Footwedge;1742634 wrote:What is...225, 222, 217, 234 and 232? Try the batting averages for the Indians 5 through 9. The cleanup hitter is hittimg 269.

It's time to scour the top prospects of the contenders and blow the whole thing up. Nothing wrong with going 50-112 the next 3 years to rebuild this train wreck. Nobody is untouchable including Brantley, Kluber and Kipnis.

Watching the performances of Santana, Gomes, Swisher, Bourn, Moss et al makes a compelling argument for compensating baseball players with performance based pay only.

Today Moss made an absolute horrible base running blunder. It's a daily occurrence and Francona deserves the blame. These people do not have their heads in the game...you see it every single ball game.

If only they would have traded Kipnis for a middle reliever like you wanted, it could be an entirely different season.

First time Chciago has swept Indians on the road in a while. Will be interested how that affects their trade deadline decisions.

Footwedge;1742634 wrote:Nothing wrong with going 50-112 the next 3 years to rebuild this train wreck.

I would have a problem with that.

slingshot4ever;1742638 wrote:First time Chciago has swept Indians on the road in a while. Will be interested how that affects their trade deadline decisions.

They were in last place coming into this series. They are not buyers, they are sellers. And if they think otherwise, they are making a huge mistake.

My guess is that they will stay put and try to sign Samardzija long term

Al Bundy;1742635 wrote:If only they would have traded Kipnis for a middle reliever like you wanted, it could be an entirely different season.

They should still dump Kipnis...and start over.

Nobody is untouchable including Brantley, Kluber and Kipnis.

Why would you want to trade the guys who are performing with team friendly contracts?

A couple of months ago everybody was clamoring for Francisco Lindor… Well, he's here... Whoop de do!
No doubt there is some serious wheeling and dealing that needs to be done in the off season.

HitsRus;1742709 wrote:Why would you want to trade the guys who are performing with team friendly contracts?

A couple of months ago everybody was clamoring for Francisco Lindor… Well, he's here... Whoop de do!
No doubt there is some serious wheeling and dealing that needs to be done in the off season.

Yep, and providing defense and hitting over .300 in the last 2 weeks. He should've been up sooner.

Laley23;1742716 wrote:Yep, and providing defense and hitting over .300 in the last 2 weeks. He should've been up sooner.

yeah but the only argument you can make is he is getting MLB time in hopes the team turns in around next year. other than that, one player doing good on a last place team is basically a waste when it comes to contract issues etc. which is my understanding of why they didn't rush him.

^^^that was my point.
Nothing has worked out offensively for this team. Ramirez and Chisenhall couldn't even stay in the league. Brandon Moss has not lived up to expectations. Michael Bourn was expected to return to productivity after recovering from injuries. Yan Gomes was expected to be one of the best catchers in the AL.
That's a lot of expectations, but the expectations were not unreasonable.
Those expectations are now heaped on the shoulders of Urshela and Lindor. There is no guarantee they will be better.

i think we've seen Carlos Santana enough to say that what we see is what we have. He has had 2 off seasons to work on beating the shift, and hasn't changed a thing( and some of that is on the organization). Powerful hitters like Miggy Cabrera can hit into the teeth of that shift and still be top league players. Carlos is not that player.

Lindor would be under team control the same amount whether he played all of this year or just part of it. And he was never going to be down in AAA for an entire year longer (ie the date he was called up, but NEXT year). His contract status would not have changed.

What would have changed is what year he is arbitration eligible, and frankly, that doesn't matter. If he lives up to it, he will still be a steal and of not, his arbitration $$$ will be low. Non-issue and a bullshit excuse by the organization.

^^I don't know if that was an actual reason that they kept him down. You did have Jose Ramirez coming off a good second half, and the kid STILL is a little green. Francona himself alluded to that a few days ago. Lindor up or down would have been a non-issue if this team was in first place, or if Ramirez was hitting .280 +. Let's put it this way....he wouldn't have made a difference. This team sucks because the guys I listed above have not been performing up to snuff.

I agree. he wouldn't have made a difference in the season.

I was just responding to you initially saying "whoop-dee-do" to him being up. I was stating that he has been a positive.

http://baseball.realgm.com/wiretap/43238/Blue-Jays-Indians-Nearly-Completed-Carlos-Carrasco-Trade

I would have been pretty pissed.

NEVER TRADE GOOD PITCHING