.

Bird vs. LeBron/Melo--advantage new era. Give me Bird over Melo any day of the week, but as great as Bird was, I gotta take LBJ every day. About the same difference between the SG matchups.

Karl/Moses vs. Ducan--push. I think it's very close between Duncan and Karl. I'd usually give it to Duncan because of rings, but this is purely from a talent level so its too close to call. The new era guys could play very talented players here, but out of position. I think it would be a mismatch in both directions. Karl/Moses would struggle guarding LBJ, but LBJ would struggle guarding the true PF's.

Hakeem vs. Shaq/Howard--advantage new guys. I think Shaq has had the better career, but Hakeem gave O'neal fits when they matched up. If I started a team, I'd probably pick Shaq. Howard is very nice depth, but I think Hakeem would have him sitting on the bench with fouls early.

I just have to go with the 80's because of Magic being able to control tempo better and them having the best player on the court. Plus I like their ability to hit the jumper better.

I probably would take the new era guys over the 90's because of the gap at SF. Pippen is great, but he couldn't score with LBJ if he needed to.

So if they adjust things to match up with that 80's team and this is the matchup, who do you take?

Magic vs. LeBron (this is what they would do I would think--and not only does this eliminate the mismatch of size--but there is no way Magic can handle LeBron's speed. LeBron's the best PG in the NBA right now anyways and he doesn't even play there lol)
Jordan vs. Kobe
Bird vs. Melo
Malone vs. Duncan
Hakeem vs. Shaq

All I have to say is I'd take out a loan to buy tickets to that one...

I think it is unrealistic to believe that Kidd would guard Magic.

LeBron is basically Cleveland's PG so...

PG: LeBron
SG: Kobe
SF: Melo
PF: Ducan
C: Shaq

And as much as I love Duncan. With that group (LeBron at the 1), I'd strongly consider moving Melo to the 4 and playing Durant at the 3. They'd score so many points and they'd dominate on the break.

i think its funny shaq doent make anyone's 90s team...interesting.

Glory Days wrote: i think its funny shaq doent make anyone's 90s team...interesting.

I think it's funny that you said that because Shaq made everyone's 90's team.

SQ_Crazies wrote:

Glory Days wrote: i think its funny shaq doent make anyone's 90s team...interesting.

I think it's funny that you said that because Shaq made everyone's 90's team.

Indeed i was wrong....do you think "Shaq vs" could do 90s Shaq vs 00s Shaq?

Shaq 00 was way more dominant, not even close imo.