The short answer is the union balks at eliminating the incentive. The company responds they will have to lay off a dozen workers. The union caves because unions are first and foremost about jobs.

A flex plan is really the way to go. Particularly for salaried employees vacation doesn't technically cost the company anything, in most cases (an example of an exception being a line supervisor where you have to cover the vacation with OT). She purchases a week of vacation that doesn't really cost the company anything, they save on the medical and she's happy.

An alternate way to think of this is companies decide benefits mainly on market comp, for starters. The benefit plan they choose also takes into account an expected number of opt outs. People who don't opt out ultimatley only succeed in forcing the company to offer a less lucrative health plan for its workers and/or lay additional people off. That's why flex plans help to ensure the fairest comp levels at the cheapest rate for the company, but then administration of those costs more and may not be practical for smaller companies.

And as benefits go, your wife should count herself lucky to only lose something most companies don't offer in the first place. People at other companies have seen salaries and benefits cut and 401k matches were among the first to be cut or eliminated all together.

ernest_t_bass;580428 wrote:I'm not sure what happened to the Union thread, but here is a recent example (in my own life) where I think a union would be beneficial. I'm a fence rider on unions. I can see how they can hurt, but I have also seen instances where they help. Here is an example of one:

My wife gets paid weekly, and she works at a non-unionized factory (she's an office worker). My wife opts out of insurance at the company b/c she is on my insurance. Her business pays any employee who chooses to opt out of insurance $100 per month for choosing to do so. This is cheaper than providing insurance to the employee, and a plus for the business. Well, she informs me that at the beginning of the new year, the business is going to stop paying employees the $100 per month, the employees who opt out of insurance.

Yes, it is an added expense to the business to pay these employees $1,200 per year, but the expense to the business if they opted to take insurance is much greater (unless I'm missing something). If the factory was unionized, I don't see something like this happening.

/Rant

The union may have fought for it. But the $1,200 collected every year thus far wouldn't have existed because it would have been deducted out and called "union dues" anyway.

Classyposter58;591657 wrote:That added protection of job security gives me a good peace of mind in a union I won't lie

Ummmm....unions can only make you think you have job security. But don't get too cozy. When the union goes too far and the company decides it can't afford you anymore, they'll just sell or move the business offshore.

NNN;592137 wrote:The union may have fought for it. But the $1,200 collected every year thus far wouldn't have existed because it would have been deducted out and called "union dues" anyway.

Yeah, somewhere I've already mentioned that.

Classyposter58;591657 wrote:That added protection of job security gives me a good peace of mind in a union I won't lie

Unions protect the bad(lazy) worker more than the good worker. I've seen it first hand for over 30yrs.

iclfan2;582440 wrote:I can get fired at any time, get no overtime yet work more than 40 hours, and am ok with that. DEAL with it.

I can't get fired just for any old reason, and I make time and a half for anything over 40 hours, and am ok with that. DEAL with it.

Union exempt from Obama care tax....WTF
http://washingtonexaminer.com/news/2009/06/union-workers-would-be-exempt-dem-health-care-tax


Want to know why? Simple Obamacare is a failure and scam and everyone knows it and it is being exposed for what it is and those who have benified are also being exposed as socialist/ maxist organizations...so be the Unions

http://www.dispatchpolitics.com/live/content/local_news/stories/2010/12/13/copy/public-sector-unions-in-ohio-soon-may-be-under-seige.html?adsec=politics&sid=101

It is high time to eliminate collective bargaining of state and municipal employees and the unaffordable wage/banefit packages often caused by ridiculous binding arbitration.

Your wife works where there is no union so presenting the case that she would be better off if there was a union is a non-starter. I understand that the OP was a hypothetical situation to begin with, but again, the whole union idea is null and void since no union exists there.

Follow the money and understand what companies face in the very near future once 2011 arrives. ObamaCare begins to rear it's ugly head and common folk begin to see how it affects their lives.

Companies have a budget they need to abide by and they are being strong-armed to come up with the funds to pay for the mandates of ObamaCare.

I would venture to say that your wife's $100 per month money is being redistributed and is going to pay for the increase in costs that her company is being mandated to pay because of the new health care law.

Don't bother complaining. It's change you can believe in!

edit: Boobs!

LOL. BOOBS!

My wife just got a $850 bonus, so I'm over it!

believer;592149 wrote:Ummmm....unions can only make you think you have job security. But don't get too cozy. When the union goes too far and the company decides it can't afford you anymore, they'll just sell or move the business offshore.

Lol I work at UPS bud. Ha trust me it's not going overseas anytime soon

Classyposter58;602203 wrote:Lol I work at UPS bud. Ha trust me it's not going overseas anytime soon

Well, don't get too cozy with UPS either. Despite the Christmas delivery rush, there are plenty of optional shipping companies out there. I know....I look for the options every day...bud. LMAO

believer;602719 wrote:Well, don't get too cozy with UPS either. Despite the Christmas delivery rush, there are plenty of optional shipping companies out there. I know....I look for the options every day...bud. LMAO

Yea that's why I have another job that pays $9.50 on hour too and thats on weekends only. So after Christmas rush I will still have 3-4 days of work which is pretty good considering I'm a freshman in college

Classyposter58;602203 wrote:Lol I work at UPS bud. Ha trust me it's not going overseas anytime soon

I worked for the railroad and lost my UNION job due to layoffs. I would say the railroad is not going overseas anytime soon. Since I was low in seniority, I was laid off, even though (a supervisor stated) plenty of guys getting laid off were better workers than those that were keeping their jobs because they had higher seniority. Unions served their purpose many years ago, now they are pointless.

dwccrew;604824 wrote:I worked for the railroad and lost my UNION job due to layoffs. I would say the railroad is not going overseas anytime soon. Since I was low in seniority, I was laid off, even though (a supervisor stated) plenty of guys getting laid off were better workers than those that were keeping their jobs because they had higher seniority. Unions served their purpose many years ago, now they are pointless.

The railroads can't be off-shored that's true. But the products the railroad once shipped are being produced offshore and rolling across Chinese railroads...hence the U.S. railroad layoffs.

And I agree that union seniority clauses are totally bogus, detrimental, unproductive and way, way outdated in today's radically changing global economy.

believer;604896 wrote:The railroads can't be off-shored that's true. But the products the railroad once shipped are being produced offshore and rolling across Chinese railroads...hence the U.S. railroad layoffs.

And I agree that union seniority clauses are totally bogus, detrimental, unproductive and way, way outdated in today's radically changing global economy.

Absolutely. The reason we were layed off is because the auto-industry took a dump. Although a lot of what we shipped was also grain, chemicals, coal, etc. These things will continue to be produced here, and although I was called back to work, I have since found a better job and didn't go back.