j_crazy;470457 wrote:you know what i mean. they haven't been the same national powerhouse year in and year out since parsghian.

Since Parseghian retired, ND has won 2 national titles. The entire Big Ten has 3 in that time period with no team having more than 1.

Al Bundy;470521 wrote:Since Parseghian retired, ND has won 2 national titles. The entire Big Ten has 3 in that time period with no team having more than 1.

If we are going by OSU math wouldn't it technically be 2.5 national titles??

Al Bundy;470521 wrote:Since Parseghian retired, ND has won 2 national titles. The entire Big Ten has 3 in that time period with no team having more than 1.

true. and there are teams in the big ten that have no earthly business being BCS eligible.

they're in by the same rule that Pitt's in, they are in the BCS conference.

I'm not trying to start an ND vs. Big Ten fight, and i already said that ND deserves their shot at the BCS.

goosebumps;470323 wrote:Site some sort of fact to back up your arguments....

Last year Cincinnati play the season with three quarterback and sweeps through the conference. What other conference could have the undefeated champion start three different quarterbacks?
Watch the bowl game from last year. I don't care if Kelley was coaching or not, Cinci. didn't belong on the field. The only athlete they had that could compete was a receiver.

j_crazy;470558 wrote:true. and there are teams in the big ten that have no earthly business being BCS eligible.

they're in by the same rule that Pitt's in, they are in the BCS conference.

I'm not trying to start an ND vs. Big Ten fight, and i already said that ND deserves their shot at the BCS.

I'm an OSU fan. I just thought it was a little strange to question ND "only" having 2 national title seasons in the 35 years or so since Ara retired. I wish the Buckeyes had 2 or more titles in that same time period.

justcompete;470630 wrote:Last year Cincinnati play the season with three quarterback and sweeps through the conference. What other conference could have the undefeated champion start three different quarterbacks?
Watch the bowl game from last year. I don't care if Kelley was coaching or not, Cinci. didn't belong on the field. The only athlete they had that could compete was a receiver.

OSU has won the B10 with multiple QB's in the past. Florida won a national championship with two QB's. It has happened before. Btw, UC also beat a team that finished third in the Pac10 last yea at their place,, beat a B10 team and a Fresno State team is always competing with the big boys OOC last year so I guess your theory they could only win in the Big East is blown out of the water.

Al Bundy;470639 wrote:I'm an OSU fan. I just thought it was a little strange to question ND "only" having 2 national title seasons in the 35 years or so since Ara retired. I wish the Buckeyes had 2 or more titles in that same time period.

the point i'm trying to make is that the undergraduate students at ND this semester (or quarter or whatever) have not experienced a ND national title in their lifetime. to me that means you're losing relevance. I never tried to discount anything that happened before that, and NEVER brought up OSU as the model that every school should be held to, there is clearly room to improve. but my point remains the same, IMO ND is losing relevancy every year.

wildcats20;470332 wrote:Right.

However, there is a case to be made for them not deserving to be eligible.

The case can certainly be made that based solely on football, the bar should be much higher.

Little Danny;470644 wrote:OSU has won the B10 with multiple QB's in the past. Florida won a national championship with two QB's. It has happened before. Btw, UC also beat a team that finished third in the Pac10 last yea at their place,, beat a B10 team and a Fresno State team is always competing with the big boys OOC last year so I guess your theory they could only win in the Big East is blown out of the water.

The two teams you mention used two QB's in the scheme of their offense. They were not forced into action because of injury. I can't believe you are defending a conference championship team with beating a non BCS team, and two average-at-best teams from other conferences. But, since you are, the way they demolished their conference teams, that doesn't speak too highly of the other teams. Also, I never said they couldn't beat other bcs teams. I said the "conference" is subpar as a whole, thus they shouldn't be in the bcs.

j_crazy;470697 wrote:the point i'm trying to make is that the undergraduate students at ND this semester (or quarter or whatever) have not experienced a ND national title in their lifetime. to me that means you're losing relevance. I never tried to discount anything that happened before that, and NEVER brought up OSU as the model that every school should be held to, there is clearly room to improve. but my point remains the same, IMO ND is losing relevancy every year.

I would then argue that 10 undergraduate classes at OSU hadn't experienced a national title until 2002. Their last title before that was 68. You can't use that kind of argument.

Ask USC, Illinois and Wisconsin if Fresno is not a tough opponent. That average Oregon State had not lost at home OOC since 1996. If they would have beaten Oregon in the Civil War they would have played Ohio State in the Rose Bowl last year. As far as the weak BE goes, the worst team in the BE (Syracuse) beat the 4th place team in the B10 (Northwestern) so what does that say?

Finally, should the Big Ten have lost their automatic bid a few years ago? OSU ran rough-shot over the B10 only to be decimated by the same margin as UC against Florida. What's more, until last season the B10 has not had a lot of success in their bowl games as of late.

My point in all of this is these things all go in cycles. As it stands the Big East has met all of the qualifications to retain their automatic bid. In fact, they have actually had better suces than a couple other conferences, namely the PAC10 and the ACC. In order not to go too far off point, I will refrain from posting up all of the numbers but I could do so if you'd like.

karen lotz;470714 wrote:I would then argue that 10 undergraduate classes at OSU hadn't experienced a national title until 2002. Their last title before that was 68. You can't use that kind of argument.

you'd be spot on and I'd live with it. up until 2002 OSU was exactly how i'm describing Pitt now. good team with good history, but had a way of blowing their oportunities to grab their prominence.