SportsAndLady;1768038 wrote:God damnit. Two mid level prospects for the (arguably) best closer in baseball? Fuck!

But yeah I didn't realize he was leaving after this year so might as well get something.

My biggest hate is that he is a spectacle to see. He can throw like no one else can on the planet. Reds are going to suck regardless. I like to go to GABP sit close and watch the spectacle with my son.

They get rid of those I want them to keep and keep the guys that mean nothing to me. Bye bye Todd.

Ironman92;1768072 wrote:My biggest hate is that he is a spectacle to see. He can throw like no one else can on the planet. Reds are going to suck regardless. I like to go to GABP sit close and watch the spectacle with my son.

They get rid of those I want them to keep and keep the guys that mean nothing to me. Bye bye Todd.

It's true that he's a spectacle to watch. But how often is he going to get into a game when the offense can't score and the starters are giving up 4-5 runs a game? So they're paying him a shit load to come in every few days just to keep from being rusty and save the occasional game the rest of the team doesn't fuck up. Then at the end of the season, he's gone to free agency. So you have to get rid of him now and try to get something for him to help with the future.

Deal unconfirmed.

Rumors swirling that other teams are involved. Mark Sheldon just Tweeted there is no deal and other teams are still inquiring.

This deal doesn't make a ton of sense. The Reds price on Chapman was sky high in July. Now they sell so low? Also, the Dodgers have had some problems with personalities. Kenley Jansen was a top 5 closer in MLB, he's under team control and is only 28. To bring in Chapman, when they have some other issues, makes sense in a "acquire tons of talent" regard, but it doesn't fix the potential conflict there.

Jayson Stark ‏@jaysonst 1m1 minute ago Not sure what to make of this. But Reds telling teams they haven't yet agreed to trade Aroldis Chapman to LA. I don't think Dodgers agree

sherm03;1768083 wrote:It's true that he's a spectacle to watch. But how often is he going to get into a game when the offense can't score and the starters are giving up 4-5 runs a game? So they're paying him a shit load to come in every few days just to keep from being rusty and save the occasional game the rest of the team doesn't fuck up. Then at the end of the season, he's gone to free agency. So you have to get rid of him now and try to get something for him to help with the future.

I understand every ounce of that. I don't trust the Reds to develop anything that wins the World Series as long as Jocketty is in charge of stuff...Price is well over his head as well.

I don't want to lose Chapman....simply do not care about the money. Ridiculous to never try him starting.

Dodgers don't agree because this story has come out. While the lack of injuries and even redness make me believe more of Chapman's side of the story...anyone who fires a gun 8 times in their garage because they are pissed is probably going to fuck up sooner rather than later. Looks like the Reds won't get anything for him now.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/aroldis-chapman-s-girlfriend-alleged-he--choked--her--according-to-police-report-023629095.html?nf=1

Ironman92;1768150 wrote:I understand every ounce of that. I don't trust the Reds to develop anything that wins the World Series as long as Jocketty is in charge of stuff...Price is well over his head as well.

I don't want to lose Chapman....simply do not care about the money. Ridiculous to never try him starting.

I can't argue with anything there. I think he should have been a starter from way early on. If he had converted, and been fairly effective, then I'd be furious that they aren't trying to keep him. I shudder every time I think about what that 2012 team could have been with Cueto, Latos, and an effective Chapman as the top 3 pitchers in the rotation.

Something is weird.

Yesterday, the Dodgers were saying the deal was done. The Reds were saying it wasn't. The Reds have known about the incident for a month, since it happened. Surely, the Dodgers knew about it at the same time they were saying "it's done", even if they just found out recently.

On one hand, the return for Chapman was crappy, so I'm glad it hasn't been finalized. On the other hand, the Reds will probably just end up giving him away for even less because they aren't competent and appear to be content with just selling everyone off. While I agree with selling, Chapman is one piece they should keep.

Good old Dusty Baker just about offended every race/creed possible at yesterday's winter meetings....

http://espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/14323216/dusty-baker-washington-nationals-defends-aroldis-chapman-backs-mlb-domestic-violence-policy

Then he goes all Jimmy the Greek....

http://www.foxsports.com/mlb/story/dusty-baker-makes-race-sensitive-comments-about-latin-african-american-players-120815

Azubuike24;1768245 wrote:Something is weird.

Yesterday, the Dodgers were saying the deal was done. The Reds were saying it wasn't. The Reds have known about the incident for a month, since it happened. Surely, the Dodgers knew about it at the same time they were saying "it's done", even if they just found out recently.

On one hand, the return for Chapman was crappy, so I'm glad it hasn't been finalized. On the other hand, the Reds will probably just end up giving him away for even less because they aren't competent and appear to be content with just selling everyone off. While I agree with selling, Chapman is one piece they should keep.

We don't even know what the return was

Midstate01;1768393 wrote:We don't even know what the return was

We know it wasn't Seager, Urias, Olivera, or De Leon.

http://www.si.com/mlb/2015/12/09/jason-heyward-free-agent-winter-meetings

Tom Verducci wrote a great article about Heyward and his free agency situation.

WAR says he should be paid like a top 5 player in the league. The eye test tells a different story.

Multiple GM's anonymously said they would be scared to pay him the kind of contract he will get because he doesn't hit well, and his defense will erode as he ages. Yet someone will still end up giving him $175-200 million most likely.

http://espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/14328302/chris-davis-7-year-offer-worth-150m-baltimore-orioles

Baltimore has put 7/150 on the table for Davis, but wants an answer soon or they will move on. Goes against the usual Boras M.O.

He's out of his mind if he passes on that.

Laley23;1768068 wrote:Closers just don't seem to have any value. Somewhat surprising, as you can't really win without one these days.

I think "closer" is more of a mental thing that players need to get over. Sometimes, the most important situation is 2 outs in the 7th with runners on the corner in a 1 run game. Why don't you bring your best reliever/closer in in that situation?

IggyPride00;1768527 wrote:http://www.si.com/mlb/2015/12/09/jason-heyward-free-agent-winter-meetings

Tom Verducci wrote a great article about Heyward and his free agency situation.

WAR says he should be paid like a top 5 player in the league. The eye test tells a different story.

Multiple GM's anonymously said they would be scared to pay him the kind of contract he will get because he doesn't hit well, and his defense will erode as he ages. Yet someone will still end up giving him $175-200 million most likely.

I just disagree. Idk. His defense will erode, but will it go from elite to really good? Or are you expecting it to plummet to "he has to be a DH"? He's 26 so a 10 year will take him to 36. How many guys are getting 8 years at their 30,31,32 age seasons? Contracts that take them into their late 30s/40s. He's not a 30+ HR guy right now, but he could be. 6+ WAR player. Above league average OBP, AVG,OPS+.

He produces runs and prevents runs. Remember, a run saved is a run earned.

Sonofanump;1768501 wrote:We know it wasn't Seager, Urias, Olivera, or De Leon.

So we don't know what the return was...

Or Pederson.

Sure, the value wasn't confirmed, but it wasn't anyone that was MLB ready or close to MLB ready. The Dodgers don't have a top tier farm system either.

AKA, the value wasn't even close to what Kimbrel brought, and arguably, Chapman is better than Kimbrel in every category. The only difference was Chapman is a FA (which lowers his value a bit).

The Reds were getting hosed...as expected.

Hearing talk that Jason Heyward isn't looking for 10 years at $20M/year. More like $24M/year for 8 or 9 years.

Jayson Stark tweeted this this afternoon.

8/$192 or 9/$216 are both a ton of money. Unless he gets it from the Cubs I just don't see what bigger market team is interested in playing on him at that kind of money. I get surprised every year, but it will be a brave GM that inks him to that deal if he gets it.

Not a fan of Heyward. I would be pissed if my team gave him that contract, and in baseball contracts are practically meaningless. But I'd still be pissed.

SportsAndLady;1768762 wrote:Not a fan of Heyward. I would be pissed if my team gave him that contract, and in baseball contracts are practically meaningless. But I'd still be pissed.

I agree, just don't see it with him. Part of why I am fascinated by his situation, because the analytics tell you he should be paid X, but most people look at him and just don't see it.

I think whoever gives him that deal is going hate themselves with a passion in about 3-4 years.

Jon Heyman from CBS reporting that the Nationals are the "mystery team" in on Heyward as well.

Boras has a history of fleecing them, so if they are in on Heyward Brinks is sending multiple trucks already.

Brnging in Heyward though would almost be a defacto way of letting the world know that Harper will be gone when he's up, because if they give Heyward $200+ million then you would have to think $300+ million would be the starting point for any Harper deal.

Can't imagine they would be able to afford that as they would already have 2 $200+ million contracts on the books long term.

I like Heyward and what he brings but that's WAAAAAAYYY too much.

Contracts have been insane so far. Baseball may not be the most popular or even 2nd...but no doubt MLB is doing great.

The ban of Pete Rose by MLB will remains in place.

http://espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/14365554/pete-rose-remains-banned-major-league-baseball-per-commissioner-rob-manfred-decision

Con_Alma;1769408 wrote:The ban of Pete Rose by MLB will remains in place.

http://espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/14365554/pete-rose-remains-banned-major-league-baseball-per-commissioner-rob-manfred-decision

I'm well past caring anymore. Pretty old stuff.

Giants and Cueto agree on 6/$130 deal.

People thought he was crazy for turning down $120/6, Giants bailed him out.

They ended up getting the Shark and Cueto for not much more than the Dbacks spent on just Grienke. Interesting to see how that all plays out since it is in the division.

Why are the Dodgers sitting on their hands not spending money while their division rivals improve?

Frazier traded to white sox