posted by kizer permanenteShocking that people in opposition to universal healthcare have heard nothing but bad from it and proponents haven't heard anything bad. Just shocking.
Lol sorry for posting my anecdotal stories. And any economically intelligent person would be in opposition to universal healthcare.
Heck the US system of health care is getting just as bad in regards to wait. I have a cardiac issue and my cardiologist appointments are out to next June if you want to see him.
Like I said before, Canada can offer "free" health care because we are their military. Cant police the world and pay for 350,000,000 peoples health care.
posted by SpockHeck the US system of health care is getting just as bad in regards to wait. I have a cardiac issue and my cardiologist appointments are out to next June if you want to see him.
I've been going to the cardiologist for ten years and never heard of a 7+ month waiting list. I'd see mine the week of Thanksgiving and they'd reach out in September-ish to get me scheduled. He's actually retiring at the end of the year so I called up Miami Valley South last week and got in with a new guy in mid-January.
I'd guess you're going to a small town guy you like which is fine but hardly worth waiting half a year if you have an "issue" -- and it also doesn't define the US system.
posted by SportsAndLadyMy canadian “friends” are really not friends but coworkers and clients.
I have 35 asian friends. Well, they're not friends, but people I've seen on TV.
posted by SpockHeck the US system of health care is getting just as bad in regards to wait. I have a cardiac issue and my cardiologist appointments are out to next June if you want to see him.
Like I said before, Canada can offer "free" health care because we are their military. Cant police the world and pay for 350,000,000 peoples health care.
Well, after about 8 years of obamaKare, this is where we are headed. I have several doctor friends; they are all completely disgusted by what has occurred over the last 8 years. It does not bode well; hopefully the high court gets one more chance to bury this disaster.
posted by SportsAndLadyI’m not a proponent for universal health care, just simply started the thread. I’m researching the pros and cons of each and figured I’d start this thread to see what you all thought.
My canadian “friends” are really not friends but coworkers and clients. I’m not saying they’re screaming from the rooftop how great their healthcare service is. But I’ve definitely never heard anything negative from them when it comes to hospital care there. And I was just talking to a couple the other day about it.
More anecdotal story time!
I had to get a sinus surgery done last week. I originally went to the ENT the Monday after thanksgiving. He recommended a minimally invasive procedure where I would be on local anesthesia. The recovery time was 1-2 days. I thought about it for a couple days and during that time I was able to email the doctor with my questions and concerns. I scheduled my procedure for December 10th and could have had scheduled it earlier, but the previous week was busy and I was out of town. The procedure went fine and I was pretty much back to my daily activities 24 hours later. I just had the follow-up with my doctor yesterday. There is still some healing to be done, but I am already starting to feel much better than I was pre surgery and immediately after.
Why did I provide this /coolstorybro? Because you don't hear stories like this from Canada or the NHS in UK. In the span of a few weeks I was able to see my doctor three times. A consultation, surgery and a follow-up. I am already feeling great. If this were in Canada, UK, or any other socialized country I probably would still be waiting for my consultation on why the hell I always feel constant sinus pressure which leads to dizziness and headaches.
Quality care (waiting times fall under this category), affordability, and universal care. You can't have all three. It is impossible. At best you can have two out of the three. Give me quality care first and then affordability. As Justin has said, tell Government to quit meddling into healthcare and the prices will drop. Look at the EpiPen. Over regulation has made it nearly impossible for businesses to penetrate the market. It made the EpiPen ridiculously expensive. Finally another business was finally able to cut thru the red tape or find a loophole and cut the price in half. Imagine if a bunch of smaller businesses could do this. Hell, without insurance the prices wouldn't be as high as they are now.
posted by QuakerOatsI have several doctor friends;
Define "friends"
posted by ernest_t_bassDefine "friends"
Are they politard losers who waste time spouting the same nonsense to a 30-something member message board, too?
posted by friendfromlowryI've been going to the cardiologist for ten years and never heard of a 7+ month waiting list. I'd see mine the week of Thanksgiving and they'd reach out in September-ish to get me scheduled. He's actually retiring at the end of the year so I called up Miami Valley South last week and got in with a new guy in mid-January.
I'd guess you're going to a small town guy you like which is fine but hardly worth waiting half a year if you have an "issue" -- and it also doesn't define the US system.
No....Kravitz at Dayton heart.
posted by ernest_t_bassI have 35 asian friends. Well, they're not friends, but people I've seen on TV.
With how cheap and cranky you are, no one would ever believe you have 35 friends.
posted by SpockCant police the world ...
Probably should have stopped there.
posted by like_that
As Justin has said, tell Government to quit meddling into healthcare and the prices will drop. Look at the EpiPen. Over regulation has made it nearly impossible for businesses to penetrate the market. It made the EpiPen ridiculously expensive. Finally another business was finally able to cut thru the red tape or find a loophole and cut the price in half. Imagine if a bunch of smaller businesses could do this. Hell, without insurance the prices wouldn't be as high as they are now.
Fucking aye, on both counts.
Regulations do more to protect large corporate interests than they do the general public, so those pushing for them in support of the latter actually harm the latter by allowing less competition and a more prohibitively expensive product.
And if we didn't use insurance to cover every little thing under the damn sun, insurance would be cheaper. I actually found something like that recently. I pay for visits out of pocket, and when the offices find that out, they drop the price.
Shocking how much less things cost when they find out they can't just bill insurance for everything.
posted by SportsAndLadyWith how cheap and cranky you are, no one would ever believe you have 35 friends.
posted by O-TrapProbably should have stopped there.
posted by like_that
As Justin has said, tell Government to quit meddling into healthcare and the prices will drop. Look at the EpiPen. Over regulation has made it nearly impossible for businesses to penetrate the market. It made the EpiPen ridiculously expensive. Finally another business was finally able to cut thru the red tape or find a loophole and cut the price in half. Imagine if a bunch of smaller businesses could do this. Hell, without insurance the prices wouldn't be as high as they are now.Fucking aye, on both counts.
Regulations do more to protect large corporate interests than they do the general public, so those pushing for them in support of the latter actually harm the latter by allowing less competition and a more prohibitively expensive product.
And if we didn't use insurance to cover every little thing under the damn sun, insurance would be cheaper. I actually found something like that recently. I pay for visits out of pocket, and when the offices find that out, they drop the price.
Shocking how much less things cost when they find out they can't just bill insurance for everything.
Are you familiar with Direct Primary Care?
posted by like_thatAre you familiar with Direct Primary Care?
I've looked into it in the past, but have yet to go to the doctor since. I'm getting to that age (past it, probably) where I should start going yearly. This is the route I plan to take if I can find a good doctor locally.
posted by like_thatAre you familiar with Direct Primary Care?
Sure, but normal insurance still takes into account the cost of regular visits by the average user when determining premiums.
posted by justincredibleI've looked into it in the past, but have yet to go to the doctor since. I'm getting to that age (past it, probably) where I should start going yearly. This is the route I plan to take if I can find a good doctor locally.
I am looking into taking this route as well.
posted by O-TrapSure, but normal insurance still takes into account the cost of regular visits by the average user when determining premiums.
I was just curious if you were aware. I think this is the direction healthcare could go if there is a legitimate threat of single payer. It would be hilarious to see the insurance bubble burst and our healthcare system go back to how it was pre health insurance.
There is already a grassroots movement to get it going and it seems like more and more DPCs are popping up. I know med schools are starting "clubs/orgs" trying to promote DPCs to their students.
posted by like_thatThere is already a grassroots movement to get it going and it seems like more and more DPCs are popping up. I know med schools are starting "clubs/orgs" trying to promote DPCs to their students.
Is this what's commonly known as "concierge" doctors? Because I think that is mostly only recommended for older people that need someone to help them navigate their various conditions and specialists. It doesn't seem to return value if you're a healthy individual that only goes to a GP once or twice a year.
I don't see much savings in paying for a GP directly. It's the hospitalization/cancer treatment-type stuff that will do you in.
Deductibles and premiums have skyrocketed over Obamakare, but they were skyrocketing before Obamakare too. I have a $3500 deductible and an HSA, but if I recall it was Bush who pushed for high deductible plans.
I do think one of the advantages (if you want to call it that) of single payer is that the payer can then set the cost.
I've worked in health insurance for a while and I've seen some crazy billing. I used to work for an insurance company that dealt with multiple networks. We recieved a bill from a dr for $500. They determined it was billed to the wrong network so the dr rebilled under the correct network for $3500.
A friend of mine recently had a baby and they charged her $35 to hold the baby after it was born.
There is definitely some money that can be saved by doing away with insurance companies, but hospitals are just as guilty as inflating the cost of medical care.
FatHobbit, per your point, I think inflation in general is out of hand. I understand that inflation is a thing in the free market, and in order for our standard of living to rise, inflation must exist. But I feel inflation exists mostly just because inflation. I feel that prices often rise just because prices should rise. And you can blame idiot fucking consumers for that. Millennials, in my opinion, are a lot to blame for stupid costs of something. "Yes, I need to spend $50 on this T-shirt, b/c the quality is just that good!" I mean... come on!? It's an isolated incident (T-shirt), but I see inflated costs on a TON of things with little to no reasoning for inflated costs other than "the suckers will buy it!" I think the american consumer has gotten incredibly stupid with their buying decisions, and don't vote with their dollars like they should. Producers react accordingly.
tl;dr - Blame everything on the consumer, not the business
posted by ernest_t_bassFatHobbit, per your point, I think inflation in general is out of hand. I understand that inflation is a thing in the free market, and in order for our standard of living to rise, inflation must exist. But I feel inflation exists mostly just because inflation. I feel that prices often rise just because prices should rise. And you can blame idiot fucking consumers for that. Millennials, in my opinion, are a lot to blame for stupid costs of something. "Yes, I need to spend $50 on this T-shirt, b/c the quality is just that good!" I mean... come on!? It's an isolated incident (T-shirt), but I see inflated costs on a TON of things with little to no reasoning for inflated costs other than "the suckers will buy it!" I think the american consumer has gotten incredibly stupid with their buying decisions, and don't vote with their dollars like they should. Producers react accordingly.
tl;dr - Blame everything on the consumer, not the business
lack of education where schools dont teach finance and life skills classes where you learned to budget and the value of a dollar was taught.
