LJ;1574696 wrote:ahem

My argument wasn't that it's automatically safe to eat. I'll take my chances that the local girl in the neighborhood isn't making cupcakes in pure filth.

justincredible;1574676 wrote:Because the rules are fucking ridiculous in the first place. It's nothing more that a money grab by the government. Unelected bureaucrats pushing a bunch of rules and regulations to finance their own jobs. I do not need "protection" from big government to save me from someone making food in their own house.

And really, this is hardly "Big Government". This is the local county health department. It's about as close and accountable as "government" gets. The Federal Government has no police power over such things. The local populace is fully free to be able to have unregulated food industries if they want it. There are no big government thugs preventing a county from having unregulated food service.

But, oh wait, that's right, the people of that community decided collectively through their mutual association that they wanted to have rules that food providers should follow if they are going to sell food to the public, just like any other association of people like a business association or non-profit association votes and decides on rules and procedures through elected representatives, agents and the like.

Local communities want people who provide food for sale to the public over the course of years like the little girl in question did to follow certain rules and procedures. The Libertarian Party has the freedom to lobby the people of Madison County as to why it would be better to have no rules or procedures for providing food services.

justincredible;1574701 wrote:My argument wasn't that it's automatically safe to eat. I'll take my chances that the local girl in the neighborhood isn't making cupcakes in pure filth.

You were implying that where it is made makes a difference in the expected cleanliness and the need for the inspections. Its just not true.

LJ;1574703 wrote:You were implying that where it is made makes a difference in the expected cleanliness and the need for the inspections. Its just not true.

People get pissed when you torch their strawmen.

LJ;1574703 wrote:You were implying that where it is made makes a difference in the expected cleanliness and the need for the inspections. Its just not true.

I was implying that I should be able to make that choice for myself. I understand the risk buying cupcakes from a 12 year old girl.

But I do apologize for thinking that their are ways to handle this kind of thing without the need for pencil pushing bureaucrats. I won't go against the collective again. Promise.

justincredible;1574706 wrote:I was implying that I should be able to make that choice for myself. I understand the risk buying cupcakes from a 12 year old girl.

But I do apologize for thinking that their are ways to handle this kind of thing without the need for pencil pushing bureaucrats. I won't go against the collective again. Promise.

Like what, private companies with no oversight? Yeah, that sounds good.

"Yeah, Sarah's parents paid us $5,000 to approve her, haven't looked at her kitchen at all"

BoatShoes;1574702 wrote:And really, this is hardly "Big Government". This is the local county health department. It's about as close and accountable as "government" gets. The Federal Government has no police power over such things. The local populace is fully free to be able to have unregulated food industries if they want it. There are no big government thugs preventing a county from having unregulated food service.

But, oh wait, that's right, the people of that community decided collectively through their mutual association that they wanted to have rules that food providers should follow if they are going to sell food to the public, just like any other association of people like a business association or non-profit association votes and decides on rules and procedures through elected representatives, agents and the like.

Local communities want people who provide food for sale to the public over the course of years like the little girl in question did to follow certain rules and procedures. The Libertarian Party has the freedom to lobby the people of Madison County as to why it would be better to have no rules or procedures for providing food services.

or God forbid. we could want people to apply the smallest amount of common sense and realize a child baking for some family and friends for pennies is not the same as a bakery on Main Street and we don't need to apply the same rules.

LJ;1574710 wrote:Like what, private companies with no oversight? Yeah, that sounds good.

"Yeah, Sarah's parents paid us $5,000 to approve her, haven't looked at her kitchen at all"

I'll expand on the idea more later because I have to run.

I'm curious, though. Have you ever been to a potluck?

justincredible;1574717 wrote:I'll expand on the idea more later because I have to run.

I'm curious, though. Have you ever been to a potluck?

I've never been to a potluck where food was for sale. Not once ever.

queencitybuckeye;1574716 wrote:or God forbid. we could want people to apply the smallest amount of common sense and realize a child baking for some family and friends for pennies is not the same as a bakery on Main Street and we don't need to apply the same rules.

Typically you are correct. Great example would be a lemonade stand. Obvious is obvious.

But she's running a self-proclaimed business for 2 years. To me that's different.

WebFire;1574719 wrote:I've never been to a potluck where food was for sale. Not once ever.

The fact that money changes hands or not is of no relevance.

Did you personally inspect every kitchen of everyone there before digging in?

justincredible;1574717 wrote:I'll expand on the idea more later because I have to run.

I'm curious, though. Have you ever been to a potluck?

You can find my responses in the work holiday lunch thread. I typically don't eat much at them because I don't know the prep conditions of that person's kitchen

WebFire;1574720 wrote:Typically you are correct. Great example would be a lemonade stand. Obvious is obvious.

But she's running a self-proclaimed business for 2 years. To me that's different.

Fine. Inspect her "operation". Just look the other way on any sort of fees. Again, apply some common sense. Hell, get the inspector and local yokel mayor there for a picture for the local fishwrap and get a little good pub for the town.

What a concept, a middle ground between the "rules are rules" and "all government is evil government" extremes.

queencitybuckeye;1574723 wrote:Fine. Inspect her "operation". Just look the other way on any sort of fees. Again, apply some common sense.

"Apply some common sense" exceptions is the avenue for public-choice style corruption conservatives like yourself often oppose. The "unelected bureacrat" picking and choosing who gets to follow mutually agreed upon rules opens up the door to more problems than simply imposing them uniformly if you're going to have them, in my humble opinion. I'm with Webfire on this one.

BoatShoes;1574725 wrote:"Apply some common sense" exceptions is the avenue for public-choice style corruption conservatives like yourself often oppose. The "unelected bureacrat" picking and choosing who gets to follow mutually agreed upon rules opens up the door to more problems than simply imposing them uniformly if you're going to have them, in my humble opinion. I'm with Webfire on this one.

God, you're an idiot. Are you REALLY stupid enough to believe that applying a common sense (to anyone who isn't a moron) solution to a non-problem will cause the decline of civilization?

As an aside, what in your makeup causes this need to categorize people in these discussions with labels (i.e. "conservatives like yourself")? My thoughts are mine. It may be easier for you to pretend that everyone who disagrees with you does so in lockstep with taking points handed down from some radio dipshit or some television network, but if you have any actual interest in truth, you might want to consider talking to people as thinking human beings.

WebFire;1574679 wrote:So you are in favor of deregulation of the food industry? That doesn't sound like a good idea.

I definitely am. Why are we telling people what to eat? If people want safety in their food, then a competitive market is creative to validate the safety of said food. It's much more efficient than a government bullied by lobbyist regulating our food system.

justincredible;1574706 wrote:I was implying that I should be able to make that choice for myself.

Never say that to a liberal.....

justincredible;1574706 wrote:I understand the risk buying cupcakes from a 12 year old girl.

According to our current liberal government, you really don't.....you are not smart enough to understand this.

justincredible;1574706 wrote:But I do apologize for thinking that their are ways to handle this kind of thing without the need for pencil pushing bureaucrats. I won't go against the collective again. Promise.

Now you're thinking like a liberal......

justincredible;1574706 wrote:I was implying that I should be able to make that choice for myself. I understand the risk buying cupcakes from a 12 year old girl.

....

You do have that choice. You are not the one that local health departments have an issue with.

She, however, doesn't have the choice to sell to the masses if she doesn't follow the rules.

Con_Alma;1574736 wrote:You do have that choice. You are not the one that local health departments have an issue with.

She, however, doesn't have the choice to sell to the masses if she doesn't follow the rules.

Yet she could give them away to the masses. What's more important, the rules or the purpose for the rules?

sleeper;1574731 wrote:I definitely am. Why are we telling people what to eat? If people want safety in their food, then a competitive market is creative to validate the safety of said food. It's much more efficient than a government bullied by lobbyist regulating our food system.

Would it be? You don't think a private company would be paid off to pass inspections. Puh-lease.

Personally, I'm just glad she isn't black. This would be national news about how racist our government is.

justincredible;1574721 wrote:The fact that money changes hands or not is of no relevance.

Did you personally inspect every kitchen of everyone there before digging in?

Actually it's very relevant. Food sold to the public for profit is way different than a potluck. I think you know this.

And we had this very discussion about potlucks here. Some people even said they don't eat food at them because the don't know where the food came from. Can you imagine grocery shopping like that? How would you know what was safe.

WebFire;1574738 wrote:Would it be? You don't think a private company would be paid off to pass inspections. Puh-lease.

If a private company builds a reputation that they are paid off then their label would become worthless opening up an opportunity for a new company to come along to validate food. Do you not have any concept on how a free market would work?

queencitybuckeye;1574737 wrote:Yet she could give them away to the masses. What's more important, the rules or the purpose for the rules?

For me, at least, what's more important is following the rules...whether I agree with them or not. Everybody doesn't agree with all rules. We can't pick and choose the ones we want to follow.

queencitybuckeye;1574726 wrote:God, you're an idiot. Are you REALLY stupid enough to believe that applying a common sense (to anyone who isn't a moron) solution to a non-problem will cause the decline of civilization?

Some things just can't work that way. Many things can, food regulation is not one. Where would you draw the line? Why would I not run my food business through the my kids to avoid regulations and fees. Surely you people aren't this simple-minded?

We aren't talking about making cupcakes once or twice. She has been running a for-profit BUSINESS for 2 years.