SQ_Crazies
Posts: 7,977
Dec 18, 2009 12:27am
My shit? I was the first person to be called insane. Your opinion is just that as well, a fucking opinion. I'd say my point is pretty valid--we're talking about the best player to ever play the game. Shaq is damn good in his own right, but Jordan is without a doubt the best player that ever played the game. I'm not talking about titles--this has NOTHING to do with titles, we're talking individual players here. Not that the title argument supports your side anyways.
Pick6
Posts: 14,946
Dec 18, 2009 12:32am
James easy.. hack-a-shack most famously done by the spurs has killed shaqs teams over the years in the playoffs (most recently the suns) and now that he is with cleveland it will hurt them in the playoffs as well.
Darkon
Posts: 3,476
Dec 18, 2009 7:32am
Not sure I agree that Larry "changed" the game. Great player but I don't believe he changed the game.SQ_Crazies wrote: LOL, alright. If you want to talk about greatness--they're both great players. If you want to talk about game changing--I could argue that Larry did more to change the game than Shaq.
Back on Topic.
I'll take Shaq over LBJ.
With a dominent big man it's not as hard to biuld a championship team.
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Bluepride13
Posts: 75
Dec 18, 2009 7:54am
I think Bird could be in an argument for the most complete player. He could beat you in any phase of the game. He wasnt fast, couldnt jump that well, but as far as basketball instincts he may have been the best. He could have scored many more points than he did but was a total team player...on both ends of the court.
In reply to the question...probally Shaq. Alot of room for argument though.
In reply to the question...probally Shaq. Alot of room for argument though.
Darkon
Posts: 3,476
Dec 18, 2009 7:59am
I agree, but I don't believe Bird changed the game like say Wilt, MJ, or Magic.Bluepride13 wrote: I think Bird could be in an argument for the most complete player. He could beat you in any phase of the game. He wasnt fast, couldnt jump that well, but as far as basketball instincts he may have been the best. He could have scored many more points than he did but was a total team player...on both ends of the court.
In reply to the question...probally Shaq. Alot of room for argument though.
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Bluepride13
Posts: 75
Dec 18, 2009 8:42am
Maybe. They certainly had some great matchups against each other. The one quote Magic made always sticks out in my mind about Bird. Magic said..."There is only one man I ever feared on a basketball court...Larry Bird". That says alot. I know they are good friends now but that took years. They actually didnt like each other for a long period of time. Either way...it says alot about the respect Magic had for Bird.
SQ_Crazies
Posts: 7,977
Dec 18, 2009 12:28pm
If it wasn't for Larry and Magic, Shaq/LeBron/Kobe/D-Wade/Jordan/etc/etc/etc, wouldn't be household names--nor would they be making as much money as they are. If you don't think Larry Bird did as much to change the game as Shaq then I don't know what to tell you...
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Bluepride13
Posts: 75
Dec 18, 2009 12:40pm
They were great to watch compete. It was a great era imo.
jpake1
Posts: 2,389
Dec 18, 2009 1:07pm
SQ- Why exactly wouldn't all those guys you mentioned be household names, nor have the money they do? I'm mostly interested in knowing why Magic and Bird are the reason those guys are household names.
Each great player leaves their footprint in NBA history. Each great player adds to the history, present, and future of the NBA. Bird definitely left his footprint in history. He also was the reason for something called Bird Rights, which is a pretty big deal.
Each great player leaves their footprint in NBA history. Each great player adds to the history, present, and future of the NBA. Bird definitely left his footprint in history. He also was the reason for something called Bird Rights, which is a pretty big deal.
SQ_Crazies
Posts: 7,977
Dec 18, 2009 1:11pm
I agree that every player leaves their footprint--but figuratively speaking Shaq's isn't any bigger than Bird's.
But Bird and Magic changed everything--they started the major media fascination and the primetime TV market. The average salaries for players has always gone up because the league has always made more money--but it EXPLODED because of them and television is why.
But Bird and Magic changed everything--they started the major media fascination and the primetime TV market. The average salaries for players has always gone up because the league has always made more money--but it EXPLODED because of them and television is why.
SQ_Crazies
Posts: 7,977
Dec 18, 2009 1:14pm
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bo shemmy3337
Posts: 962
Dec 18, 2009 1:16pm
Lebron's 3 point % is .368%. I am not seeing the ridiculously good three point shooter.LTrain23 wrote: IMO, prime is when you have nearly maxed out your potential.. I don't see that yet.
LeBron has gotten ridiculously good from the 3, but still needs to get a better back-to the-basket game...
LeBron should be in his prime by 26.
But, this is just one mans opinion.
SQ_Crazies
Posts: 7,977
Dec 18, 2009 1:19pm
Bird and Magic essentially MADE the league what it is today--no disrespect to those before them, they had the benefit of the technology but that's how timing works sometimes.
Of course then Jordan took the reigns--but they got the ball rolling while they were still in college.
Of course then Jordan took the reigns--but they got the ball rolling while they were still in college.
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devil1197
Posts: 6,220
Dec 18, 2009 1:21pm
For someone like LeBron, that is pretty damn good.bo shemmy3337 wrote:Lebron's 3 point % is .368%. I am not seeing the ridiculously good three point shooter.LTrain23 wrote: IMO, prime is when you have nearly maxed out your potential.. I don't see that yet.
LeBron has gotten ridiculously good from the 3, but still needs to get a better back-to the-basket game...
LeBron should be in his prime by 26.
But, this is just one mans opinion.
Better than the other elite players like Kobe and Wade who both play SG.
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bo shemmy3337
Posts: 962
Dec 18, 2009 1:40pm
devil1197 wrote:For someone like LeBron, that is pretty damn good.bo shemmy3337 wrote:Lebron's 3 point % is .368%. I am not seeing the ridiculously good three point shooter.LTrain23 wrote: IMO, prime is when you have nearly maxed out your potential.. I don't see that yet.
LeBron has gotten ridiculously good from the 3, but still needs to get a better back-to the-basket game...
LeBron should be in his prime by 26.
But, this is just one mans opinion.
Better than the other elite players like Kobe and Wade who both play SG.
What does that mean? SO because he is Lebron his shooting % is great regardless of what it is? I get he is not a true shooting guard but if you are going to make that argument you should agree with me that he needs to get off his high horse and move to the true 4 spot and be the best PF in the game today. No one could stop him down there. The Caves would be the front runners to win the tittle if Lebron would post up more often. Playing the 4 spot the way he does only hurts the team. Having 4 guys up top limits 2end chance opportunity and is a major hole in there offense.
SQ_Crazies
Posts: 7,977
Dec 18, 2009 1:42pm
LMAO, LeBron should not move to PF. I won't argue that he should work on his post moves--but he's too good from all over to have any sort of labelled position. It's all situational, no way he should be held back by banging in the post all night.
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devil1197
Posts: 6,220
Dec 18, 2009 1:45pm
He should post up more often, but he should never move to a true 4 until later in his career when his driving ability diminishes.
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bo shemmy3337
Posts: 962
Dec 18, 2009 1:45pm
Big O was not held back. I am not saying he needs to always be down there and never shoot jump shots but when he is playing the 4 spot he tends to have the ball at the top of the key way to much. He is such a rare talent and he should play to his strength and that is he is very powerful.SQ_Crazies wrote: LMAO, LeBron should not move to PF. I won't argue that he should work on his post moves--but he's too good from all over to have any sort of labelled position. It's all situational, no way he should be held back by banging in the post all night.
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bo shemmy3337
Posts: 962
Dec 18, 2009 1:46pm
See I love his driving ability late in a game and in fast breaks but when everything settles down he needs to be down low more often.devil1197 wrote: He should post up more often, but he should never move to a true 4 until later in his career when his driving ability diminishes.
SQ_Crazies
Posts: 7,977
Dec 18, 2009 1:47pm
He's not the Big O. I think it's safe to say that the comparisons can stop now--he's LeBron. There hasn't even been a player quite like him.
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bo shemmy3337
Posts: 962
Dec 18, 2009 1:48pm
Not an comparison just and example. I just think he should play down low a lot more for the teams sake.SQ_Crazies wrote: He's not the Big O. I think it's safe to say that the comparisons can stop now--he's LeBron. There hasn't even been a player quite like him.
SQ_Crazies
Posts: 7,977
Dec 18, 2009 1:49pm
I said I agreed he could do it more often--but that isn't what you said. What you actually said was he should move to the 4--you're acting like he needs to just bury his talents into the post. That has to be a joke.
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devil1197
Posts: 6,220
Dec 18, 2009 1:50pm
And I think you will see that later in the year with Lebron at the 4 unless Cleveland makes a trade.
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bo shemmy3337
Posts: 962
Dec 18, 2009 1:53pm
Everything does not have to end in a smart comment. You can have an argument about Lebron without getting your panties in a bunch. I do think if it is not at the end of the game or a fast break he should be in the post. So 90% of the time I think he should be in the post and that is my opinion.SQ_Crazies wrote: I said I agreed he could do it more often--but that isn't what you said. What you actually said was he should move to the 4--you're acting like he needs to just bury his talents into the post. That has to be a joke.
SQ_Crazies
Posts: 7,977
Dec 18, 2009 1:55pm
Alright, that's fine you can have that opinion--my opinion is that you're nuts. I don't wear panties, thanks 
I don't disagree that he should play down on the block sometimes--but 90% of the game? LMAO, that takes away a big part of his game and makes it much easier on defenses.
I don't disagree that he should play down on the block sometimes--but 90% of the game? LMAO, that takes away a big part of his game and makes it much easier on defenses.