shook_17
Posts: 3,023
Dec 2, 2014 6:45am
Biggest Browns game to date, Mike Pettiness biggest coaching decision to date. Does Hoyer or Manziel start? I think/hope Manziel gets the nod, help give the team a shot in the arm. Gordon can be his Mike Evans. Colts have the 23rd ranked defense, so we know we need to score touchdowns not field goals. Saw a stat yesterday, in the last 7 games the Browns D has forced 17 turnovers and only converted three into touchdowns, which is unacceptable.
If Manziel starts
Colts 24
Browns 27
if Hoyer starts
Colts 30
Browns 10
If Manziel starts
Colts 24
Browns 27
if Hoyer starts
Colts 30
Browns 10
like_that
Posts: 26,625
Dec 2, 2014 7:13am
I'm gonna sound like br, but I think luck torches the Browns this week. Luck will have all day to throw.
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BR1986FB
Posts: 24,104
Dec 2, 2014 7:40am
Browns are going to have to score more than 27 to win this one. That's why it's probably a good call to start Manziel. We have no idea what he's capable of but we do know what Hoyer's NOT capable of, winning a shootout.....at least this year.
like_that
Posts: 26,625
Dec 2, 2014 8:07am
To be fair, hoyer won us 2 shoot outs and got us close to winning another this year.BR1986FB;1680962 wrote:Browns are going to have to score more than 27 to win this one. That's why it's probably a good call to start Manziel. We have no idea what he's capable of but we do know what Hoyer's NOT capable of, winning a shootout.....at least this year.
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SportsAndLady
Posts: 35,632
Dec 2, 2014 8:09am
No idea what the hells gonna happen
HitsRus
Posts: 9,206
Dec 2, 2014 8:19am
This.....but this season has been fun to watch! So much drama, so many twists and turns. Browns being relevant in December.....it's been so long.SportsAndLady;1680973 wrote:No idea what the hells gonna happen
Ytowngirlinfla
Posts: 2,295
Dec 2, 2014 8:44am
I want to see the Browns win and I am willing to be okay with Luck having a shitty day fantasy wise if they do win.
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BR1986FB
Posts: 24,104
Dec 2, 2014 8:51am
Browns defense does seem to step up their game, a bit, at home. The biggest issue is that Indy is #1 in overall offense and points per game at almost 32 points a clip. Browns D will need either an exceptional effort by the defense or the offense to light it up. Both would be preferred. 
BRF
Posts: 8,748
Dec 2, 2014 10:40am
Yes!HitsRus;1680976 wrote:Browns being relevant in December.....it's been so long.
Go Browns!
Go Johnny!
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BR1986FB
Posts: 24,104
Dec 2, 2014 10:46am
Goldhammer is a D-Bag but I found this interesting.....
@HammerNation19: SportsNation poll says 51% for Hoyer and 49% for Manziel. Are the Browns split the same way?
Personally, I think they have to go with Manziel. Hoyer looks like a dog who's been kicked in the ribs too many times.
@HammerNation19: SportsNation poll says 51% for Hoyer and 49% for Manziel. Are the Browns split the same way?
Personally, I think they have to go with Manziel. Hoyer looks like a dog who's been kicked in the ribs too many times.
like_that
Posts: 26,625
Dec 2, 2014 10:54am
Hoyers td-int ratio is 11-10. Teams have caught on, it's time to move on.
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BR1986FB
Posts: 24,104
Dec 2, 2014 10:58am
Yep. He's regressed to "he is who we thought he was" (journeyman) but I'm thankful for him getting the team to this point. My take on it is that I'd rather see a rookie make rookie mistakes/go through growing pains than a veteran make those same rookie mistakes. Plus Manziel has the added weapon of his feet. Just hope he doesn't get broken in half.like_that;1681052 wrote:Hoyers td-int ratio is 11-10. Teams have caught on, it's time to move on.
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like_that
Posts: 26,625
Dec 2, 2014 11:03am
I believe anyone who isn't an idiot shared this same attitude with the hoyer/manziel debate.BR1986FB;1681058 wrote:Yep. He's regressed to "he is who we thought he was" (journeyman) but I'm thankful for him getting the team to this point. My take on it is that I'd rather see a rookie make rookie mistakes/go through growing pains than a veteran make those same rookie mistakes. Plus Manziel has the added weapon of his feet. Just hope he doesn't get broken in half.
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Ironman92
Posts: 49,363
Dec 2, 2014 11:03am
This here is the catch.like_that;1681052 wrote:Hoyers td-int ratio is 11-10. Teams have caught on, it's time to move on.
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The league catches on and Hoyer has little to no room for error because of that. The better the Browns were doing the more time teams were going to focus on how he was getting it done. Manziel is the unknown, sure everyone thinks they know, but until you face it you typically can't adapt what you need to do to stop it until it's worked a few times.
With Shanahan calling and Colts defense not getting pressure....Manziel should have a good 1st half (probably the rest of the season).....I do think teams will have his number by the 2nd half but that is more than Hoyer would maybe be able to do. This is a good defense to face in your first career start.
TBone14
Posts: 6,383
Dec 2, 2014 11:11am
Living in NW Ohio and being a Colts fan, I follow both teams very closely. To be honest, and somebody said it earlier, nothing would surprise me.
I thought the Colts were going to roll into Pittsburgh and play really well. They gave up over 600 yards of offense and 6 TD passes and were thrashed. The Colts have beat up on the bad teams. Washington, Jville x2, Tennessee, Giants. The only good teams they have beaten really are the Bengals and Ravens, both games at home. Losses to Denver, Philly, Pitt and New England. Road game vs Houston they got out early and let them back in it. This game feels similar to that. Road game vs an above average team. Should be competitive.
I thought the Colts were going to roll into Pittsburgh and play really well. They gave up over 600 yards of offense and 6 TD passes and were thrashed. The Colts have beat up on the bad teams. Washington, Jville x2, Tennessee, Giants. The only good teams they have beaten really are the Bengals and Ravens, both games at home. Losses to Denver, Philly, Pitt and New England. Road game vs Houston they got out early and let them back in it. This game feels similar to that. Road game vs an above average team. Should be competitive.
Laley23
Posts: 29,506
Dec 2, 2014 11:13am
Colts D is either lights out, or horrendous.
Colts offense however, is pretty much always great.
Gonna be tough for either QB to put up 30+, which is probably what is gonna be needed.
Colts offense however, is pretty much always great.
Gonna be tough for either QB to put up 30+, which is probably what is gonna be needed.
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BR1986FB
Posts: 24,104
Dec 2, 2014 11:24am
The thing about this that I think a lot of people are taking for granted is that Hoyer has been dealt a little bit of a "bad hand" since Alex Mack went down. During last weeks game they were on their 4th center of the season, the O-Line in general kinda sucks, the rookie RB's aren't doing well (see O-Line) and he's missing Jordan Cameron. All teams have injuries, so that's no excuse, but my point is that Manziel will be coming into the same situation. Yes, he can run but how effective will he be?Ironman92;1681065 wrote:This here is the catch.
The league catches on and Hoyer has little to no room for error because of that. The better the Browns were doing the more time teams were going to focus on how he was getting it done. Manziel is the unknown, sure everyone thinks they know, but until you face it you typically can't adapt what you need to do to stop it until it's worked a few times.
With Shanahan calling and Colts defense not getting pressure....Manziel should have a good 1st half (probably the rest of the season).....I do think teams will have his number by the 2nd half but that is more than Hoyer would maybe be able to do. This is a good defense to face in your first career start.
like_that
Posts: 26,625
Dec 2, 2014 11:29am
The oline doesn't generally suck. They are the 2nd best pass protection unit in the league without Mack. With Mack they are the best oline overall in the league. Hoyer for the most part has had plenty of time to throw.BR1986FB;1681085 wrote:The thing about this that I think a lot of people are taking for granted is that Hoyer has been dealt a little bit of a "bad hand" since Alex Mack went down. During last weeks game they were on their 4th center of the season, the O-Line in general kinda sucks, the rookie RB's aren't doing well (see O-Line) and he's missing Jordan Cameron. All teams have injuries, so that's no excuse, but my point is that Manziel will be coming into the same situation. Yes, he can run but how effective will he be?
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thavoice
Posts: 14,376
Dec 2, 2014 11:39am
Hoyer starts and plays most of the game? Colts win.
Manziel starts and plays most of the game? Browns win.
Manziel starts and plays most of the game? Browns win.
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BR1986FB
Posts: 24,104
Dec 2, 2014 11:49am
Pass protection isn't the issue. They suck in run blocking.like_that;1681090 wrote:The oline doesn't generally suck. They are the 2nd best pass protection unit in the league without Mack. With Mack they are the best oline overall in the league. Hoyer for the most part has had plenty of time to throw.
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If there's no real threat of a legit rushing attack, they are putting all of the weight on Hoyer's shoulders to win with his arm. That's not happening. Ever since the running game went to Hell, Hoyer has been exposed. They did ok running against Atlanta but the last real solid game the team had in rushing was against Cincinnati, which coincidently was the last game Hoyer looked decent.
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BR1986FB
Posts: 24,104
Dec 2, 2014 11:50am
I think they lose either way. Too much expectation for a rookie in his first start. Some seem to think JFF walks on water but I doubt he's a miracle worker. And I give them about a 5% chance with Hoyer.thavoice;1681096 wrote:Hoyer starts and plays most of the game? Colts win.
Manziel starts and plays most of the game? Browns win.
like_that
Posts: 26,625
Dec 2, 2014 11:54am
Mack definitely makes a huge difference in the rushing attack unfortunately.BR1986FB;1681102 wrote:Pass protection isn't the issue. They suck in run blocking.
If there's no real threat of a legit rushing attack, they are putting all of the weight on Hoyer's shoulders to win with his arm. That's not happening. Ever since the running game went to Hell, Hoyer has been exposed. They did ok running against Atlanta but the last real solid game the team had in rushing was against Cincinnati, which coincidently was the last game Hoyer looked decent.
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Automatik
Posts: 14,632
Dec 2, 2014 11:58am
Meaningless opinion, but I feel you gotta just say "fuck it." Put Manziel in and roll with it. You've seen pretty much all you're gonna get with Hoyer. Will he be back next year? Highly doubtful. Time to see what you have in Manziel.
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BR1986FB
Posts: 24,104
Dec 2, 2014 12:03pm
Exactly. Teams like Buffalo, JAX & Houston will attack those weak links (McDonald & Schwartz) and shut down a running game fast. Unfortunately, Shanahan's playcalling tendency has them running on almost every 1st down. You shut them down on 1st and put Hoyer in 2nd/3rd & long, it's usually not going to end well.like_that;1681106 wrote:Mack definitely makes a huge difference in the rushing attack unfortunately.
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TBone14
Posts: 6,383
Dec 2, 2014 12:42pm
From MMQB and Peter King: Start Manziel.
http://mmqb.si.com/2014/12/02/cleveland-browns-start-johnny-manziel/
http://mmqb.si.com/2014/12/02/cleveland-browns-start-johnny-manziel/