killer_ewok;548302 wrote:Yeah, forget investigations. You must know exactly what happened there that day prior to Sullivan's death. You know it all.

Speaking of arrogance...

Ewok you know of me enough to know that I am not an ND hater. I don't troll ND threads.

I've never really seen this arrogance from Notre Dame...but right now, I see it.

Obviously you do not, that is fine, you are a huge fan. But it's there.

I never said you were trolling. You're assuming and talking as if you know all of the facts and details leading up to his death. We don't know yet exactly what transpired.

So, please define the arrogance by ND. I'm not seeing it.

killer_ewok;548309 wrote:I never said you were trolling. You're assuming and talking as if you know all of the facts and details leading up to his death. We don't know yet exactly what transpired.

So, please define the arrogance by ND. I'm not seeing it.

There's arrogance in what you are saying. Wait til the facts and details come out? Haven't they already come out??? Kelly wanted to have practice outside during windy weather, the student was obviously sent up to tape practice, and it fell over. It's not like a report is going to come out saying this kid wasn't even a member of the team team, just a random kid who showed up to practice and went up there himself lol for christ sake, understand the severity of this situation and stop saying " just wait til the info comes out"

There have been several coaches in the area that moved practice indoors that day due to the wind. I think that is what'll hurt BK. Tressel came out the same day (Tues.) and stated that they moved practice indoors for the safety of the players and the video people on the perch. Granted Columbus and South Bend are a ways away from each other, but things like this aren't going to help BK support his claim that he didn't know about the weather.

I see some more resident dumbasses ("pick my ass" and "never played sports/can't get no ladies") have joined the debate. You haters are a joke, Brian Kelly is going nowhere and as ewok stated, ND has assumed FULL responsibility for Sullivan's tragic death. This story is closed, the only reason certain assholes bring it up is to flame and bash.

I never said he should be fired or should resign, I'm just saying that his claim of being unaware isn't being helped by other coaches saying they made changes to practice on the same day due to weather.

rock_knutne;548328 wrote:I see some more resident dumbasses ("pick my ass" and "never played sports/can't get no ladies") have joined the debate.

Do you use that line in every post?

rock_knutne;548328 wrote:You haters are a joke

Arrogance.

rock_knutne;548328 wrote:Brian Kelly is going nowhere

Arrogance.

rock_knutne;548328 wrote: This story is closed

Arrogance.

^^^^^Keep proving me right that you're as dumb as a box of rocks!

Sorry, but this story is a long way away from being closed. A student doesn't die while under the supervision of a very publicized football team in an incident that could have been easily avoided and it just gets swept away quickly.

Any of the ND fans that think this is a closed matter and will be forgotten shortly are not only delusional but also naive.

Fly4Fun;548347 wrote:Sorry, but this story is a long way away from being closed. A student doesn't die while under the supervision of a very publicized football team in an incident that could have been easily avoided and it just gets swept away quickly.

Any of the ND fans that think this is a closed matter and will be forgotten shortly are not only delusional but also naive.

AND ARROGANT!

SportsAndLady;548317 wrote:There's arrogance in what you are saying. Wait til the facts and details come out? Haven't they already come out??? Kelly wanted to have practice outside during windy weather, the student was obviously sent up to tape practice, and it fell over. It's not like a report is going to come out saying this kid wasn't even a member of the team team, just a random kid who showed up to practice and went up there himself lol for christ sake, understand the severity of this situation and stop saying " just wait til the info comes out"

So whether Kelly or someone else told him to stay up there wouldn't be important to know? Maybe the kid was encouraged to come down and chose to stay up there and wouldn't that change things? There are details out there that aren't public knowledge yet. You'd just as soon pass judgement without knowing the particulars though. That is arrogance IMO. Presumptuous too.

Me taking a wait and see approach is arrogance? Whatever you say. Me saying ND and Kelly aren't to blame at all would be arrogance and I'm not saying that. Again, I'd prefer to hear the results of the investigation before jumping the gun either way.

Kahuna-Pretty sure Kelly moved practice indoors that same Tuesday that Tressel said that. It was the following day when the tragedy happened if I'm not mistaken.

Fly4Fun;548347 wrote:Sorry, but this story is a long way away from being closed. A student doesn't die while under the supervision of a very publicized football team in an incident that could have been easily avoided and it just gets swept away quickly.

Any of the ND fans that think this is a closed matter and will be forgotten shortly are not only delusional but also naive.

I agree. This story is far from being "closed"

Fly4Fun;548347 wrote:Sorry, but this story is a long way away from being closed. A student doesn't die while under the supervision of a very publicized football team in an incident that could have been easily avoided and it just gets swept away quickly.

Any of the ND fans that think this is a closed matter and will be forgotten shortly are not only delusional but also naive.

Agree with that.

SportsAndLady;548349 wrote:AND ARROGANT!

And that's rock's opinion. He doesn't represent the university or the entire fan base.

Oh, I thought it was Tuesday when this all happened.

killer_ewok;548350 wrote:So whether Kelly or someone else told him to stay up there wouldn't be important to know? Maybe the kid was encouraged to come down and chose to stay up there and wouldn't that change things? There are details out there that aren't public knowledge yet. You'd just as soon pass judgement without knowing the particulars though. That is arrogance IMO. Presumptuous too.

I think his tweet from his iphone while being up there is enough to know that he was asked to do his job like it was any other day.

"Holy fuck holy fuck this is terrifying."

Yeah, that just screams "I want to be up here!!"

If the investigation shows that Brian Kelly is responsible should he be fired?

killer_ewok;548353 wrote:And that's rock's opinion. He doesn't represent the university or the entire fan base.

Of course he doesn't. If that guy has ANY representation at all in this world, it would be a travesty.

Trust me, I do not take Rock's dumbass remarks and label it as ND fans' remarks. Rock is synonymous with a gay italian delusional cocksucker, not Notre Dame.

KR1245;548358 wrote:If the investigation shows that Brian Kelly is responsible should he be fired?

It would be a metaphorical slap in the face to an unfairly deceased 20 year old kid if he were to have a job.

It would tell me that Brian Kelly has no spine, if he continued to work at Notre Dame fully knowing he was responsible for a death. If I were working a job in lets say Missouri, and I negligently got an innocent 20 year old co-worker under me killed, I would ask for my resignation, and work somewhere else. There is no way I could fully do my job at the same place with that in the back of my head. That is because I am a human being.

SportsAndLady;548356 wrote:I think his tweet from his iphone while being up there is enough to know that he was asked to do his job like it was any other day.

"Holy fuck holy fuck this is terrifying."

Yeah, that just screams "I want to be up here!!"

I say that on amusement park rides too. My choice to get on in the first place. Not saying that's what happened in Sullivan's case, but a tweet while up there doesn't guarantee that he didn't want to be up there.

Also, if it's naive and arrogant for some ND fans to think it should be a done deal and they wash Kelly's hands from any wrongdoing.....wouldn't it be equally arrogant, etc. of those who assume that Kelly is at fault and that's "case closed" without knowing all of the details?

I think so.

Yes, he should be fired if he is found to be responsible. And I'm going to define being responsible as the person being in charge of practice... (aka the Coach). He doesn't have to had specifically told the student that he needs to be up there. But if it standard that anytime there is outdoor practice, unless said otherwise, there are expected to be people on the lifts operating video equipment.

The only mitigating factors that I could see is if it was a freakishly strong gust and the weather actually wasn't that bad that day (which I don't believe is the case).

When it comes down to it, Brian Kelly is the guy in charge of practice; he's the top dog. The important factor is the severity of the weather conditions and whether or not it will be deemed that it was foreseeable that such an accident could occur. The guidelines for operating a lift like that during the weather conditions are going to be important. What other coaches/people do in those same weather conditions is going to be important.

I really just don't see how this could end well for Brian Kelly.

SportsAndLady;548356 wrote:I think his tweet from his iphone while being up there is enough to know that he was asked to do his job like it was any other day.

"Holy fuck holy fuck this is terrifying."

Yeah, that just screams "I want to be up here!!"

The situation is terrible, and they need an investigation to find out exactly how everything played out. In his own words, he was terrified. Why didn't he just come down?

KR1245;548358 wrote:If the investigation shows that Brian Kelly is responsible should he be fired?

Yes. And I think the results of an investigation are extremely important in a matter such as this...rather than jumping the gun and simply assuming innocence or guilt. That's easy to do.

killer_ewok;548365 wrote:I say that on amusement park rides too. My choice to get on in the first place. Not saying that's what happened in Sullivan's case, but a tweet while up there doesn't guarantee that he didn't want to be up there.

Also, if it's naive and arrogant for some ND fans to think it should be a done deal and they wash Kelly's hands from any wrongdoing.....wouldn't it be equally arrogant, etc. of those who assume that Kelly is at fault and that's "case closed" without knowing all of the details?

I think so.

An amusement ride isn't comparable to your workplace. Poor comparison ewok.

As for your second point, "without knowing all of the details" what details do you think are going to come out that would make Kelly look less negligent? The only thing that could come out would be if the kid was encouraged to come down and he said no he's fine. Like I said, when you tweet holy fuck this is terrifying, and someone says come down, wouldn't you say yes? YES! You would! The only person who truly knows if that happened was Declan himself, and well...

killer_ewok;548370 wrote:Yes. And I think the results of an investigation are extremely important in a matter such as this...rather than jumping the gun and simply assuming innocence or guilt. That's easy to do.

Lol again, the writing is on the wall. There is nothing that will come from an investigation that a) we dont already know or b) is truly factual.