Commander of Awesome;1868776 wrote:That is not true, not sure why you're being so aggressive about it. IT can't shoot, can't defend, and can't play in the post season. He was only in the trade bc of salary and Celtics willing to get rid of him. He'll chew up some reg season minutes only.

Yeah, totally.

29 ppg, top 15 player in the NBA last year. But yeah, he's just here to eat up regular season minutes.

LOL

SportsAndLady;1868777 wrote:Yeah, totally.

29 ppg, top 15 player in the NBA last year. But yeah, he's just here to eat up regular season minutes.

LOL

He is not a top 15 player. If 100% healthy, he would have close to no trade market.

IT shot like 1% lower than Kyrie from distance. Neither can defend. IT is worse, but fuck at least he tries. He had a PER higher than Kyrie. He won't take awful shots out of rythym. He has no size, which hurts, if they meet the GSW. But damn, people act like Kyrie was second coming of LBJ. He is great, but not that great. This trade doesn't hurt Cavs at all, if Thomas is healthy.

Commander of Awesome;1868776 wrote:That is not true, not sure why you're being so aggressive about it. IT can't shoot, can't defend, and can't play in the post season. He was only in the trade bc of salary and Celtics willing to get rid of him. He'll chew up some reg season minutes only.

Lol at you calling someone aggressive. Weren't you shitting on him for averaging 0.1 less APG than Kyrie.

Commander of Awesome;1868779 wrote:He is not a top 15 player. If 100% healthy, he would have close to no trade market.

Read what I said, top 15 player in the NBA LAST SEASON. That's not debatable. He had a great year.

Also, no trade value? He was just traded for Kyrie Irving lol.

SportsAndLady;1868786 wrote:Also, no trade value? He was just traded for Kyrie Irving lol.

Not in my opinion. He was a throw in to match salary. Just you guys wait until you're watching him all season.

Woj says Cavs are asking for more compensation.

Commander of Awesome;1868776 wrote:That is not true, not sure why you're being so aggressive about it. IT can't shoot, can't defend, and can't play in the post season. He was only in the trade bc of salary and Celtics willing to get rid of him. He'll chew up some reg season minutes only.

5'9 players don't average 29 pts and 46% from the field by being bad shooters.

kizer permanente;1868799 wrote:5'9 players don't average 29 pts and 46% from the field by being bad shooters.

I disagree--a guy can be a 'bad' shooter yet still be an excellent scorer

vball10set;1868839 wrote:I disagree--a guy can be a 'bad' shooter yet still be an excellent scorer

When they're 5'9 in the NBA ?

I disagree with COA and S&L. The pick is the highlight of the deal, because if gives them a lot of flexibility. They can trade it for a star to compete with the Warriors and make Lebron stay, or they can use the pick for the rebuild if Lebron leaves.

As for IT, you can go back to the old Cavs thread and find out it is not secret I am a certified IT hater just as much as COA, but if you say IT was just a "throw in" for that trade, then you are wearing some thick hater lenses. The Cavs wanted somebody that could help Lebron compete now, and IT can do that (along with Crowder). He isn't as good as Kyrie, but he at least has proven to score with a bunch of role players. Whenever Lebron didn't play or left the court, it seemed about 90% of the time Kyrie couldn't prevent any team from going on a run.

Now that IT is for sure damaged goods, I don't do the trade without the Celtics offering more. If IT recovers well, then it is a bonus. Also, I just received a notification from a Woj report, that the Cavs and Celtics are damaging IT's value. LOL. I didn't realize the Cavs bashed IT with a sledgehammer and tricked the Celtics into trading him.

like_that;1868852 wrote:I disagree with COA and S&L. The pick is the highlight of the deal, because if gives them a lot of flexibility. They can trade it for a star to compete with the Warriors and make Lebron stay, or they can use the pick for the rebuild if Lebron leaves.

As for IT, you can go back to the old Cavs thread and find out it is not secret I am a certified IT hater just as much as COA, but if you say IT was just a "throw in" for that trade, then you are wearing some thick hater lenses. The Cavs wanted somebody that could help Lebron compete now, and IT can do that (along with Crowder). He isn't as good as Kyrie, but he at least has proven to score with a bunch of role players. Whenever Lebron didn't play or left the court, it seemed about 90% of the time Kyrie couldn't prevent any team from going on a run.

Now that IT is for sure damaged goods, I don't do the trade without the Celtics offering more. If IT recovers well, then it is a bonus. Also, I just received a notification from a Woj report, that the Cavs and Celtics are damaging IT's value. LOL. I didn't realize the Cavs bashed IT with a sledgehammer and tricked the Celtics into trading him.

Your first paragraph: I actually said in my post an argument could be made the pick is the most valuable asset they received.

I look at it this way, in the short term, IT was the most valuable asset. In the long term, it's the Nets pick.

SportsAndLady;1868858 wrote:Your first paragraph: I actually said in my post an argument could be made the pick is the most valuable asset they received.

I look at it this way, in the short term, IT was the most valuable asset. In the long term, it's the Nets pick.

I look at it as the pick could also be the most valuable asset short term as well.

like_that;1868861 wrote:I look at it as the pick could also be the most valuable asset short term as well.

We're on the same page:

SportsAndLady;1868338 wrote:Really the Nets pick is what makes this a good deal for the cavs. Especially if it's the #1 overall.

Lebron leaves, draft Bagley and rebuild around him. Lebron stays, send that pick to a team who's about to lose their star player (like a Davis).

SportsAndLady;1868868 wrote:We're on the same page:

Then I only disagree with COA lol.

like_that;1868875 wrote:Then I only disagree with COA lol.

That's fine, I have no problem being the correct person on an island. S&L's history of sports hot taeks is pretty bad, so you want to align with that, all good!

Commander of Awesome;1868877 wrote:That's fine, I have no problem being the correct person on an island. S&L's history of sports hot taeks is pretty bad, so you want to align with that, all good!

Lol, you just said Isaiah Thomas was a throw in, and I'm the hot takes guy?

SportsAndLady;1868884 wrote:Lol, you just said Isaiah Thomas was a throw in, and I'm the hot takes guy?

My point about him being a throw in is that he's a net negative player who can't play in the playoffs, and his skill set doesn't compliment this team. Outside of some off the bench scoring, he can't help this team.

Def - LEGITIMATELY the WORST defender in the nba. Can't log major minutes in the playoffs with that. Not he's fault, he's fucking 5'9".

Shooting - Not a good shooter. Relies on quickness, holding the ball that is never called for some reason, to blow by defenders. Should also note, that coming off of a very major injury (hip), I expect his quickness to be worse.

Passer - not an elite passer, doesnt set up teammates at an above avg level.

Comparing to Derrick Rose, I don't see anything he does better outside of maybe 3 pt shooting.

I think you guys are being clouded by his scoring numbers last season. Scoring on a team that was set up for him to score and could hide his defense with great defensive talent around him.

By this logic, yes he is a throw in who I don't think will see major minutes on the Cavs. I'd be pretty surprised if he played more than 20 min a game (barring injury) in the playoffs against a good team.

Laley23;1868782 wrote:IT shot like 1% lower than Kyrie from distance. Neither can defend. IT is worse, but fuck at least he tries. He had a PER higher than Kyrie. He won't take awful shots out of rythym. He has no size, which hurts, if they meet the GSW. But damn, people act like Kyrie was second coming of LBJ. He is great, but not that great. This trade doesn't hurt Cavs at all, if Thomas is healthy.

Yeah, seems people forget that when Lebron was on the bench against GSW, Kyrie sure as fuck couldn't do shit. He's a really good player, but by no means a game-changing force of nature.

Commander of Awesome;1868877 wrote:That's fine, I have no problem being the correct person on an island. S&L's history of sports hot taeks is pretty bad, so you want to align with that, all good!

Ok sleeper.

Cabs will ask for Tatum or jaylon Brown.

ernest_t_bass;1868945 wrote:Cabs will ask for Tatum or Bell. Not Tatum Bell.

Who's Bell?

friendfromlowry;1868946 wrote:Who's Bell?

I'm retarded. My parents should be ashamed.

ernest_t_bass;1868945 wrote:Cabs will ask for Tatum or jaylon Brown.

They can ask all they want, they wont get either.

I think either trade goes through as is, the trade is rescinded and the Cavs trade Kyrie later (probably for a worse deal bc Cleveland), or MAYBE cavs get an extra pick of some kind that probably isn't that great. Like swapping 1sts or getting a 2nd rounder.