And this......

"In October 2006, the Office of the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees (UNHCR) and the Iraqi government estimated that more than 370,000 Iraqis had been displaced since the 2006 bombing of the al-Askari Mosque, bringing the total number of Iraqi refugees to more than 1.6 million.[SUP][24][/SUP] By 2008, the UNHCR raised the estimate of refugees to a total of about 4.7 million (~16% of the population). The number of refugees estimated abroad was 2 million (a number close to CIA projections[SUP][25][/SUP]) and the number of internally displaced people was 2.7 million.[SUP][26][/SUP] The estimated number of orphans across Iraq has ranged from 400,000 (according to the Baghdad Provincial Council), to five million (according to Iraq's anti-corruption board). A UN report from 2008 placed the number of orphans at about 870,000.[SUP][27][/SUP][SUP][28][/SUP] The Red Cross has also stated that Iraq's humanitarian situation remains among the most critical in the world, with millions of Iraqis forced to rely on insufficient and poor-quality water sources.[SUP][29]"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_war_in_Iraq[/SUP]

Maybe we shouldn't have left quite yet.

ccrunner609;1396002 wrote:for every post you put on here about how lavish the Iraqies had it I can post 10 on how bad it was living under Sadaam and the hundreds of thousands he killed. The children and women he murdered.

Go ahead and start.

But it is OK for us to kill women and children throughout the middleeast. Its a good plan. I don't see how that could potentially give motive to create future terrorists.

Con_Alma;1396011 wrote:Maybe we shouldn't have left quite yet.

We could have stayed 20 years. Wouldn't have made a difference.

I haven't seen anyone advocate for killing women and children. I expect all reasonable efforts to be taken to avoid such a thing.

pmoney25;1396030 wrote:We could have stayed 20 years. Wouldn't have made a difference.

We have stayed 20+ years in other places. Instability is less likely when our presence is evident.

Footwedge;1395968 wrote:Fine. You wanna comment about torturing civilians too? And how's the "progress" over there been going?

If you want to discuss torture, start a thread about it. In regard to the progress there, there is none, and we should have been gone some time ago. The topic was us "invading" their country, which was a foolish terminology, borne I suppose of your constant labeling of anyone who would ever use our military as war mongers and chickenhawks. This action was the most justifiable use of military force in some 60 years.

queencitybuckeye;1396154 wrote:If you want to discuss torture, start a thread about it. In regard to the progress there, there is none, and we should have been gone some time ago. The topic was us "invading" their country, which was a foolish terminology, borne I suppose of your constant labeling of anyone who would ever use our military as war mongers and chickenhawks. This action was the most justifiable use of military force in some 60 years.

this

Con_Alma;1396031 wrote:I expect all reasonable efforts to be taken to avoid such a thing.

Obviously you don't. The only reasonable effort to avoid such a thing is to get out.

Cleveland Buck;1396249 wrote:Obviously you don't. The only reasonable effort to avoid such a thing is to get out.

I do have such expectation of efforts to avoid women and minors as casualties. I do not think it's reasonable to avoid it at all costs, ie. getting out.

rydawg5;1395906 wrote:If China "occupied" us for 12 years. You probably wouldn't prefer Coke or Pepsi. Maybe you'd like RC COLA?

RC Cola is fucking awesome.

queencitybuckeye;1396154 wrote:If you want to discuss torture, start a thread about it. In regard to the progress there, there is none, and we should have been gone some time ago. The topic was us "invading" their country, which was a foolish terminology, borne I suppose of your constant labeling of anyone who would ever use our military as war mongers and chickenhawks. This action was the most justifiable use of military force in some 60 years.

Going after those behind the 9/11 attacks was justified. Occupying a country for 12 years was and is not.

queencitybuckeye;1396154 wrote:If you want to discuss torture, start a thread about it.

Um...the opening thread and one of the primary reasons for Karzai wanting us out as written in the article is torture. Care to comment on it?

In regard to the progress there, there is none, and we should have been gone some time ago. The topic was us "invading" their country, which was a foolish terminology, borne I suppose of your constant labeling of anyone who would ever use our military as war mongers and chickenhawks. This action was the most justifiable use of military force in some 60 years.

Apparently you missed in post 23 when I said this..."Whereby the Afghan initial mission was more than justified". selective reading is a strong suit of yours.

Con_Alma;1395995 wrote:Thank God. I will support whatever is needed to keep it that way inclusive of massive tax increases and cuts to domestic programs.

So...now you are a flaming liberal that enjoys Fed printing presses for funding and unsustainable national debts. Got it.

Footwedge;1396503 wrote:So...now you are a flaming liberal that enjoys Fed printing presses for funding and unsustainable national debts. Got it.

Nope. If you read the post my solution funded the effort as opposed to printing money.

Clearly you don't "got it".

Footwedge;1396495 wrote:Um...the opening thread and one of the primary reasons for Karzai wanting us out as written in the article is torture. Care to comment on it?

It's nonsense. It may be a stated reason, but based on their history of humanitarianism, it's nonsense.

Apparently you missed in post 23 when I said this..."Whereby the Afghan initial mission was more than justified". selective reading is a strong suit of yours.

I did miss that.

Cleveland Buck;1396458 wrote:Going after those behind the 9/11 attacks was justified. Occupying a country for 12 years was and is not.

You don't understand. If we are not over there, they will come here and invade our country and either kill us all or enslave us. All the Money spent, american soldiers killed, innocent people aka to some as "collateral damage" is well worth it. If we stay there forever, it will obviously put an end to terrorism and eventually they will just accept democracy, Christ and the American way.

Also history will show you that occupying countries, spreading your military throughout the world and spending as much money as you want is a great way to boost your economy and continue your world dominance.

pmoney25;1396725 wrote:You don't understand. If we are not over there, they will come here and invade our country and either kill us all or enslave us. ...

I don't know that they "will" do that but I know that they did do that.

We will have presence in a variety of areas across the world that we have an interest in and/or that by being there will preserve a greater degree of stability. If that upsets certain fringe groups and creates blow-back against the United States, we will work to squelch those entities.

Footwedge;1395694 wrote:We invade and occupy their country for 12 years now. We murder their citizens. We torture them. We kill their children. And Bradley Manning remains in solitary confinement for whistleblowing our war crimes.

Not to mention the pilotless kamakazi genocide toys we are wont to use to sate our militaristic sadism.

Yeah, we are the beacon of all that's right in the world, as we spend over 100 billion dollars a year on a perpetual war. About 100 billion more than we can afford to spend I might add.

Yet....Iran's women, children and overall population is the international sanctioned punching bag led by the US led coalition for "bad behavior".

Go figure.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/24/afghan-karzai-us-troops-leave-wardak-province_n_2754361.html

Obama has had over 4 years to get us out, why the delay? I will be able to ask you this in another 4 years also.

Con_Alma;1396773 wrote:I don't know that they "will" do that but I know that they did do that.

We will have presence in a variety of areas across the world that we have an interest in and/or that by being there will preserve a greater degree of stability. If that upsets certain fringe groups and creates blow-back against the United States, we will work to squelch those entities.

As we always have. World political realities demand it.

Plus we have to maintain and secure our cushy 'Murican way of life. After all, we can't let our wives be caught dead driving anything other than an SUV to the mall and we guys gotta have our 4-wheel drive pick-em up trucks to get us back and forth to work.