Why no school shooter thread?

This will add fuel to the fire:

PARKLAND, Fla. (AP) — Leader of white nationalist group has confirmed suspect in Florida school shooting was member of his organization.

posted by queencitybuckeye

There are millions of good guys who own AR-15s. If the world is falling apart, it ain't their fault.

Indeed. The most popular rifle in the country, with millions in circulation, but due to a dozen or so psychopaths all of us that own them are bad guys. 

posted by ptown_trojans_1

This will add fuel to the fire:

PARKLAND, Fla. (AP) — Leader of white nationalist group has confirmed suspect in Florida school shooting was member of his organization.

I mean, he killed white people too..  So I'm not sure what this has to do with the shooting. Other than verify he's a fuck head.

posted by kizer permanente

I mean, he killed white people too..  So I'm not sure what this has to do with the shooting. Other than verify he's a fuck head.

Similar to ISIS claiming credit for acts of terror regardless of whether it's true?

posted by ptown_trojans_1

We do live in the same world.  I meant to say the policy makers and people that have influence do not agree that it is a problem we need to solve. 

Sure, I agree, it is complicated, but we cannot even get to have the discussion about all the nuances or complex portions of the problem to get to potential solutions from those people of power/ influence. 

Maybe it's time to stop looking to government for a solution? It seems like we, as a society, lean too heavily on a system that has shown time and time again that it really doesn't give a shit about anything but expanding its own power and influence. Or maybe I'm just too cynical when it comes to government.

posted by queencitybuckeye

Similar to ISIS claiming credit for acts of terror regardless of whether it;'s true?

Right.. and it's a weird thing to claim unless you're a terrorist cell like ISIS who wants these deaths. Not that a white nationalist group is a beacon of light. Just weird to claim to me.

I want to see the stats that say your 50 % more likely to die from a gun than a car wreck.

posted by thavoice

I want to see the stats that say your 50 % more likely to die from a gun than a car wreck.

From my quick look, you are more likely to die by car than gun IN GENERAL, even when they include suicide and justifiable homicides. Much less once you take the stupid suicide stat out.

posted by thavoice

I want to see the stats that say your 50 % more likely to die from a gun than a car wreck.

http://www.businessinsider.com/gun-death-statistics-assault-mass-shootings-accidents-2017-10

posted by justincredible

Maybe it's time to stop looking to government for a solution? ...

Agreed.  I we the people really want it solved we can keep it from happening but that would take vigilant effort of societies part.

posted by justincredible

I've read that the FBI knew about the kid, and spoke to someone who reported his comments on a youtube video, saying he was going to be a "professional school shooter" or something similar, yet this still happened. WTF was the FBI doing in between? Did they not think to make a visit to the kid directly? People were literally joking this kid was eventually going to shoot up a school, yet nothing was done.

Busy playing partisan politics...

There are also reports that this kid allegedly was sympathizer with middle east resistance groups.  There were plenty of red flags.  If he got his gun legally, the FBI knew about it or should have.  

posted by Automatik

But too often this happens and the "gun weirdos" throw up there hands like "well that's just the way it is!" Even the thought of addressing the issue sparks outrage. It's unreal. 

Probably because it is way too easy to poke holes (with actual data and logic) in most arguments for gun control.  If you look at the majority of where gun crime comes stems from, I think we could make try a couple solutions that would drop the statistics significantly.

Also, how about we actually enforce the laws we already have in place, before we throw out more laws that will not work?  All of these red flags and the FBI acknowledged this kid as a threat.  

posted by kizer permanente

http://www.businessinsider.com/gun-death-statistics-assault-mass-shootings-accidents-2017-10

There is a reason why people dont believe the anti gun people when the bring out stats like this.

That article states 11,000 die a year due to guns, more or less.

If you look up the stats for traffic fatalites, in 2016 there were over 37,000 people killed in auto accidents, and average of 104 a day.

One can fanagle stats many ways to prove their own agenda.   

Last I looked 37,461 > 11,000

posted by kizer permanente

http://www.businessinsider.com/gun-death-statistics-assault-mass-shootings-accidents-2017-10

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/12/17/guns-are-now-killing-as-many-people-as-cars-in-the-u-s/?utm_term=.1177bdac9c6e

Those stats make no sense. Almost every source say that gun and car accidents are almost identical in 2014 per 100k. And that includes the skewed suicides and justifiable homicides. Unless they are making up odds because of how many people own guns vs cars it doesn't make sense.

https://crimeresearch.org/2015/01/are-guns-more-likely-to-kill-you-than-a-car-is-no/ Also

posted by like_that

Busy playing partisan politics...

There are also reports that this kid allegedly was sympathizer with middle east resistance groups.  There were plenty of red flags.  If he got his gun legally, the FBI knew about it or should have.  

 

posted by Automatik

But too often this happens and the "gun weirdos" throw up there hands like "well that's just the way it is!" Even the thought of addressing the issue sparks outrage. It's unreal. 

Probably because it is way too easy to poke holes (with actual data and logic) in most arguments for gun control.  If you look at the majority of where gun crime comes stems from, I think we could make try a couple solutions that would drop the statistics significantly.

 

Also, how about we actually enforce the laws we already have in place, before we throw out more laws that will not work?  All of these red flags and the FBI acknowledged this kid as a threat.  

 

The FBI needs to get hammered for this. Same shit with the terrorists who were also "flagged"

At this point what does flagging them even mean? Honest question, because I have no idea.

Not to mention it stats you are more likely killed by an asteroid attack than a dog attack.

posted by iclfan2

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/12/17/guns-are-now-killing-as-many-people-as-cars-in-the-u-s/?utm_term=.1177bdac9c6e

Those stats make no sense. Almost every source say that gun and car accidents are almost identical in 2014 per 100k. And that includes the skewed suicides and justifiable homicides. Unless they are making up odds because of how many people own guns vs cars it doesn't make sense.

Yeah I'm not sure what formula was used to figure those stats.

posted by iclfan2

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/12/17/guns-are-now-killing-as-many-people-as-cars-in-the-u-s/?utm_term=.1177bdac9c6e

Those stats make no sense. Almost every source say that gun and car accidents are almost identical in 2014 per 100k. And that includes the skewed suicides and justifiable homicides. Unless they are making up odds because of how many people own guns vs cars it doesn't make sense.

Its a BS article pushing the antti gun agenda..34K die on the roads per year, over 100 a day....not to mention they talk about dieing from asteroids striking....

posted by thavoice

Its a BS article pushing the antti gun agenda..34K die on the roads per year, over 100 a day....not to mention they talk about dieing from asteroids striking....

I would guess if an asteroid hit you and a dog bit you, you definitely ARE more likely to die from the asteroid. 
Maybe that's how they look at it?

posted by Automatik

The FBI needs to get hammered for this. Same shit with the terrorists who were also "flagged"

At this point what does flagging them even mean? Honest question, because I have no idea.

All background check are ran through the NICS database, ran by the FBI. When you buy a gun, you fill out a form and the store calls into the NICS hotline with your name, ssn (optional), and birthdate (I think). They run a check against their system and approve or deny the sale. If this guy was known by the FBI he should not have been able to legally purchase a firearm. So he either purchased it before they knew about him, and they never followed up knowing that he had purchased a firearm. Or they failed to flag him in the system. Either way, it's a bad look for the FBI.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Instant_Criminal_Background_Check_System

posted by Automatik

The FBI needs to get hammered for this. Same shit with the terrorists who were also "flagged"

At this point what does flagging them even mean? Honest question, because I have no idea.

Apparently it doesn't mean shit these days.

posted by thavoice

 

posted by kizer permanente

http://www.businessinsider.com/gun-death-statistics-assault-mass-shootings-accidents-2017-10

There is a reason why people dont believe the anti gun people when the bring out stats like this.

 

That article states 11,000 die a year due to guns, more or less.

 

If you look up the stats for traffic fatalites, in 2016 there were over 37,000 people killed in auto accidents, and average of 104 a day.

 

One can fanagle stats many ways to prove their own agenda.   

 

Last I looked 37,461 > 11,000

I'm forced to actually agree with thavoice.  Everything I have ever read or heard is we are more likely to die from a car crash than a gun shot.  If you stay out of violent areas, the odds are even more in your favor.

And yes, being dishonest about the gun debate is why the "gun weirdos" dig in for their arguments.  You might think they are "weirdos"  (god forbid law abiding citizens excercise/show support for their 2nd amendment rights), but most know a lot about guns and the data that comes with it.  Don't come in with some weak bullshit argument without thinking it thru or researching it.