vball10set;635397 wrote:http://www.toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20110112/COLUMNIST08/101120308

Scarlet_Buckeye;635514 wrote:Excellent article. Hit the nail on the head.

Yep. RR left the program is shambles. A huge reason why Harbaugh or Miles did not take up the offer.

My whole point a few pages ago was Hoke is not going to lead the program back to Michigan levels, where Michigan wins 9-10-11 games each year. He will probably peak at 8. So, once he gets several good seasons in, but starts to level off for some years straight (maybe 3 straight 6 7 win years), Michigan needs to pull the trigger on that coach that will bring them back up to that elite level. Then it is will be easier to grab that top coach as the job will look better.


I think it is the right approach really.

ptown_trojans_1;635623 wrote:Yep. RR left the program is shambles. A huge reason why Harbaugh or Miles did not take up the offer.

My whole point a few pages ago was Hoke is not going to lead the program back to Michigan levels, where Michigan wins 9-10-11 games each year. He will probably peak at 8. So, once he gets several good seasons in, but starts to level off for some years straight (maybe 3 straight 6 7 win years), Michigan needs to pull the trigger on that coach that will bring them back up to that elite level. Then it is will be easier to grab that top coach as the job will look better.


I think it is the right approach really.

Just curious why you'll think he'll peak at 8?

I don't buy that Harbaugh and Miles didn't go to UM due to the cupboard being bare. It may have contributed but Harbaugh was destined for the NFL and struck while the iron was hot. Mile's old lady wanted to stay in Baton Rouge, they have high school aged kids and didn't want to uproot them, plus it's sounding pretty loudly that Brandon may not have offered him anyway.

Hoke will be fine, he wants to be there and will def. give it his best shot.

ytownfootball;635638 wrote:I Hoke will be fine, he wants to be there and will def. give it his best shot.

IMO, this says it all

WebFire;635629 wrote:Just curious why you'll think he'll peak at 8?

Just my view he is not an elite coach. He hasn't shown it yet. He may be and I might be wrong.
Tressel at least had national titles at the lower level. Hoke has turned around programs, which is what he is doing here, but he has yet to prove he can really win at an elite level.

Don't get me wrong, I like the hire, but I see it as a short and medium term solution.
But, again, I could be wrong.

I think turning a program upwards with the caliber of players you're going to get at SD St. isn't too bad though. Not like he'd be looking at a BCS bowl with the talent he'd be getting there.

"When we got to San Diego State, they were ranked 119th in Defense. A year later, we are ranked in the 40s with the same group of kids."

I know SDSU and MWC =/= Michigan and B1G, but that excites me.

It's just a press conference, but I am eating up what Hoke is saying.

Also, Dave Brandon has been taking some under handed shots at Rich Rodriguez and a few other coaches during this press conference. It's somewhat comical.

He's also dodging questions that are pertaining to Les Miles and the rest of the coaching search.

He was really taking shots at Harbaugh and Miles mostly. Not a big fan of it really.

He was saying things about having someone who has never been in the area wouldn't succeed here. I believe it was something about parachuting someone into Ann Arbor.

He said something about Brady doesn't need a map of the city of campus... I don't think Les and Jim would either. Then, he said something about having a guy come in and say he was going to run 1 type of offense and 1 type only and make due with what players he was given makes it very hard to win. I thought those were all shots at RR. Yea, there were some things about JH and LM as well.

I didn't say that I approved of it, but it was somewhat funny to say the least.

Tate Forcier is no longer with Michigan.

we all know Forcier is no longer at Michigan, it was posted days ago. He was gone even if RR was still around.

I heard Hoke is considering offering Lloyd a job as a defensive coach. Not D-coordinator but more of a bridge to help the program the next couple years. Not exactly sure what it would be.

WebFire;635776 wrote:He was really taking shots at Harbaugh and Miles mostly. Not a big fan of it really.

Why would he take shots at Harbaugh and Miles?

Judging by Hoke's interview by Gus Johnson, sounds like Denard will be staying. Obviously that could change but he sounded pretty confident.

Yea. It's already been stated the his OC is adaptable. I'd say we'll see 60-70% of a variation of RR's system. I can't really think of anyone to compare to what we will see next year.

ytownfootball;635658 wrote:I think turning a program upwards with the caliber of players you're going to get at SD St. isn't too bad though. Not like he'd be looking at a BCS bowl with the talent he'd be getting there.

Right, and as I've always said, that makes what teams like Boise State and TCU do on a yearly basis so impressive. They really are a lot more limited in the players they can attract, and what they have to work with when it comes to recruiting. Same for SDSU. It's not like you can just go after the 3, 4 and 5* guys like OSU, Alabama, Florida, Texas etc can just because of their reputation. If Michigan can have a good year or two, they CAN do that and that's a luxury Hoke has never had at Ball State or SDSU. He is a Michigan guy, was on the staff when they won their last NC (which I think is important), he has recruited the midwest before both as an assistant at UM and at Ball State, he understands the rivalry, and he's shown that he can take limited resources and take them from being terrible to making them halfway respectable. I think it says a LOT about a coach who can take a midmajor who consistently finishes in the bottom 25% of their league, which both Ball State and SDSU had done for YEARS before he took over both programs, and turn them into bowl-caliber teams. Not sure every coach can do that. It's pretty easy to get recruits at big-time programs because of their reputation and national exposure. All kids have heard of Michigan...not sure you can say the same about a kid from the midwest ever seeing or watching San Diego State play football. I think Hoke is a good hire, and I think he'll bring back a little substance to "the game" that has been missing the past several years with RR, just because everyone knows Hoke is a UM guy and he has ties to the rivalry. I think like all coaches, a little success the first few seasons would help him greatly to get the momentum rolling and get back some of their top-tier in-state recruits that they've been losing out on lately, especially on defense. And I think he'll turn around the defense first and foremost. I think he understands how important having a solid defense is in a conference like the B10. As an OSU fan, I think Michigan got a good hire...it's not always the "big" name that you need to get that turns out to be the best coach...look at Florida and Urban Meyer, or of course, OSU hiring Tressel who most casual fans had never heard of before he was considered for the position. I think LM being a Michigan guy was the obvious get, and when that didn't happen, I think Hoke was the next best choice and they got him. Not bad, considering a lot of schools have to go to their 3rd, 4th or even 5th choice sometimes. I think Harbaugh really had no interest, with his brother being a successful NFL coach, I think he has his sights set there and thinks he can be too, so I don't consider that an option for UM, because he never really considered them as a real option.

Denard's HS coach now saying he will probably stay.

Ideally I'd like to see a similar offense to last year with Gardner getting about as much playing time as Tate did this past year. Then in 2012 use Denard all over the field. Returning kicks, QB, slot, rb so he can get drafted.

Robinson was attendance tonight at the game and seemed happy. I'd say it is unlikely he transfers

The best news to UM fans (if it were me) would be that the new OC is adaptable. RR inflexibility cost them recruits, existing players and more importantly wins. Denard staying has got to be a plus, there will still be offensive excitement and highlights on ESPN to keep recruits interested.

bigkahuna;635822 wrote:He was saying things about having someone who has never been in the area wouldn't succeed here. I believe it was something about parachuting someone into Ann Arbor.

He said something about Brady doesn't need a map of the city of campus... I don't think Les and Jim would either. Then, he said something about having a guy come in and say he was going to run 1 type of offense and 1 type only and make due with what players he was given makes it very hard to win. I thought those were all shots at RR. Yea, there were some things about JH and LM as well.

I didn't say that I approved of it, but it was somewhat funny to say the least.

Yes, he took shots are RR too. Didn't mean to dispute that. But the shot at Les and Jim stuck out to me.

Tiger2003;635898 wrote:Tate Forcier is no longer with Michigan.

Word on the street is that Tate is enrolled in community college and will be reapplying at Michigan after completion if some classes. At this point I'm not sure if that is for football reasons or not. I would assume he wants to play football somewhere.

elbuckeye28;635925 wrote:Why would he take shots at Harbaugh and Miles?

Because he doesn't like either and they somewhat took shots at Michigan with actions and/or comments.

dave;635908 wrote:I heard Hoke is considering offering Lloyd a job as a defensive coach. Not D-coordinator but more of a bridge to help the program the next couple years. Not exactly sure what it would be.

I hope this is untrue. Lloyd is part of that problem with the athletic department at UM right now.

WebFire;636413 wrote:I hope this is untrue. Lloyd is part of that problem with the athletic department at UM right now.

Maybe so, but he can also be part of the solution. I guess Hoke spoke to many former players and the current team, and Lloyd was a topic brought up repeatedly.