Progressives, part 3...

posted by jmog

I did not vote for the film maker.

 

Not voting for a libertarian does not mean one is not a libertarian. Unfortunately we have a 2 party system, many people believe they need to vote which of those 2 candidates are closer to their belief system.

 

Let's look at my history in POTUS elections...

 

1996-Clinton (D) (if I was old enough in 1992 I admit I would have voted for Bush 1)

2000-Bush II (R)

2004-Bush II (R) (hated Iraq war, but Bush was in general such a nice/good guy it was hard not to vote for him, almost pulled the lever for Kerry here)

2008-Obama (D) (yeah, had a brain fart here, but couldn't put Palin 1 heartbeat away, liked McCain but Palin...good Lord)

2012-Romney (R)

2016-Trump (R)

 

So no, I have never voted for the libertarian party, I vote for the R or D that, in my opinion, "fits" closer to libertarian as possible. To be honest, unless the Ds shift course back to the middle I don't see that being a D in a long time.

 

To answer your Ohio Governor question, I actually voted for Cordray. I hated his stance on healthcare but most of his other platform ideas were better, in my opinion, than DeWine's.

How in your opinion was Cordray's platform better/closer to the libertarian platform than Mike Dewine? 

Cordray's Platform: https://secure.cordrayforohio.com/page/content/on-the-issues/

included things that are typically the bane of libertarians such as firearm restrictions, universal pre-k and free community college. 

posted by BoatShoes

How in your opinion was Cordray's platform better/closer to the libertarian platform than Mike Dewine? 

Cordray's Platform: https://secure.cordrayforohio.com/page/content/on-the-issues/

included things that are typically the bane of libertarians such as firearm restrictions, universal pre-k and free community college. 

DeWine's answer to the opiate problem was to sue the pharmaceutical companies. Cordray supported more rehab and treatment facilities (which is about the only policy that works).

Cordray was more "small business" and economic freedom for small businesses (tax incentives, etc).

DeWine's stances on education was just as "big government" as Cordray's. His were just more up a the HS and college level rather than pre-k. They both wanted to expand things at Pre-K, HS, and college/community college level. This aspect they where 6 in one hand and half a dozen in the other.

DeWine's health care was basically the same as Cordray's, neither of which I agreed with much. 

Cordray wanted to remove regulations on "renewable" energies, specifically wind (I thought I saw him say nuclear once as well but it's not currently on his page). De-regulation is always a libertarian happy place. 

About his gun restrictions he proposed, only one restriction I disagreed with...

Bump stock bans-these add ons took semi-automatic weapons and effectively made them automatic. Just like it is currently illegal to buy/change out a firing pin to change a semi-auto to a full auto rifle, bump stocks should have been in the same category.

High capacity magazines-this is where I think he went off his rocker.

Universal Background Checks-dog whistle phrase for democrats, but background checks already happen when buying a firearm. This "restriction" already happens, so he was just pandering and this wasn't really a restriction.

Changing Ohio laws to 21 years old to buy a firearm-Ohio law is already 21 for hand guns but not for rifles. Federal law was/is 21 for all guns. I see no reason why the Ohio restriction and federal restriction shouldn't be aligned. I believe it should be/could be 18 across the US just like the drinking age but no real issue with Ohio lining up their age requirement with the current federal law. I would "like" it to be 18, but it doesn't bother me to align them up (especially since drinking age is 21 as well).

To finalize, neither DeWine nor Cordray were "small government" candidates, so in my mind I went with the "lesser of two evils".

Also, to be clear, libertarians are more for limited FEDERAL government, not necesarily limited state/local government. This is how the Constitution was originally written and designed our government anyway, and libertarians love their Constitution.

Survey: Minimum wage increases challenge restaurateurs

Almost 10% of restaurant operators in areas where the minimum wage was recently raised have closed locations and 71% have raised prices to offset higher labor costs, according to a survey by Harri. In addition, 64% cut staff hours and 43% have cut jobs.

Restaurant Business online (4/16) 

Liberalism always generates the exact opposite of its stated intent.

posted by SportsAndLady

They probably think they’re doing actual “public service”  so they don’t need to be charitable. 

Such a joke

Lol 

“Beto O'Rourke is defending details from his released tax returns that shows how little he and his wife gave to charity, saying his public service is the real contribution” from cnn

https://twitter.com/cnn/status/1118608247303430145?s=21

posted by iclfan2

Lol 

“Beto O'Rourke is defending details from his released tax returns that shows how little he and his wife gave to charity, saying his public service is the real contribution"..

It's all an elaborate scheme to shame Trump into releasing his tax returns!

But you're exactly right.  None of the big gubmit socialists ever pay extra taxes, or give generously to charity.  It's absolutely about other people's money.  And I don't really have a problem believing taxes should be higher and only paying what the law requires you to.....but you are hypocrite if you aren't giving that extra money to charity.

Crazy Bernie should get absolutely destroyed over this.  LOL, Bret Baier asked him why he didn't pay more taxes voluntarily, and Sanders flipped out - rose out of his chair waving his hands all over the place!

Part of me also thinks these early smears on Bernie and Biden are straight out of the political playbook.  Clear the deck and take your lumps and it can't come out later to hurt you....a year from now when people start voting it's all forgotten.

It will be interesting to see how much the media attempts to influence the nomination.  Bernie is the guy they love, and Biden is the one who can win.  I think it's a two-horse race.  But Buttigieg is gay.....

posted by gut

Part of me also thinks these early smears on Bernie and Biden are straight out of the political playbook.  Clear the deck and take your lumps and it can't come out later to hurt you....a year from now when people start voting it's all forgotten.

It will be interesting to see how much the media attempts to influence the nomination.  Bernie is the guy they love, and Biden is the one who can win.  I think it's a two-horse race.  But Buttigieg is gay.....

You spelled butt wrong.

posted by iclfan2

Lol 

“Beto O'Rourke is defending details from his released tax returns that shows how little he and his wife gave to charity, saying his public service is the real contribution” from cnn

https://twitter.com/cnn/status/1118608247303430145?s=21

It always makes me laugh when you say something sarcastically and then it actually comes true..lol

posted by SportsAndLady

It always makes me laugh when you say something sarcastically and then it actually comes true..lol

That was a good call.

posted by iclfan2

Lol 

“Beto O'Rourke is defending details from his released tax returns that shows how little he and his wife gave to charity, saying his public service is the real contribution” from cnn

https://twitter.com/cnn/status/1118608247303430145?s=21

Donating his time for public service

Still gets paid

What a gig

The media is melting down about the Mueller report and Barr again. It's high comedy. Lol someone from the NY Times/ CNN also said that the White House was playing the song "Edelweiss" from the Sound of Music and insinuating it is racist or something. It's hilarious

Can all the left wing people on this site just read 1 paragraph from the Mueller Report for me. It is found on page 1 and 2. 

Although the investigation established that the Russian government perceived it would benefit from a Trump presidency and worked to secure that outcome, and the Campaign expected it would benefit electorally from information stolen and released through Russian efforts, the investigation did not establish that members of the Trump Campaign conspired or coordinated with the Russian government in its election interference activities.

posted by jmog

Can all the left wing people on this site just read 1 paragraph from the Mueller Report for me. It is found on page 1 and 2. 

There’s left winged people on this site?

posted by SportsAndLady

There’s left winged people on this site?

There's a bunch of them. They just posted more when Obama was President.

posted by SportsAndLady

There’s left winged people on this site?

By the standards of this site, OTrap, Justin and Gut have all been basically called left-wingers by at least one person, so the perception about what exactly is a left-winger is kind of different here than most places.

posted by Spock

You spelled butt wrong.

Does your wife know that you are looking at other guy's butts?

posted by Devils Advocate

Does your wife know that you are looking at other guy's butts?

yea I usually point them out to her so she can look

posted by CenterBHSFan

There's a bunch of them. They just posted more when Obama was President.

Sooo they’re not here anymore..

posted by SportsAndLady

There’s left winged people on this site?

A lot of them have left thru the years, which is why I think you believe this site has become more right wing.  

posted by Heretic

By the standards of this site, OTrap, Justin and Gut have all been basically called left-wingers by at least one person, so the perception about what exactly is a left-winger is kind of different here than most places.

I wouldn't consider any of those guys left wingers. 
 

posted by like_that

A lot of them have left thru the years, which is why I think you believe this site has become more right wing.  

posted by Heretic

By the standards of this site, OTrap, Justin and Gut have all been basically called left-wingers by at least one person, so the perception about what exactly is a left-winger is kind of different here than most places.

I wouldn't consider any of those guys left wingers. 
 

 

Think it was QQ for Justin and OTrap because their ideas of limited government DO NOT include spending tons of wasted money on meaningless shit like the "war" on drugs. And just recently, CC was insinuating that about Gut because of differing views on what a coup actually is (on the "Dipshit Righty Conspiracy Thread" or whatever it's actually called).

Sure, that's the over-the-top blind partisan hack segment, but they also are, along with maybe ICL, the only prolific posters here who are aligned "R" and not "Libertarian with conservative tendencies for at least financial issues", since a lot of the pure R crowd from back in the day also either no longer post here or at least rarely hit this forum.