For many Americans, finding time to run down to the Fire Department to fill out a couple ovals can be hard when you have to balance work, kids, school and many of the other obligations many of us face each day.

We have holidays for things such as Columbus Day and Christmas, days no doubt of great importance in American Culture but nonetheless not integrally related to our role in representative democracy like the days on which we are to vote for our agents in the various levels of government we create.

Thus, do you think it would be a good idea to make voting days, national or state holidays?

I'm not sure if we need a holiday, or to get the whole day off. Where I work, they'll let us leave an hour or so early if we want to vote.

BoatShoes wrote: For many Americans, finding time to run down to the Fire Department to fill out a couple ovals can be hard when you have to balance work, kids, school and many of the other obligations many of us face each day.

Sorry, calling bullshit on this. People in other places will walk tens of miles and stand in line for hour after hour to cast a vote. Are we really so a) spoiled and b) lousy time managers that we can't carve out a few minutes to do what people have paid the ultimate price to protect?

queencitybuckeye wrote:

BoatShoes wrote: For many Americans, finding time to run down to the Fire Department to fill out a couple ovals can be hard when you have to balance work, kids, school and many of the other obligations many of us face each day.

Sorry, calling bullshit on this. People in other places will walk tens of miles and stand in line for hour after hour to cast a vote. Are we really so a) spoiled and b) lousy time managers that we can't carve out a few minutes to do what people have paid the ultimate price to protect?

yes to a and b

Holiday for election day? Awful idea. Actually, voter turnout would decrease. Boatshoes argument in favor was really kind of amazing.

No need to declare a holiday. They make absentee ballots for those that know their schedule won't allow them to get to the polls. I used them for years while working a job that wouldn't allow me to get to the polls on time.

ross ford81 wrote: Holiday for election day? Awful idea. Actually, voter turnout would decrease. Boatshoes argument in favor was really kind of amazing.

I don't really think I was "arguing in favor" as opposed to just laying out the question.

What makes you think voter turnout would decrease? Do you have a study, a link? Perhaps even a logical syllogism that we could use even we accepted your premises as true? Why is it an "awful" idea to have an election day as a Holiday and why it's not an "awful" idea to have a holiday for some other reason?

I don't know if voting turnout would decrease, but it wouldn't make it more convenient for many families with children and in fact may make it more inconvenient. At least by having it on a "normal" day the routine isn't effected, the kids go to school or daycare or the babysitter comes over, by making it a holiday the parents would be knocked out of their routine making voting possibly more difficult since someone has to watch the kids.

It's 2010. We should not be walking to polling stations anymore. All voting should be done through an online system from the comfort of our homes.

Politicians don't want to make voting easier though. The less people that show up the better for them.

ross ford81 wrote: Actually, voter turnout would decrease.

Not sure if this is the case, but if so, I'd change my mind. Anything that makes my vote worth more is a good thing.

eersandbeers wrote: It's 2010. We should not be walking to polling stations anymore. All voting should be done through an online system from the comfort of our homes.

Politicians don't want to make voting easier though. The less people that show up the better for them.

I'm not so sure that we need to be goverened based on the opinions of those who can't get their fat asses to a polling place.

eersandbeers wrote: It's 2010. We should not be walking to polling stations anymore. All voting should be done through an online system from the comfort of our homes.

Politicians don't want to make voting easier though. The less people that show up the better for them.

So many problems with that now, online voting may work well with proxy services for annual meetings but those are much smaller than national elections and people typically aren't as sensitive about the privacy of their vote.

queencitybuckeye wrote: I'm not so sure that we need to be goverened based on the opinions of those who can't get their fat asses to a polling place.

It's not that we can't but rather than waiting for a couple of hours to vote, I could be done in 5 minutes from my home. This seems like a common sense move.

Manhattan Buckeye wrote: So many problems with that now, online voting may work well with proxy services for annual meetings but those are much smaller than national elections and people typically aren't as sensitive about the privacy of their vote.

Setting up and maintaining the system would take some work, but I think they could accomplish it rather easily. I'd like to believe they possess the ability to secure the system.

I think they have the ability to make it secure, though it would be quite the undertaking. However, it would be worthwhile to do so, IMO.

I mean, the cyber-threat issue is always a problem, because you would have to believe that the best hackers in the world would be doing their best to disrupt the process on election day. But, i think that it could certainly be done, given the right amount of time and effort is invested, and that they go about it the right way.

But, that would bring all about all sorts of absurd accusations about voter fraud from the losing side, and i would probably throw up from all the ignorant arguments made by the losing side about how their candidate might have lost.

But, i like the idea, but my goodness, you couldn't pay me enough to be a part of the group making it happen.

eersandbeers wrote: It's 2010. We should not be walking to polling stations anymore. All voting should be done through an online system from the comfort of our homes.

Politicians don't want to make voting easier though. The less people that show up the better for them.

Voting is a public and community event and should be done in public. The public needs to visually see the process and be confident in its integrity.

This would also be expensive and impossible to insure the integrity of each vote. Not only would we have to worry about hackers, but how would you know the person casting the vote is not doing so under duress. You would see political shekanery at levels unseen in this country. With this you can kiss what little freedom you have left in this country goodbye.

majorspark wrote:

eersandbeers wrote: It's 2010. We should not be walking to polling stations anymore. All voting should be done through an online system from the comfort of our homes.

Politicians don't want to make voting easier though. The less people that show up the better for them.

Voting is a public and community event and should be done in public. The public needs to visually see the process and be confident in its integrity.

This would also be expensive and impossible to insure the integrity of each vote. Not only would we have to worry about hackers, but how would you know the person casting the vote is not doing so under duress. You would see political shekanery at levels unseen in this country. With this you can kiss what little freedom you have left in this country goodbye.

An excellent post. Well done.

eersandbeers wrote: It's 2010. We should not be walking to polling stations anymore. All voting should be done through an online system from the comfort of our homes.

Politicians don't want to make voting easier though. The less people that show up the better for them.

You do realize that voter fraud would go up 100% if that were to be put in place

You know.....please explain to me how we have lost ANY freedoms since President Obama has come into office?

majorspark wrote: Voting is a public and community event and should be done in public. The public needs to visually see the process and be confident in its integrity.

This would also be expensive and impossible to insure the integrity of each vote. Not only would we have to worry about hackers, but how would you know the person casting the vote is not doing so under duress. You would see political shekanery at levels unseen in this country. With this you can kiss what little freedom you have left in this country goodbye.

I think your fears are not really based in reality.

First of all, it wouldn't be all that expensive. No more expensive than setting up polling stations, counting ballots, ensuring there is no voter fraud, etc.

Yes, hackers would be a worry. That is why we have internet security. We do everything else online including filing taxes with the government. I don't see why voting shouldn't be online also.

How would I be under duress from my home. And if I vote under duress, could I just not report that person once they leave? That doesn't make any logical sense to me.

There would actually be less voter fraud because it is much more difficult to commit voter fraud with validated credentials online. I guarantee you wouldn't have dead people voting like we have seen in the last elections. You wouldn't have ACORN workers standing outside of peoples homes to influence and intimidate voters.

We would hardly lose our freedom, nor would be there be greater voter fraud. I'm not sure how familiar you are with online security and such, but I could see how it would be a concern to someone who isn't entirely familiarized with these things.

gibby08 wrote:
You do realize that voter fraud would go up 100% if that were to be put in place

You know.....please explain to me how we have lost ANY freedoms since President Obama has come into office?

As I explained above, no voter fraud would not go up. That doesn't make any sense. You can require validation like we do for everything else.

Where did I say we have lost any freedoms or did you just create a statement from nowhere.

eersandbeers wrote:

majorspark wrote: Voting is a public and community event and should be done in public. The public needs to visually see the process and be confident in its integrity.

This would also be expensive and impossible to insure the integrity of each vote. Not only would we have to worry about hackers, but how would you know the person casting the vote is not doing so under duress. You would see political shekanery at levels unseen in this country. With this you can kiss what little freedom you have left in this country goodbye.

I think your fears are not really based in reality.

First of all, it wouldn't be all that expensive. No more expensive than setting up polling stations, counting ballots, ensuring there is no voter fraud, etc.

Yes, hackers would be a worry. That is why we have internet security. We do everything else online including filing taxes with the government. I don't see why voting shouldn't be online also.

How would I be under duress from my home. And if I vote under duress, could I just not report that person once they leave? That doesn't make any logical sense to me.

There would actually be less voter fraud because it is much more difficult to commit voter fraud with validated credentials online. I guarantee you wouldn't have dead people voting like we have seen in the last elections. You wouldn't have ACORN workers standing outside of peoples homes to influence and intimidate voters.

We would hardly lose our freedom, nor would be there be greater voter fraud. I'm not sure how familiar you are with online security and such, but I could see how it would be a concern to someone who isn't entirely familiarized with these things.

Evan if you were correct on security (which I disagree) a large portion of the public would have no confidence in this system. Many people don't even trust putting their credit card number online. Read the bold above. Without the masses being able to visually see the process, their confidence in the system would quickly be undermined by savvy politicians. It would be political chaos.

majorspark wrote:
Evan if you were correct on security (which I disagree) a large portion of the public would have no confidence in this system. Many people don't even trust putting their credit card number online. Read the bold above. Without the masses being able to visually see the process, their confidence in the system would quickly be undermined by savvy politicians. It would be political chaos.

It would be a system that needs to be grandfathered in.

In an internet system citizens could recheck their ballot at any time ensuring the correct candidates are marked. There would be no more of this confusion with certain voting systems and such.

In fact, you could give everyone a unique ID number that only they would know, and list those ID's under each candidate ensuring each vote was properly counted.

The masses cannot check the process now. I think the system I proposed above would be far more transparent.

I like the idea of people voting in public...not to mention there's a lot of people who don't have computers. I'd like to be able to see if Jimmy Hoffa puts a gun up to a guys head at the local library.

Since no one's taken the Holiday side, I suppose I will.

Imagine if election day were a kind of community event, wherein the the city or town or county had functions and there was a general feeling of community and collectivism wherein everybody went to the polls. Parents could take their kids with them to vote and it could be a festival like atmosphere.

Surely, people can find time to vote in the current system...but it doesn't seem like a celebratory or festive event but instead just a new hassle added to a different day.

We take Veterans Day to celebrate the heroes who protect our rights but we don't take a day to celebrate our most crucial role in a republic feuled by representative democracy? Many of us get a day off to celebrate the "finding" of America but we don't take a day to celebrate the mechanism that keeps the Republic together?

"Imagine if election day were a kind of community event, wherein the the city or town or county had functions and there was a general feeling of community and collectivism wherein everybody went to the polls. Parents could take their kids with them to vote and it could be a festival like atmosphere."

We have enough community events as it is, and we've already elevated our political class to levels that were never intended by the founders of the U.S which IMO is one of the BIGGEST issues we have with government. We should be electing public servants, not deities. It isn't necessarily supposed to be a celebration even if many people now treat it such. I'm fine taking off a few minutes, going to the local polls and getting in and out with minimal expense or inconvenience. Turning it into a carnival atmosphere is not IMO a good move. There's a reason why many places have laws about campaigning within "X" distance of a polling location.

Holiday?. Maybe one holiday a year for national elections replacing Columbus day or Veterans Day. In fact, Veterans Day could be celebrated on the same day as national elections since the ability to vote is secured by the sacrifice of our men/women in the armed forces.

as for people getting to the polls...that's a non issue. Everyone knows that if you can make it to a bar, a Democratic committee man will buy you a drink and drive you to a polling place


As for the internet....do we really want to open up our election system to hackers, phishers and pirates?

BoatShoes wrote: For many Americans, finding time to run down to the Fire Department to fill out a couple ovals can be hard when you have to balance work, kids, school and many of the other obligations many of us face each day.

We have holidays for things such as Columbus Day and Christmas, days no doubt of great importance in American Culture but nonetheless not integrally related to our role in representative democracy like the days on which we are to vote for our agents in the various levels of government we create.

Thus, do you think it would be a good idea to make voting days, national or state holidays?

No. I agree with George Carlin regarding voting. Don't do it. That way, I can't be blamed for anything.