believer
Posts: 8,153
Feb 14, 2010 6:21am
Debt ceiling signed into law behind closed doors.
Oh well...what the hell right? After all it's only 2 trillion more. Gotta keep Big Government moving! Roll on Big O.Behind closed doors and with no cameras present, President Obama signed into law Friday afternoon the bill raising the public debt limit from $12.394 trillion to $14.294 trillion.
gibby08
Posts: 1,581
Feb 14, 2010 12:50pm
You do realize that this was passed by congress.....
Why should he have to sign it with camera's present....it's not like everyone didn't know it was coming
Why should he have to sign it with camera's present....it's not like everyone didn't know it was coming
believer
Posts: 8,153
Feb 14, 2010 12:54pm
^^^ Photo op maybe? No wait....the Repubs would use that in this fall's political ads. My bad.
But you're right...The Dem-controlled Congress raised the ceiling and BHO signed off on it behind closed doors...no fanfare...no flashing bulbs....no smiles....no teleprompter speeches on how this is a great thing for America... no bullshit.
But you're right...The Dem-controlled Congress raised the ceiling and BHO signed off on it behind closed doors...no fanfare...no flashing bulbs....no smiles....no teleprompter speeches on how this is a great thing for America... no bullshit.
gibby08
Posts: 1,581
Feb 14, 2010 12:59pm
Explain to me WHY he should have had press there??
This had already been passed by congress and everyone knew it was coming....so it really wasn't a big deal
This had already been passed by congress and everyone knew it was coming....so it really wasn't a big deal
believer
Posts: 8,153
Feb 14, 2010 1:02pm
I'm not surprised. Liberals like you are all about government spending. No big deal.gibby08 wrote: Explain to me WHY he should have had press there??
This had already been passed by congress and everyone knew it was coming....so it really wasn't a big deal
Keep drinking the Kool Aid.
gibby08
Posts: 1,581
Feb 14, 2010 1:08pm
Thanks for answering my question.....
This isn't THAT big of an issue
This needed to be done....people knew it was coming....it's not a big deal
This isn't THAT big of an issue
This needed to be done....people knew it was coming....it's not a big deal
M
Manhattan Buckeye
Posts: 7,566
Feb 14, 2010 1:40pm
"This needed to be done....people knew it was coming....it's not a big deal "
What needed to be done? To insure that not only our grandkids will lead a lower lifestyle than ours, that their grandkids will as well? At some point this debt needs to be addressed.
What needed to be done? To insure that not only our grandkids will lead a lower lifestyle than ours, that their grandkids will as well? At some point this debt needs to be addressed.
believer
Posts: 8,153
Feb 14, 2010 1:55pm
2 trillion dollars isn't that big of a deal.gibby08 wrote:This isn't THAT big of an issue
This needed to be done....people knew it was coming....it's not a big deal
[size=xx-large]
$2,000,000,000,000[/size]
Looks big to me.
derek bomar
Posts: 3,722
Feb 14, 2010 2:03pm
I find it funny that conservatives are up in arms about the Debt but every attempt to address it so far has been shot down by them in Congress....Republicans in congress aren't gonna lower the debt, they can't even agree on a fucking panel to look into it...
believer
Posts: 8,153
Feb 14, 2010 2:07pm
The problem with your argument is that you mistakenly equate conservatives with Republicans. Most conservatives I know are equally angry at Republicans for spending like Democrats.derek bomar wrote: I find it funny that conservatives are up in arms about the Debt but every attempt to address it so far has been shot down by them in Congress....Republicans in congress aren't gonna lower the debt, they can't even agree on a fucking panel to look into it...
Both parties need a budgetary enema.
Besides asking a Dem-controlled Congress to "look into lowering the national debt" is like asking the inmates to run the asylum. Oh wait...that's already the case.
I
I Wear Pants
Posts: 16,223
Feb 14, 2010 3:24pm
So what are they supposed to do if the debt projections exceed the ceiling?
I hate seeing this raised as much as anyone but it's not like we can just shut the whole place down because we went over what is at this point an arbitrary number.
Actually, what would happen if we went above the debt ceiling?
Edit: "I'm not surprised. Liberals like you are all about government spending. No big deal."
The problem with your argument is that you mistakenly equate liberals with Democrats.
I hate seeing this raised as much as anyone but it's not like we can just shut the whole place down because we went over what is at this point an arbitrary number.
Actually, what would happen if we went above the debt ceiling?
Edit: "I'm not surprised. Liberals like you are all about government spending. No big deal."
The problem with your argument is that you mistakenly equate liberals with Democrats.
gibby08
Posts: 1,581
Feb 14, 2010 3:26pm
+1I Wear Pants wrote: So what are they supposed to do if the debt projections exceed the ceiling?
I hate seeing this raised as much as anyone but it's not like we can just shut the whole place down because we went over what is at this point an arbitrary number.
Actually, what would happen if we went above the debt ceiling?
My thought exactly
M
Manhattan Buckeye
Posts: 7,566
Feb 14, 2010 3:57pm
"So what are they supposed to do if the debt projections exceed the ceiling? "
Cut salaries, cut pension obligations for federal workers, treat them as private businesses treat their employees. Cut the fat. If there is no fat, tough shit, cut it anyway. The private sector has bit the big one the last couple of years yet federal workers are living on increasingly less revenues from said sector. And if the government really has balls cut SS benefits for folks that are getting back much more than what they put in. At some point the federal ponzi scheme has to stop.
Cut salaries, cut pension obligations for federal workers, treat them as private businesses treat their employees. Cut the fat. If there is no fat, tough shit, cut it anyway. The private sector has bit the big one the last couple of years yet federal workers are living on increasingly less revenues from said sector. And if the government really has balls cut SS benefits for folks that are getting back much more than what they put in. At some point the federal ponzi scheme has to stop.
believer
Posts: 8,153
Feb 14, 2010 4:34pm
Oh I dunno....how about reducing fraud, waste, abuse, and redundancy across-the-board in all aspects of federal spending for starters?I Wear Pants wrote:Actually, what would happen if we went above the debt ceiling?
REDUCE the size and scope of Big Government and then let's talk about raising the debt ceiling.
It's like giving my daughter a credit card with a $5,000 limit which she subsequently runs to the limit and then comes to me and wants me to call the bank to have the limit raised to $10,000 because she's not finished with her spending spree.
If I sign off on that am I an idiot or should I just shrug and say, "What would you have me do? She's maxed out and needs more stuff. It's really no big deal."
majorspark
Posts: 5,122
Feb 14, 2010 5:35pm
Great post. Although in your anaology your daughter is spending your money. In the case of the federal government they are spending other people's money, so the sky is the limit.believer wrote:Oh I dunno....how about reducing fraud, waste, abuse, and redundancy across-the-board in all aspects of federal spending for starters?I Wear Pants wrote:Actually, what would happen if we went above the debt ceiling?
REDUCE the size and scope of Big Government and then let's talk about raising the debt ceiling.
It's like giving my daughter a credit card with a $5,000 limit which she subsequently runs to the limit and then comes to me and wants me to call the bank to have the limit raised to $10,000 because she's not finished with her spending spree.
If I sign off on that am I an idiot or should I just shrug and say, "What would you have me do? She's maxed out and needs more stuff. It's really no big deal."
I
I Wear Pants
Posts: 16,223
Feb 14, 2010 6:43pm
I don't think a daughters spending spree quite equates to the many necessary things that the government does. They also do unneeded things which is why people are so upset but it's hard to separate them.
majorspark
Posts: 5,122
Feb 14, 2010 7:00pm
That is why we have debt limits. So the federal government is forced to separate them. Without true hard limits they never will, until they are forced into them by the laws of economics. The debt limits were set up to guard against the danger of financial collapse. Those unwilling to make the hard decisions necessary today defer them to their children, only the consequences for them will be more severe.I Wear Pants wrote: I don't think a daughters spending spree quite equates to the many necessary things that the government does. They also do unneeded things which is why people are so upset but it's hard to separate them.
derek bomar
Posts: 3,722
Feb 15, 2010 7:16am
Well then I hope to see you voting for a 3rd part in the next electionbeliever wrote:The problem with your argument is that you mistakenly equate conservatives with Republicans. Most conservatives I know are equally angry at Republicans for spending like Democrats.derek bomar wrote: I find it funny that conservatives are up in arms about the Debt but every attempt to address it so far has been shot down by them in Congress....Republicans in congress aren't gonna lower the debt, they can't even agree on a fucking panel to look into it...
Both parties need a budgetary enema.
Besides asking a Dem-controlled Congress to "look into lowering the national debt" is like asking the inmates to run the asylum. Oh wait...that's already the case.
CenterBHSFan
Posts: 6,115
Feb 15, 2010 8:17am
This would have been a great opportunity for Obama to discard the bill and publicly tell congress to start over. By not signing it, he would be sending them the clear message that raising the debt ceiling is below them and that they could do better. It also would be a huge boost to his public image, the public would love him for doing it. It definitely would have warmed me up to him a little!
gibby08
Posts: 1,581
Feb 15, 2010 12:48pm
Just to clear up some confusion on my part:
I didn't mean that the debt ceiling raise isn't a big deal....I meant that his signing it with no press present wasn't a big deal
I didn't mean that the debt ceiling raise isn't a big deal....I meant that his signing it with no press present wasn't a big deal
F
Footwedge
Posts: 9,265
Feb 15, 2010 3:11pm
Raising the debt ceiling by the president? Wow...that's never happened before, has it?
believer
Posts: 8,153
Feb 15, 2010 4:30pm
^^^Only by the more opaque presidents.
I
I Wear Pants
Posts: 16,223
Feb 15, 2010 4:52pm
June 28, 2002
116 Stat. 734 Increased the debt limit to 6,400.0
May 27, 2003
117 Stat. 710 Increased the debt limit to 7,384.0
November 19, 2004
118 Stat. 2337 Increased the debt limit to 8,184.0
March 20, 2006
120 Stat. 289 Increased the debt limit to 8,965.0
September 29, 2007
121 Stat. 988 Increased the debt limit to 9,815.0
July 30, 2008
122 Stat. 2908 Increased the debt limit to 10,615.0
October 3, 2008
122 Stat. 3790 Increased the debt limit to 11,315.0
116 Stat. 734 Increased the debt limit to 6,400.0
May 27, 2003
117 Stat. 710 Increased the debt limit to 7,384.0
November 19, 2004
118 Stat. 2337 Increased the debt limit to 8,184.0
March 20, 2006
120 Stat. 289 Increased the debt limit to 8,965.0
September 29, 2007
121 Stat. 988 Increased the debt limit to 9,815.0
July 30, 2008
122 Stat. 2908 Increased the debt limit to 10,615.0
October 3, 2008
122 Stat. 3790 Increased the debt limit to 11,315.0
derek bomar
Posts: 3,722
Feb 15, 2010 6:58pm
ouch
I
I Wear Pants
Posts: 16,223
Feb 15, 2010 10:00pm
http://www.whitehouse.gov/omb/budget/fy2010/assets/hist07z3.xlsccrunner609 wrote:I Wear Pants wrote: June 28, 2002
116 Stat. 734 Increased the debt limit to 6,400.0
May 27, 2003
117 Stat. 710 Increased the debt limit to 7,384.0
November 19, 2004
118 Stat. 2337 Increased the debt limit to 8,184.0
March 20, 2006
120 Stat. 289 Increased the debt limit to 8,965.0
September 29, 2007
121 Stat. 988 Increased the debt limit to 9,815.0
July 30, 2008
122 Stat. 2908 Increased the debt limit to 10,615.0
October 3, 2008
122 Stat. 3790 Increased the debt limit to 11,315.0
Links? I would love to see what bills they tied these to so they would pass? Maybe military spending? I gaurentee that these were line items in a much bigger piece of legislation.
The following link is also interesting and related: http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode31/usc_sec_31_00003101----000-notes.html