http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/kathleen-parker-hillary-clinton-and-the-ghosts-of-benghazi/2013/02/08/423e3bc6-722c-11e2-ac36-3d8d9dcaa2e2_story.html

Hilary Clinton..."What difference, at this point, does it make?"

Most important, obviously, is the possibility that those four American lives might have been saved. More prosaically, it is very possible that President Obama’s reelection might not have been assured had possible incompetence at the highest levels been highlighted sooner rather than . . . now.

Or if it were a Republican in office. If this happened months before W's re-election, no way he gets back in office.

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2013/02/11/now-know-president-obama-was-mia-on-benghazi/


It is interesting to go back and re-read this thread from the posts in October I wonder if any of the administrations supporters have changed their minds?

HitsRus;1386914 wrote:http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2013/02/11/now-know-president-obama-was-mia-on-benghazi/


It is interesting to go back and re-read this thread from the posts in October I wonder if any of the administrations supporters have changed their minds?

ccrunner609;1386455 wrote:^^^^The average person with any sort of intelligence knew that this ordeal would of killed Obama for a 2nd term. But the electorate is so dumbed down now that what history will call "the biggest cover up of all time at the highest level" (even bigger then watergate) will eventually be written.


If the press that went after watergate was still operating like that, Obama would be gone.

Our Constitution is designed for a well-informed populace. You can now see why we are where we are.

I have a feeling all of you will still be crying about this in 2017, when the next Democrat takes the Presidential Oath of Office.

If that's the case we should all be crying. The last 4 years was an unmitigated disaster. Unemployment is still painfully high. We're as socially divided as we were in the late 60's. Our foreign policy is a mess. And we have a generation of young people that are putting off marriage, having children, buying homes because they are drowned in student loan debt and any type of job with growth potential is scarce - hell any job is scarce.

But its ok because we elected a Black Democrat. As Fonzie would say, AYYYYYYYYY!

I find it interesting that the Lefties on this board can't even begin to defend the state of our country. It is all "well we won!" "Go Democrats", "Worship Obama, even though he's doing the same things Bush did a few years ago when we hated him!"

I don't think the U.S. will survive my lifetime if we have another 8 years like Obama's past 4 and most likely future 4. We'll have to devalue our currency, we'll have social unrest when the young people realize that retirement (or even a career) is a pipe dream, and a workforce ill-equipped to develop private sector initiatives that made this country great, because they can't even get a job at Starbuck's.

stlouiedipalma;1388114 wrote:I have a feeling all of you will still be crying about this in 2017, when the next Democrat takes the Presidential Oath of Office.

For once I agree with you. We have, indeed, become a nation of whiners increasingly dependent upon Big Government to take good care of us.

The myth of the American Dream has evolved into a nightmare where instead being free to make personal choices in life that promote being rewarded by the sum of our own efforts, we now clamor for the mediocrity of European-style socialism with it's false promise of cradle-to-grave government entitlements.

So - yes - it does appear that we are settling for declining economic opportunity, fading prospects of home ownership, less purchasing power on phony monetary policies, state-dependent health care, and crumbling foreign policy.

And it doesn't matter if we re-elect a Dem or switch to a Repub in 2017. I'm convinced we've collectively decided to toss in the towel.

With 9 years of military service to my credit I used to stand in pride at the playing of our national anthem. Now I find myself having a difficult time even looking at the flag when it's played. I've never been more embarrassed to be American.

we now clamor for the mediocrity of European-style socialism with it's false promise of cradle-to-grave government entitlements.

This.

I have a feeling all of you will still be crying about this in 2017

Just a couple of words...unprepared, incompetent, uncaring, bumbling, spin, deceit ,delay, obfuscate.
...and a few letters.... M.I.A.

Nothing to see here....move along.....

believer;1388163 wrote:For once I agree with you. We have, indeed, become a nation of whiners increasingly dependent upon Big Government to take good care of us.

The myth of the American Dream has evolved into a nightmare where instead being free to make personal choices in life that promote being rewarded by the sum of our own efforts, we now clamor for the mediocrity of European-style socialism with it's false promise of cradle-to-grave government entitlements.

So - yes - it does appear that we are settling for declining economic opportunity, fading prospects of home ownership, less purchasing power on phony monetary policies, state-dependent health care, and crumbling foreign policy.

And it doesn't matter if we re-elect a Dem or switch to a Repub in 2017. I'm convinced we've collectively decided to toss in the towel.

With 9 years of military service to my credit I used to stand in pride at the playing of our national anthem. Now I find myself having a difficult time even looking at the flag when it's played. I've never been more embarrassed to be American.

What a bunch of sanctimonious nonsense. The older generation always thinks the decline of western civilization is imminent because of the brats comung after them. BHO talked about individual initiative and hard work multiple times in his speech. People who voted for obama believe in hard work too lol. Moocher class fantasies!

They can believe in hard work all they want, the fact is our young people are unemployed. Where has Obama been on this issue in the last 4 years? We're developing a lost generation, if we haven't already done so. What's the un/underemployment rate for young people under 25? 50% now?

Sounds a lot like Spain and Greece. Hope. Change.

Manhattan Buckeye;1388186 wrote:They can believe in hard work all they want, the fact is our young people are unemployed. Where has Obama been on this issue in the last 4 years? We're developing a lost generation, if we haven't already done so. What's the un/underemployment rate for young people under 25? 50% now?

Sounds a lot like Spain and Greece. Hope. Change.

I actually agree with you here. Except the conservative views of the world only offer prescriptions that would make the problem worse, by large. The democrats and republicans have spent most of the last 3 years or so bickering about how to be deficit hawks giving lip service to unemployment. There is at least hope with democrats who fought for a lower payroll tax, the American Jobs Act, etc. The deficit continues to shrink every year and will fall under $1 trillion this year. We ran a $3 billion surplus in January. Yet, unemployment still rests at catastrophic levels.

BoatShoes;1388223 wrote:I actually agree with you here. Except the conservative views of the world only offer prescriptions that would make the problem worse, by large. The democrats and republicans have spent most of the last 3 years or so bickering about how to be deficit hawks giving lip service to unemployment. There is at least hope with democrats who fought for a lower payroll tax, the American Jobs Act, etc. The deficit continues to shrink every year and will fall under $1 trillion this year. We ran a $3 billion surplus in January. Yet, unemployment still rests at catastrophic levels.

The way out of high unemployment is to create a thriving economy that grows at least 4%. The natural outcome of a thriving economy is job creation and price escalation. Clearly, higher taxes and stangling regulations do not lead to a growing economy, as we've witnessed over the past 49 months. However, as long as Our Dear Leader says he is for a growing economy, his followers will regurgitate it ad infinitum. His actions clearly don't create an environment for growth, but that doesn't matter to the 51% whom adore his teleprompter reading skills.

Regarding your surplus, the FICA tax was raised 2% on 1-1-2013.

What's the un/underemployment rate for young people under 25? 50% now?

Underemployment has to be fairly high especially for those who have incurred massive debt to go to college. I can list off 10 people I know that graduated from OSU(all non-engineers) that are waiting tables or working some shitty hourly job with no 401k or benefits. I can list off another 10 people, these are the geniuses, that couldn't find work yet decided to enroll in grad school in the same program as their undergrad to 1) defer their student loans primarily, but 2) to try to get a job with no experience and a masters degree.

Heck, we just hired some guy out of law school(top 20 school) who's 25 to do quality assurance. He basically makes the same wage as some guy with a high school diploma(he does get benefits at least).

Manhattan Buckeye;1388186 wrote: Sounds a lot like Spain and Greece. Hope. Change.

Net new investment in US treasuries from China the last few years: ZERO.

The fed now buys 70-80% of US treasuries. So these deficits simply are not remotely sustainable. Once inflation starts to really kick-in the wheels come off.

What the hell, we all know someone who seems to be educated, tells people about going to school, comes off as being intelligent at times, work at Hungry Howies but still defends Obama failure agenda.

Academia, poverty and stupid has no boundaries in the world of sub-sandwich.

gut;1388272 wrote:Net new investment in US treasuries from China the last few years: ZERO.

The fed now buys 70-80% of US treasuries. So these deficits simply are not remotely sustainable. Once inflation starts to really kick-in the wheels come off.

We've been hearing this song and dance for half a decade. The Fed stopped buying treasuries in 2010 for a brief period and the bond vigilantes did not attack like we were warned, etc. There is no evidence that there's going to be run away inflation let alone inflation that is sizeably above the FED's target rate (even though that would be a good thing). The deficit is going to be about $800 billion this year continuing the trend of dropping every year.

BGFalcons82;1388243 wrote:The way out of high unemployment is to create a thriving economy that grows at least 4%. The natural outcome of a thriving economy is job creation and price escalation. Clearly, higher taxes and stangling regulations do not lead to a growing economy, as we've witnessed over the past 49 months. However, as long as Our Dear Leader says he is for a growing economy, his followers will regurgitate it ad infinitum. His actions clearly don't create an environment for growth, but that doesn't matter to the 51% whom adore his teleprompter reading skills.

Regarding your surplus, the FICA tax was raised 2% on 1-1-2013.

And how do you do that with interest rates at the zero bound. More. Government. Spending. paying people compensation for services rendered until private spending power is adequate instead of transfer payments that merely support spending power throughout the duration.

There's no evidence that our marginal tax rates are too high or that we have strangling regulation so as to cause massive supply side problems because this depression has nothing to do with the supply side. You're right the payroll tax is too high and should've been fought for by the democrats and should be adjusted to to economic downturns like interest rates are and should be cut to zero until private spending power is adequate.

And, the reason we haven't had an "environment for growth" since 2010 is because our whole national conversation has been obsessed with austerity, deficit and debt reduction, raising taxes and cutting spending.

The democrats and republicans have spent most of the last 3 years or so bickering about how to be deficit hawks giving lip service to unemployment. There is at least hope with democrats who fought for a lower payroll tax,

Hahaha. What does the payroll tax reduction have to do with unemployment? If you're not working, you are not paying ANY payroll tax....and the 2% reduction was given only to the workers share, not the employers part.

I'm instructing my broker to make a big buy on the parent company of Kleenex. You crybabies here would send their stock soaring.

stlouiedipalma;1388709 wrote:I'm instructing my broker to make a big buy on the parent company of Kleenex. You crybabies here would send their stock soaring.

I love this is the Obama-bootlickers only argument - a complete non-argument. If there was anything positive about the SOTU or the Obama administration's performance, you wouldn't have to rely on this.

The SOTU is lousy, and there is no indication it is going to get better. The speech was pure fluff. We deserve who we elect, and we just re-elected a HLS graduate who never worked a real revenue-producing job in his life despite every door being opened to him. What do we expect? He's like the "idealist" in college or even in HS gunning for student body president, but only provides ideals and empty promises and no results.

HitsRus;1388497 wrote:Hahaha. What does the payroll tax reduction have to do with unemployment? If you're not working, you are not paying ANY payroll tax....and the 2% reduction was given only to the workers share, not the employers part.

Are you being serious? The payroll tax is a consumption Tax that eats at the spending power of all workers. It is a huge drag on aggregate demand! The reason unemployment is high is depressed aggregate demand! The fact that you dont understand why a huge decrease in the payroll tax rate would reduce unemployment really is something because youre a smart guy...

In the macroeconomy your spending becomes an unemployed person's income. When average ordinary workers living paycheck to paycheck have more money to spend, it reduces unemployment when there is a slump in overall spending.

^^^

Be that as it may, the government's intrusion has only led to disastrous effects with little in return. The stimulus was a colossal failure. It did little to stimulate demand and increased debt to troubling levels. At some point even the hard core statists have to admit our government hasn't been efficient. They certainly made their thoughts known during the previous administration. What is this, the Teflon Presidency? Led by an incredibly inexperienced emperor without clothing and a guy a few IQ points short of being mentally challenged. They've wasted enough of money we don't have.

BoatShoes;1388421 wrote:We've been hearing this song and dance for half a decade. The Fed stopped buying treasuries in 2010 for a brief period and the bond vigilantes did not attack like we were warned, etc. There is no evidence that there's going to be run away inflation let alone inflation that is sizeably above the FED's target rate (even though that would be a good thing). The deficit is going to be about $800 billion this year continuing the trend of dropping every year.

No evidence right this minute, but only a fool believes this is sustainable. Fact of the matter is, most of the deficit is being financed by Fed purchases. And when - not if - the day comes we will have to choose between wicked inflation and the severe austerity you are always railing against. However I would point out while NET inflation may be very low, not all people are affected equally because there has been significant inflation in food and energy - which, again, disproportionately affects the poor. Stagnant to declining wages are also helping keep that number low - so pretending like there is no inflation or no issue is ignoring the structural inequality.

Heck, it would probably be better for the poor and middle class to just give them the money rather than blow it on pork and inefficient gubmit programs.

BoatShoes;1388801 wrote: The payroll tax is a consumption Tax. It is a huge drag on aggregate demand!

No it's not. It's a tax on productivity (that's Macro 101). And, according to you, if the govt takes money from us and then spends it aggregate demand increases because of that magical multiplier effect :laugh: