se-alum;794510 wrote:He needs to do lead-off things if he's going to be up there though. I can't fathom how someone w/ his speed made it through every level of baseball w/o learning how to bunt.

He's getting there. He laid down a bunt the other day and got a hit. He's had 2+ hits in something like 6 of his last 7 games. He's really starting to put the ball in play. Remember, this is only his 2nd MLB season.

Rickey Henderson and Lou Brock struck out a lot for their times as well.

Ironman92;794523 wrote:Rickey Henderson and Lou Brock struck out a lot for their times as well.

Funny you said that as I was gonna bring up Henderson as well in comparing with Stubby.

Of course, he wont get the SB as RH did because managers are as daring to steal as much, and plus pitchers hold guys on much better.

SportsAndLady;794519 wrote:He's getting there. He laid down a bunt the other day and got a hit. He's had 2+ hits in something like 6 of his last 7 games. He's really starting to put the ball in play. Remember, this is only his 2nd MLB season.

I'm not against leaving him there(he's really the only option right now), but I'm not sure he's long term the guy, especially w/ guys like Sappelt and Hamilton in the wings. I really think Stubbs develops into a 5 or 6 hole guy, but we'll see.

I'd prefer to see Stubbs lower in the order as well. Guy can produce runs and you kind of waste him at the top of the order. You should never let speed be the determining factor in who bats leadoff.

He ain't going to steal as much as Rickey....becasue no one in baseball history is within 460 of him.....which will likely be more career SB than Stubbs gets.....though I hope not

Stolen base records will never be broken. A. Managers are not as aggressive. B. PItchers hold guys on alot better. Watch some oldtime games, pitchers dont use the variation of slide steps that they do nowadays to hold guys on.

Yeah.....and Rickey was still stealing 40 into his 40's

ok...I was wrong...but he did have over 35 twice and did have 66 at age 39 and 220 AFTER turning 38

Was around 1,000 in his early 30's.

From what I've read, Billy Hamilton is blazing fast w/ good plate awareness. His BA is a bit skewed right now because he is just in his 2nd season of switch hitting, but it seems like he may be that prototypical leadoff guy that the reds have been missing since, probably, Deion.

In 2013 you could be looking at a lineup of:

Hamilton
Sappelt
Votto
Bruce
Stubbs
Phillips
Mesoraco
Francisco

Meseraco has really come on. And he is a big steelers fan. Spoke to him for a bit at a local event and he expected to start at AA this year and he HOPED to be at AAA by the end of the season so it looks like he is above where he expected.

thavoice;795896 wrote:Meseraco has really come on. And he is a big steelers fan. Spoke to him for a bit at a local event and he expected to start at AA this year and he HOPED to be at AAA by the end of the season so it looks like he is above where he expected.

Surprising that he thought he would start at AA this year. He was in Louisville at the end of the year last year, after raking in A & AA. His AAA stats weren't great, but they were in a very limited sample size.

WHo knows if he was just speculating or what. He said "I expect to start at AA". It was a small event so got to talk to him and Marty for a bit. BP was a bit standoffish, and Ryan Freel..just looked damned bored and wanted some of the free beer they were serving! We gots to talking about the steelers. Asked if he was a fan since he was from Pa and he said he went to both playoff games. When I told him my buddies and I have season tickets he was surprised. He was going to have me give him a call if we had extra tix...but when he found out there were way up high he said he could get better than that on his own!

He def started slow in the organization and some had given up hope. It has to be very, very hard to come from HS as a catcher. Not only do ya have deal with the hitting and such, but handling a pitching staff has to be very difficult. At the HS level it is pretty simple to do as you dont have many pitchers, and they usually dont have many diff pitches.

thavoice;795950 wrote:WHo knows if he was just speculating or what. He said "I expect to start at AA". It was a small event so got to talk to him and Marty for a bit. BP was a bit standoffish, and Ryan Freel..just looked damned bored and wanted some of the free beer they were serving! We gots to talking about the steelers. Asked if he was a fan since he was from Pa and he said he went to both playoff games. When I told him my buddies and I have season tickets he was surprised. He was going to have me give him a call if we had extra tix...but when he found out there were way up high he said he could get better than that on his own!

He def started slow in the organization and some had given up hope. It has to be very, very hard to come from HS as a catcher. Not only do ya have deal with the hitting and such, but handling a pitching staff has to be very difficult. At the HS level it is pretty simple to do as you dont have many pitchers, and they usually dont have many diff pitches.

Anyone that had given up on him should be fired or excluded from Reds fandom. Last year was only his 3rd year in the minors. If you give up on a high schooler after 2 years, you don't know what the hell you're doing.

se-alum;795869 wrote:From what I've read, Billy Hamilton is blazing fast w/ good plate awareness. His BA is a bit skewed right now because he is just in his 2nd season of switch hitting, but it seems like he may be that prototypical leadoff guy that the reds have been missing since, probably, Deion.

In 2013 you could be looking at a lineup of:

Hamilton
Sappelt
Votto
Bruce
Stubbs
Phillips
Mesoraco
Francisco

They won't be able to afford to hold on to all four of Votto, Bruce, Phillips, and Stubbs.

mhs95_06;796095 wrote:They won't be able to afford to hold on to all four of Votto, Bruce, Phillips, and Stubbs.

The only one they might not have in 2013 is Phillips, and I think they'll get a deal done w/ him.

Hamilton is more than 2 yrs away, he probably won't even get to high A this year. I'd say that lineup is about right though, switch Sappelt for Frazier and Cozart for Hamilton.

I haven't watched Hamilton play, so I'm just going off what I've read on him. I think Sappelt is here next year though.