Vaccine conversations have gotten to the point at which I just can't bring myself to discuss it with anyone I know personally.
You fuckers, on the other hand ... ;)
Seriously, what's your take on vaccines and the legality around them?
I voted.
Per your tl;dr rant on health care, isn't making something mandatory (like vaccinations) a violation of rights?
posted by ernest_t_bassPer your tl;dr rant on health care, isn't making something mandatory (like vaccinations) a violation of rights?
Perhaps.
Government should not make them mandatory. However, the government should put a stamp on your forehead that says "unclean.".
I don’t think they should be mandatory, but I don’t think your kid should be allowed in daycares or school without it. We all had to have certain shots to go to college, why is this different?
And all the dumb moms who don’t vaccinate were probly all vaccinated. It really doesn’t make any sense.
Mid your kid gets polio, you should be sent to jail.
posted by iclfan2I don’t think they should be mandatory, but I don’t think your kid should be allowed in daycares or school without it. We all had to have certain shots to go to college, why is this different?
And all the dumb moms who don’t vaccinate were probly all vaccinated. It really doesn’t make any sense.
Re the moms against vaccinations - I know one lady in particular who is dead-set against vaccinations. She's constantly posting how thinks there's some conspiracy afoot about an increase in autistic diagnosises. What's weird is that her kids are now around 30, and I'm pretty sure they didn't get to go to kindergarten thru high school without those shots.
I do see an interesting correlation: The women I know warning of vaccine dangers are the same ones who are flocking to these "essential oils" as a cure-all for whatever ails you - where they used to go Longaberger or Tupperware conventions, now they travel to hear the gospel of essential oils and post updates how they have cleansed their home from harmful cleaners.
I don't remember Ohio State requiring shots when I went there in 1976?
I voted that are good and should be mandatory, although would have been better if it was worded "probably" mandatory. I personally think that autism is just as over-diagnosed at ADHD was. I know that there are legitimate cases, but 100% legit? Nope. So I think making the connection from one to the other is kinda ... iffy.
Good and should be optional. Personal choice.
Good, optional. But, without them, your kids cannot attend public school. And if I were running a private facility dealing with kids I wouldn't accept unvaccinated children. Basically, the govt shouldn't mandate them, but the market should make it pretty clear they are necessary.
As one of those who believes in the Non-Aggression Principal (NAP) which is a cornerstone of the Libertarian movement, this is a gray area for me. The simple answer is "you do you and let me do me", expressed by "if your kids are vaccinated, you need not be concerned with mine". This however doesn't take into account the diseases that re-emerge in the un-vaccinated group and mutate into a form that makes the current vaccines less effective. So is the NAP based purely on intent, or can there be violations based on negligence?
It's a public health hazard, so I say mandatory. We eliminated polio and other diseases by making the vaccines mandatory and framed them as a public health issue.
If you like your kid to have any access to public schools or daycare, for the good of the country, they need to be vaccinated.
There was a PBS documentary some time ago about the eradication of polio. It is pretty interesting.
posted by ZunardoI do see an interesting correlation: The women I know warning of vaccine dangers are the same ones who are flocking to these "essential oils" as a cure-all for whatever ails you - where they used to go Longaberger or Tupperware conventions, now they travel to hear the gospel of essential oils and post updates how they have cleansed their home from harmful cleaners.
My wife has a friend who is always talking about how greedy doctors and big pharma are. Then she turns around and tries to sell essential oils...
Mandatory. Caregivers who don't vaccinate their children should be punished by law. There is no science-backed controversy here. Failure to vaccinate is medical neglect.
Mandatory, essentially child abuse/neglect and a massive public health concern. No science that backs up their beliefs so there aren't two sides to this.
I live in a state with an actual measles outbreak because of these idiots.
Mandatory. It's not a personal issue when it affects everyone else. It's a public health issue.
You can't mandate someone putting something into their body. So instead of making the vaccinations mandate, just limit the public things that people can do... like public school, driver's licenses, etc.
posted by ernest_t_bassYou can't mandate someone putting something into their body. So instead of making the vaccinations mandate, just limit the public things that people can do... like public school, driver's licenses, etc.
Well you can’t mandate someone puts food in their body either but you can prosecute parents who don’t put food in their kids body.
posted by kizer permanenteWell you can’t mandate someone puts food in their body either but you can prosecute parents who don’t put food in their kids body.
In his defense, I can see a nuance between the two.
First, there's a distinction between the two with regard to the forgone conclusion that results:
If you don't put food in a child's body, they will die. The odds are 100%.
If you don't put vaccines in a child's body, the child might be fine, as might all the children around him or her. It's not definitive that the child will die or even experience any detriment whatsoever.
Second, vaccinations are single, one-offs. Feeding is ongoing.
You can't prosecute the parents for not feeding a child until it causes articulable harm. If I send Johnny to bed without dinner because he set the cat on fire, I don't think I can be prosecuted.
As to that second point, I could see a link made based on that idea of harm. Just like with food, maybe parents should be able to be prosecuted if their failure to do so results in harm.
posted by O-Trap
If you don't put vaccines in a child's body, the child might be fine, as might all the children around him or her. It's not definitive that the child will die or even experience any detriment whatsoever.
Did you just assign binary gender names to children?! ;)
posted by O-TrapIn his defense, I can see a nuance between the two.
First, there's a distinction between the two with regard to the forgone conclusion that results:
If you don't put food in a child's body, they will die. The odds are 100%.
If you don't put vaccines in a child's body, the child might be fine, as might all the children around him or her. It's not definitive that the child will die or even experience any detriment whatsoever.
Second, vaccinations are single, one-offs. Feeding is ongoing.
You can't prosecute the parents for not feeding a child until it causes articulable harm. If I send Johnny to bed without dinner because he set the cat on fire, I don't think I can be prosecuted.
As to that second point, I could see a link made based on that idea of harm. Just like with food, maybe parents should be able to be prosecuted if their failure to do so results in harm.
No I agree... We shouldn't prosecute them until their kid is injured or dies. We currently don't.... But we need to. And after it happens enough anti-vaxxers will fear the repercussions and abide. Will all? Of course not. But facing punishment, I think you'll see the ball shift in the other direction.
