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Republican candidates for 2012

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believer's avatar

believer

Senior Member

8,153 posts
Dec 8, 2011 12:23 AM
majorspark;1006745 wrote:And the war on poverty, crime, illiteracy, and whatever the hell other domestic issue the feds want to make war on.
All great Big Gubmint success stories to be sure. ;)
Dec 8, 2011 12:23am
I

I Wear Pants

Senior Member

16,223 posts
Dec 8, 2011 3:02 AM
majorspark;1006745 wrote:And the war on poverty, crime, illiteracy, and whatever the hell other domestic issue the feds want to make war on.
Maybe it's because war tactics are designed to well, kill people and destroy shit so trying to use them in other capacities doesn't really work.

Don't declare "wars" on shit like drugs, poverty, illiteracy, etc but instead just try to enact the best policies at the best time. The war attitude makes people double down on policies when they've failed instead of saying "you know what, maybe this isn't the best way to go about it". See the entirety of the drug war for evidence.
Dec 8, 2011 3:02am
BGFalcons82's avatar

BGFalcons82

Senior Member

2,173 posts
Dec 8, 2011 3:30 PM
I Wear Pants;1006737 wrote:If you don't think the war on drugs isn't working you should be committed. It's a god damned fact.
Methinks you misunderstood my post. As you know, I'm a huge Chris Christie fan. So to compare his "war on drugs" stance (via the video link) to Ron Paul's stance on legalizing drugs is to say that these 2 aren't so far off each other's plantation, so to speak.

Like any other war, you have to commit everyone, everything, everydime and everypassion into it in order to win it. However, just like politicians that don't listen to their field generals (too many examples here...Truman, Johnson, Clinton in Bosnia, GWB in Afghan and Barry in Afghan), they don't prosecute the war to win it. So we're left with the mess we have today. As Christie states, the original intentions were well-meaning, but the willingness to complete the job has waned over time. Time for a new strategy methinks and so does the governor of New Jersey.
Dec 8, 2011 3:30pm
I

I Wear Pants

Senior Member

16,223 posts
Dec 8, 2011 4:38 PM
The original intentions in the war on drugs were stupid and still are.

Edit: I didn't mean to imply you though the war on drugs was working if that's how my post came off.
Dec 8, 2011 4:38pm
Cleveland Buck's avatar

Cleveland Buck

Troll Hunter

5,126 posts
Dec 11, 2011 1:06 AM
[video=youtube_share;-3QJL6IiNYo][/video]

The good doctor smacked down the kool-aid man tonight, and pretty much dominated. This was his best debate this year so far.
Dec 11, 2011 1:06am
bigdaddy2003's avatar

bigdaddy2003

Senior Member

7,384 posts
Dec 11, 2011 1:15 AM
jmog;1010629 wrote:You really don't want to see a list of the craziest things Obama has said, or Pelosi has said, or Reid has said, or Biden has said...

I could keep going, but come on with that...
This. Plus a couple things on the Newt list are a little over the top. The one about child labor is pretty absurd.
Dec 11, 2011 1:15am
sleeper's avatar

sleeper

Legend

27,879 posts
Dec 11, 2011 2:17 AM
Cleveland Buck;1010875 wrote:[video=youtube_share;-3QJL6IiNYo][/video]

The good doctor smacked down the kool-aid man tonight, and pretty much dominated. This was his best debate this year so far.
He knocked it out of the park, once again.
Dec 11, 2011 2:17am
G

gut

Senior Member

15,058 posts
Dec 11, 2011 2:29 AM
sleeper;1010894 wrote:He knocked it out of the park, once again.
Far from a perfect candidate, but maybe the best of the Repub lot. Some of his ideas are a bit draconian, but maybe that's what we need to offset the stupidity of Congress. Ending-up somewhere in the middle between him and Congress might be a pretty good outcome.

I just struggle to get past how he aligned himself with the FairTax people in 2008 (toned it down a ton this go-around, but it's still there). He's up there pumping a lot of true conservative ideals, but seems to largely lack a plan with how to get there (and if FairTax is your answer, this guy could be an unmitigated disaster).
Dec 11, 2011 2:29am
sleeper's avatar

sleeper

Legend

27,879 posts
Dec 11, 2011 12:28 PM
gut;1010898 wrote:Far from a perfect candidate, but maybe the best of the Repub lot.
Exactly. I don't like all of his policies, but I think his foreign policy is rock solid and is consistent with his beliefs that the government is too big and spends too much money.

The problem with Ron Paul is his policies are easy to twist into something that they are not. Like for example, when he says "Get rid of the Dept of Education!", this translate to people as "Get rid of education!". Or when he says "Let's trade and talk with Iran instead of going to war with them", people translate this as "Ron Paul is trying to friends with people who want to Nuke us!'.

It's pathetic, but its the irrational world we live in.
Dec 11, 2011 12:28pm
Belly35's avatar

Belly35

Elderly Intellectual

9,716 posts
Dec 11, 2011 1:18 PM
Hey! How about having the Democrat candidate be ask question the public wants to ask without the usage of teleprompters and pre-determined questions..
Is that to much to ask of the mofo Democrat Public Servant ….
Dec 11, 2011 1:18pm
I

I Wear Pants

Senior Member

16,223 posts
Dec 11, 2011 2:09 PM
sleeper;1011071 wrote:Exactly. I don't like all of his policies, but I think his foreign policy is rock solid and is consistent with his beliefs that the government is too big and spends too much money.

The problem with Ron Paul is his policies are easy to twist into something that they are not. Like for example, when he says "Get rid of the Dept of Education!", this translate to people as "Get rid of education!". Or when he says "Let's trade and talk with Iran instead of going to war with them", people translate this as "Ron Paul is trying to friends with people who want to Nuke us!'.

It's pathetic, but its the irrational world we live in.
This is true about Ron Paul.
Dec 11, 2011 2:09pm
Cleveland Buck's avatar

Cleveland Buck

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5,126 posts
Dec 11, 2011 2:15 PM
gut;1010898 wrote:Far from a perfect candidate, but maybe the best of the Repub lot. Some of his ideas are a bit draconian, but maybe that's what we need to offset the stupidity of Congress. Ending-up somewhere in the middle between him and Congress might be a pretty good outcome.

I just struggle to get past how he aligned himself with the FairTax people in 2008 (toned it down a ton this go-around, but it's still there). He's up there pumping a lot of true conservative ideals, but seems to largely lack a plan with how to get there (and if FairTax is your answer, this guy could be an unmitigated disaster).
He supports anything that reduces taxes on the people and eliminates the income tax. That was the extent of his support for it. Ideally we wouldn't have a sales tax or income tax and the federal government would operate on excise taxes and non-protectionist tariffs. (Yes that means the size of government is the problem, not finding a way to maximize tax revenue.)
Dec 11, 2011 2:15pm
sleeper's avatar

sleeper

Legend

27,879 posts
Dec 11, 2011 8:39 PM
http://swampland.time.com/2011/12/09/ron-pauls-army-eyes-an-iowa-caucus-upset/?hpt=hp_bn3

I love this about Ron Paul. He's got the best grassroots political movement in the country. Even if he doesn't get elected, he's inspiring and educating younger Americans about being fiscally responsible and caring about true liberty and the constitution. I hope he wins, and if he takes Iowa, it could be smooth sailing from there.
Dec 11, 2011 8:39pm
I

I Wear Pants

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16,223 posts
Dec 11, 2011 8:47 PM
If it's Paul vs Obama I'm voting Paul unless he turns batshit crazy overnight at some point which seems unlikely. And the GOP should understand that as well, they can steal a lot of votes from Obama if they go with Paul.
Dec 11, 2011 8:47pm
BGFalcons82's avatar

BGFalcons82

Senior Member

2,173 posts
Dec 11, 2011 9:04 PM
For those that think Dr. Paul never mis-speaks, I offer - http://www.theblaze.com/stories/ron-paul-bush-administration-was-gleeful-after-911-attacks/

Really, Ron. George Bush had glee after 911? Huh....the only glee I remember after 911 was Al Jezeera showing footage of Muslims in the streets of the Middle East dancing with joy over the deaths of thousands. Anyone have a link to a story about Bush being gleeful?
Dec 11, 2011 9:04pm
I

I Wear Pants

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Dec 11, 2011 9:13 PM
He said the administration. And I'm sure there were those in it that were.
Dec 11, 2011 9:13pm
BGFalcons82's avatar

BGFalcons82

Senior Member

2,173 posts
Dec 11, 2011 9:16 PM
I Wear Pants;1011736 wrote:He said the administration. And I'm sure there were those in it that were.
Oh...that makes it alright then. I'm sure there was one person running up and down the halls of the White House jumping for joy, excluse me..."gleeful", that after 3,000 unprovoked deaths, George would be able to avenge his daddy's failure for getting Saddam. :rolleyes:

Got it.
Dec 11, 2011 9:16pm
I

I Wear Pants

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Dec 11, 2011 9:17 PM
Wouldn't be surprised if Rumsfeld or Cheney were gleeful.
Dec 11, 2011 9:17pm
fish82's avatar

fish82

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4,111 posts
Dec 11, 2011 9:45 PM
I Wear Pants;1011744 wrote:Wouldn't be surprised if Rumsfeld or Cheney were gleeful.
I'm sure you wouldn't.
Dec 11, 2011 9:45pm
pmoney25's avatar

pmoney25

Senior Member

1,787 posts
Dec 11, 2011 9:47 PM
I wouldn't really be surprised honestly about anything anymore when it comes to these politicians. Do I think anyone was happy that 911 happened? Definitely not unless they have no soul. Do I think that some people in the administration got a hard on knowing they could now pretty much attack anyone with very little evidence? Absolutely
Dec 11, 2011 9:47pm
I

I Wear Pants

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16,223 posts
Dec 11, 2011 10:26 PM
^^^ That's what I meant.
Dec 11, 2011 10:26pm
Cleveland Buck's avatar

Cleveland Buck

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5,126 posts
Dec 11, 2011 10:35 PM
BGFalcons82;1011724 wrote:For those that think Dr. Paul never mis-speaks, I offer - http://www.theblaze.com/stories/ron-paul-bush-administration-was-gleeful-after-911-attacks/

Really, Ron. George Bush had glee after 911? Huh....the only glee I remember after 911 was Al Jezeera showing footage of Muslims in the streets of the Middle East dancing with joy over the deaths of thousands. Anyone have a link to a story about Bush being gleeful?
Did he say they were gleeful about 9/11? Or that they were gleeful about the opportunity to invade Iraq, which they were. He already clarified this in several interviews that day.
Dec 11, 2011 10:35pm