Cleveland Cavaliers 2020-2021

33,369 posts 121 reps Joined Nov 2009
Fri, Jul 30, 2021 9:40 AM

Why trade a 23 year old defensive stud who has grown his offensive game year after year? You're gonna have to play a second big with Mobley most likely, anyway. Mobley and Allen can both switch and guard the smaller players, I dont understand why you think playing them together wont work long-term? 

Now, they need shooting around them in the worst way. I know they've been trying, but Id continue to try and flip Sexton for that. Garland is near 40% and improving, just needs to take more. Ice needs to get better from behind the Arc (~35% this year would be awesome). Sexton needs to get a little better if they keep him, but mostly needs to shoot the 3 more. Hes a walking bucket, but the shots he takes for the most part are losing shots. Mix in about 6-7 threes a game and that would be a drastic improvment over the 4.4 this year.

kizer permanente Senior Member
1,309 posts 15 reps Joined Aug 2017
Fri, Jul 30, 2021 10:09 AM
posted by Laley23

Why trade a 23 year old defensive stud who has grown his offensive game year after year? You're gonna have to play a second big with Mobley most likely, anyway. Mobley and Allen can both switch and guard the smaller players, I dont understand why you think playing them together wont work long-term? 

Now, they need shooting around them in the worst way. I know they've been trying, but Id continue to try and flip Sexton for that. Garland is near 40% and improving, just needs to take more. Ice needs to get better from behind the Arc (~35% this year would be awesome). Sexton needs to get a little better if they keep him, but mostly needs to shoot the 3 more. Hes a walking bucket, but the shots he takes for the most part are losing shots. Mix in about 6-7 threes a game and that would be a drastic improvment over the 4.4 this year.

To get more shooting. I’d rather keep Sexton and get rid of Allen and get some outside shooting. Allen is good on D but it’s not like Mobley can’t be a rim protector. Allens skillset is more easily replaced than Sextons is IMO 


33,369 posts 121 reps Joined Nov 2009
Fri, Jul 30, 2021 11:53 AM
posted by kizer permanente

To get more shooting. I’d rather keep Sexton and get rid of Allen and get some outside shooting. Allen is good on D but it’s not like Mobley can’t be a rim protector. Allens skillset is more easily replaced than Sextons is IMO 


Completely disagree. I like Sexton more than most. But 30 guys in the league averaged 20ppg last year. 20 averaged 24ppg. He isn't a knockdown shooter defenses have to honor so they can go under the screen. He isnt the greatest (or most willing) passer, so defenders can play him on the drives without worrying about many lobs or kick-outs. He's a fantastic finisher, but if that's the only threat, its still easy to defend. He is a willing defender, but he's not good at it. 

His offensive rating is only 104 while his defensive rating 114, both rank towards the bottom of the league. Now, these numbers aren't the end all as the team as a whole was obviously bad. But if you are going to be the dominant ball-handler, you need to shoot and make more 3s and create more offense on drives. You cant be a ball stopper the way he is unless you are doing special things offensively, which he isn't. Hence why is ORTG is so low (lowest on the team, of guys who matter). 

ALL of these things are correctable, particularly looking to create on drives and shooting from distance more. His defense is what it is at this point, I assume. He does get fouled a ton, which is great. But the problem I see with him is how easily replaceable scoring is and can even improve on the efficiency with someone who shoots more/better. Garland is the guard to keep. The last month or 2 for him were numbers than project as a guy you build around. 

As for Allen, he already does so much for a big man that typically takes longer to learn. And he doesn't foul. If he develops an actual jumped off the pick-and-roll that would be next level. But he already has a nice floater game, not typically seen from big man on the catch. 

Id much prefer to keep and develop Allen than Sexton if it came down to it. Particularly because I'm not sure how much development anyone will get with Sexton on the court. 

friendfromlowry Senior Member
7,778 posts 74 reps Joined Nov 2009
Mon, Aug 2, 2021 6:52 PM

Sorry Kizer. Jarrett Allen resigning for 5 years.

33,369 posts 121 reps Joined Nov 2009
Mon, Aug 2, 2021 10:21 PM
posted by friendfromlowry

Sorry Kizer. Jarrett Allen resigning for 5 years.

5 years at $100M seems like a steal. 


kizer permanente Senior Member
1,309 posts 15 reps Joined Aug 2017
Tue, Aug 3, 2021 7:29 AM
posted by friendfromlowry

Sorry Kizer. Jarrett Allen resigning for 5 years.

eh...

I guess I just don't understand playing 2 centers in modern NBA.  Especially since we have a guard in Sexton whos offense is attacking the rim.  Seems counter productive to actually wanting to win games.

Al Bundy Senior Member
4,526 posts 39 reps Joined Nov 2009
Tue, Aug 3, 2021 7:45 AM
posted by kizer permanente

eh...

I guess I just don't understand playing 2 centers in modern NBA.  Especially since we have a guard in Sexton whos offense is attacking the rim.  Seems counter productive to actually wanting to win games.

They think that mobley is a 4 in the NBA.

friendfromlowry Senior Member
7,778 posts 74 reps Joined Nov 2009
Tue, Aug 3, 2021 7:50 AM

This is probably the most optimistic I’ve felt about them in years. Seems like they finally have a few good things going.

33,369 posts 121 reps Joined Nov 2009
Tue, Aug 3, 2021 9:44 AM
posted by kizer permanente

eh...

I guess I just don't understand playing 2 centers in modern NBA.  Especially since we have a guard in Sexton whos offense is attacking the rim.  Seems counter productive to actually wanting to win games.

Mobley. Is. Not. A. Center. He is a 4 who will occasionally play C. 

Literally the last 3 NBA Champions have played 2 C/F. Toronto with Ibaka/Gasol, Lakers with AD/Dwight (Javale) and Milwaukee with Lopez/Giannis. 

kizer permanente Senior Member
1,309 posts 15 reps Joined Aug 2017
Tue, Aug 3, 2021 10:54 AM
posted by Laley23

Mobley. Is. Not. A. Center. He is a 4 who will occasionally play C. 

Literally the last 3 NBA Champions have played 2 C/F. Toronto with Ibaka/Gasol, Lakers with AD/Dwight (Javale) and Milwaukee with Lopez/Giannis. 

Yeah I've read he's more of a KD type of player, or at least potential to be. I'll be cautiously optimistic for that. I still don't see how that fits with Sexton. Maybe we should see what we can get for him, like you said. We'll still need outside shooting, not a rim attacker guard. 

kizer permanente Senior Member
1,309 posts 15 reps Joined Aug 2017
Tue, Aug 3, 2021 11:15 AM

looking at his tape.. I defintely don't see KD. I see Bosh though. 

33,369 posts 121 reps Joined Nov 2009
Tue, Aug 3, 2021 11:39 AM
posted by kizer permanente

looking at his tape.. I defintely don't see KD. I see Bosh though. 

Hes not KD. He is AD. 

33,369 posts 121 reps Joined Nov 2009
Tue, Aug 3, 2021 11:42 AM
posted by kizer permanente

Yeah I've read he's more of a KD type of player, or at least potential to be. I'll be cautiously optimistic for that. I still don't see how that fits with Sexton. Maybe we should see what we can get for him, like you said. We'll still need outside shooting, not a rim attacker guard. 

I've only read the AD comparisons. Never have seen a KD one. He has about equal handles to KD, but not the shooting. Has almost as good of defensive metrics as AD (basically, the second best since around 2005 behind AD). He definitely has the skill and shot form to develop the same way AD has with the turn-arounds, foul-line jumpers and occasional (ie, open) 3pt. But, he wont ever be KD running the break and pulling up in LBJs eyes for a dagger 3. Much more AD like in his game, but a little bit more versatile on offense at this stage of career because of his handles and ability to initiate the offense.

33,369 posts 121 reps Joined Nov 2009
Thu, Aug 12, 2021 11:48 AM

Some of those Mobley passes last night were great. I don't expect him to be bulked up until year 2, but hoping he can get a bit more weight on him before the season starts. He knows thats the main focus right now, based on his postgane commetns.

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