the rich get richer

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I

isadore

Senior Member

7,762 posts
Jan 23, 2014 7:12 AM
jmog;1570876 wrote:And you don't seem to remember that the Carter recession was worse than the one at the end of the Bush Presidency by far.

Convenient huh?
For the majority, income levels have dropped substantially with the median male worker making $32,137 in 2010, and an inflation-adjusted income of $32,844 in 1968.
[114
Median household income 52,823 in 2007 , has since trended downward to $49,445 in 2010
Although the banking industry and housing sector were hit hard in the 1980–1982 recession, the housing sector was hit harder in the 2008–2009 .
Jan 23, 2014 7:12am
C

Con_Alma

Senior Member

12,198 posts
Jan 23, 2014 8:40 AM
The rich will always get richer. Maybe a tax change or industry shift here or there may throttle things for a while but the wealthy will adjust and continue to grow their wealth.
Jan 23, 2014 8:40am
JD413's avatar

JD413

Senior Member

131 posts
Jan 23, 2014 8:49 AM
DeadliestWarrior34;1571000 wrote:inb4 50 pages of bullshit
LMAO
Jan 23, 2014 8:49am
I

isadore

Senior Member

7,762 posts
Jan 23, 2014 9:04 AM
Con_Alma;1571049 wrote:The rich will always get richer. Maybe a tax change or industry shift here or there may throttle things for a while but the wealthy will adjust and continue to grow their wealth.
but not at the present exponential rate aided by government policies and at the expense of the others in our economy.
Jan 23, 2014 9:04am
Q

QuakerOats

Senior Member

8,740 posts
Jan 23, 2014 10:46 AM
isadore;1571056 wrote:but not at the present exponential rate aided by government policies and at the expense of the others in our economy.

We all have the opportunity to get rich, and richer.

We also take very good care of the less fortunate. Most of them are provided housing, clothing, food, and utilities, at no cost. We do not even send them a 1099 at the end of the year for the value of the benefits they receive - likely over $30,000. Anyone else gets a 1099 for imputed income and has to pay taxes on it. Maybe we should start sending them all 1099's and requiring that they at least pay the tax on the value of their benefits ---- maybe mindsets would begin to change.
Jan 23, 2014 10:46am
C

Con_Alma

Senior Member

12,198 posts
Jan 23, 2014 10:58 AM
isadore;1571056 wrote:but not at the present exponential rate aided by government policies and at the expense of the others in our economy.
Agreed in that it not always at the same rate but that the rich will adapt to the legislative changes put in place and continue to accumulate wealth. The ability to do so has a lot to do with the ability to be wealthy.
Jan 23, 2014 10:58am
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TedSheckler

Emporium Entrepreneur

3,974 posts
Jan 23, 2014 11:02 AM
Jan 23, 2014 11:02am
A

Al Bundy

Senior Member

4,180 posts
Jan 23, 2014 11:07 AM
isadore;1570656 wrote:Gosh a ruddies the greedy and selfish are doing so well. Congratulations guys.

"The World's 85 Richest People Are as Wealthy as the Poorest 3 Billion
The report that everybody's talking about this morning is Oxfam's opus on global inequality, which leads with an eye-popping statistic: The richest 85 people in the world own more wealth than the bottom half of the entire global population.
Yes, that equation works out to: 85 > 3,000,000,000.
Before we dig into the document, a programming note about wealth inequality. Wealth isn't income. Salary is income. But investments—stocks, houses, or equity in a business—build wealth. Wealth comes from the money you don't immediately spend. Since poor people spend more of their income immediately, and rich people save/invest more of their income immediately, it's predictable that wealth inequality be much worse than income inequality.
1) Seven in ten people live in countries where inequality has increased, and the United States is leading the wave. This graph from the report looks at national income (not wealth) accumulation to the top one percent, but it makes a clear point that inequality is rising everywhere, but nowhere more than the U.S.
1) Seven in ten people live in countries where inequality has increased, and the United States is leading the wave.
2) The richest 1 percent saw its share of income rise in 24 out of 26 countries for which Oxfam collected data between 1980 and 2012. Again, the story here is the U.S. leading a global trend.
3) Related to the graph above: In the US, the wealthiest one percent "captured 95 percent of post-financial crisis growth since 2009," Oxfam reports. The bottom 90 percent actually lost wealth
http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2014/01/the-worlds-85-richest-people-are-as-wealthy-as-the-poorest-3-billion/283206/
　
We have had 5 years of Obama's leadership. During that time, the stock market has more than doubled while the median income has dropped by 7%.
Jan 23, 2014 11:07am
G

gut

Senior Member

15,058 posts
Jan 23, 2014 11:45 AM
Al Bundy;1571137 wrote:We have had 5 years of Obama's leadership. During that time, the stock market has more than doubled while the median income has dropped by 7%.
Without going into the "anti-business" agenda, what has kind of happened is QE turned investments upside down - i.e. the juiced returns on existing assets (i.e. stocks, bonds, etc...) necessarily raises the minimally acceptable return on new investments.

I think maybe it's time to look at further differentiating capital gains tax on new vs. existing investments. You have a little benefit in the tax code with regard to depreciation of equipment, but with more and more businesses service-based and most of their costs business development/labor... I'm not sure how you differentiate, but capital gains from the stock market should be like a 28% tax rate and that on new investments should be 15% (maybe less).

Or maybe what this all points to is lower marginal corporate rates and higher capital gains. Done correctly, the net "double taxation" to an investor would remain the same but would better align risk/return on new investments. I'm thinking a company getting market returns on $1B of cash on its books would pay a rate of 28%, but maybe business profits would only be taxed at 20%.
Jan 23, 2014 11:45am
I

isadore

Senior Member

7,762 posts
Jan 23, 2014 6:59 PM
QuakerOats;1571120 wrote:We all have the opportunity to get rich, and richer.

We also take very good care of the less fortunate. Most of them are provided housing, clothing, food, and utilities, at no cost. We do not even send them a 1099 at the end of the year for the value of the benefits they receive - likely over $30,000. Anyone else gets a 1099 for imputed income and has to pay taxes on it. Maybe we should start sending them all 1099's and requiring that they at least pay the tax on the value of their benefits ---- maybe mindsets would begin to change.
Wow
Do you define who you consider to be less fortunate. You know all those folks you begrudge a roof over their heads, clothes on their backs and food in their stomachs. You want to tax them on the benefits they receive. Oh Ebenezer maybe than can just die and decrease the excess population
Jan 23, 2014 6:59pm
I

isadore

Senior Member

7,762 posts
Jan 23, 2014 7:14 PM
Con_Alma;1571129 wrote:Agreed in that it not always at the same rate but that the rich will adapt to the legislative changes put in place and continue to accumulate wealth. The ability to do so has a lot to do with the ability to be wealthy.
rather than brilliance it is largely their wealth that grants them access to skilled lawyers, accountants, lobbyists, bureaucrats and elected officials that make that accumulation possible.
Jan 23, 2014 7:14pm
J

jmog

Senior Member

6,567 posts
Jan 23, 2014 9:52 PM
isadore;1571028 wrote:For the majority, income levels have dropped substantially with the median male worker making $32,137 in 2010, and an inflation-adjusted income of $32,844 in 1968.
[114
Median household income 52,823 in 2007 , has since trended downward to $49,445 in 2010
Although the banking industry and housing sector were hit hard in the 1980–1982 recession, the housing sector was hit harder in the 2008–2009 .
I notice you seem to forgot to compare to the Carter recession like I said...imagine that.
Jan 23, 2014 9:52pm
I

isadore

Senior Member

7,762 posts
Jan 23, 2014 10:51 PM
jmog;1571471 wrote:I notice you seem to forgot to compare to the Carter recession like I said...imagine that.
duh, gosh the statement about the damage to the housing and banking industry being worse from 2008-2009 than 1980-82 is compare Bush to Carter recessions.
Jan 23, 2014 10:51pm
I

isadore

Senior Member

7,762 posts
Jan 23, 2014 10:56 PM
Al Bundy;1571137 wrote:We have had 5 years of Obama's leadership. During that time, the stock market has more than doubled while the median income has dropped by 7%.

Gosh a ruddies Bush policies bury the median income and Obama brings it back;.
Jan 23, 2014 10:56pm
G

gut

Senior Member

15,058 posts
Jan 24, 2014 1:24 AM
It was the housing bubble that buried median incomes, and that was a fully bipartisan creation pushed by Democrats and with roots in the Clinton administration.

And the brilliant liberals are well on their way to destroying healthcare just like they did with housing. Maybe they'll eventually learn everyone having everything is not good for everybody.
Jan 24, 2014 1:24am
C

Con_Alma

Senior Member

12,198 posts
Jan 24, 2014 8:01 AM
isadore;1571387 wrote:rather than brilliance it is largely their wealth that grants them access to skilled lawyers, accountants, lobbyists, bureaucrats and elected officials that make that accumulation possible.
Who said brilliance?? Certainly not I. There's no doubt the money in their palms will enable them to pay for the means to assure continued wealth accumulation.

Just anothert reason the rich will always get richer. Changes the rules. The wealthy will change what they need to do to continue to get wealthier.
Jan 24, 2014 8:01am
I

isadore

Senior Member

7,762 posts
Jan 24, 2014 1:24 PM
gut;1571522 wrote:It was the housing bubble that buried median incomes, and that was a fully bipartisan creation pushed by Democrats and with roots in the Clinton administration.

And the brilliant liberals are well on their way to destroying healthcare just like they did with housing. Maybe they'll eventually learn everyone having everything is not good for everybody.
Reagan\Bush tax cuts produced our national debt Their deregulation produced the Great Recession. Caring Americans do not believe that “everyone should have everything“. But they do believe that our citizens should have food, clothing, housing and healthcare when needed. But there are some who begrudge it to them.
Jan 24, 2014 1:24pm
ernest_t_bass's avatar

ernest_t_bass

12th Son of the Lama

24,984 posts
Jan 24, 2014 1:35 PM
isadore;1571657 wrote:Reagan\Bush tax cuts produced our national debt Their deregulation produced the Great Recession. Caring Americans do not believe that “everyone should have everything“. But they do believe that our citizens should have food, clothing, housing and healthcare when needed. But there are some who begrudge it to them.
Jan 24, 2014 1:35pm
I

isadore

Senior Member

7,762 posts
Jan 24, 2014 1:36 PM
Con_Alma;1571551 wrote:Who said brilliance?? Certainly not I. There's no doubt the money in their palms will enable them to pay for the means to assure continued wealth accumulation.

Just anothert reason the rich will always get richer. Changes the rules. The wealthy will change what they need to do to continue to get wealthier.


For several decades we were able to keep some limit on their greed.
Jan 24, 2014 1:36pm
Q

QuakerOats

Senior Member

8,740 posts
Jan 24, 2014 2:05 PM
Thanks for the chart Izzy ---- right when the marxist took office in '08 is when median incomes began the big descent ---- go figure.



Keep up the good work.
Jan 24, 2014 2:05pm
I

isadore

Senior Member

7,762 posts
Jan 24, 2014 3:21 PM
QuakerOats;1571674 wrote:Thanks for the chart Izzy ---- right when the marxist took office in '08 is when median incomes began the big descent ---- go figure.



Keep up the good work.
gosh a ruddies, there is a descent beginning in 2007 but turned around by the Obama administration. thank you first African American President for putting a brake on that disaster begun by Bush policies favoring deregulation and the rich.
Jan 24, 2014 3:21pm
Q

QuakerOats

Senior Member

8,740 posts
Jan 24, 2014 3:39 PM
"deregulation" --- hilarious ........ tell us another one.
Jan 24, 2014 3:39pm
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BGFalcons82

Senior Member

2,173 posts
Jan 24, 2014 5:27 PM
How bout the stock markets this week, fellas? 500 point drop in two days. Looks like the bullish 'tudes have given way to the realities of ObummerKare and its theft of billions from those who liked their health care and wanted to keep it as promised. Period.
Jan 24, 2014 5:27pm
I

isadore

Senior Member

7,762 posts
Jan 24, 2014 6:57 PM
BGFalcons82;1571751 wrote:How bout the stock markets this week, fellas? 500 point drop in two days. Looks like the bullish 'tudes have given way to the realities of ObummerKare and its theft of billions from those who liked their health care and wanted to keep it as promised. Period.
gosh a ruddies really. Obama's fault, I guess that is what haters of our First African American President would falsely claim. But

"Slowing growth in China and a move by the Federal Reserve to start cutting back on its easy-money policies has caused problems in many emerging economies, where currencies have come under intense selling pressure, raising fears of economic problems caused by rising inflation and capital outflows.
On Thursday, the Argentine peso plunged 15% versus the U.S. dollar, its biggest swoon since 2002. Similarly the Turkish lira hit a record low vs. the U.S. greenback.
"Market turbulence in Turkey ... and now Argentina has led to talk of a new crisis sweeping emerging markets," Neil Shearing, an analyst at Capital Economics told clients in a research notes."
http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/markets/2014/01/24/stocks-friday/4816211/
Jan 24, 2014 6:57pm
C

Con_Alma

Senior Member

12,198 posts
Jan 24, 2014 7:32 PM
isadore;1571666 wrote:

For several decades we were able to keep some limit on their greed.

They will adapt to such limitations and continue to accumulate wealth.

That chart only shows income. That's hardly where real wealth multiples.
Jan 24, 2014 7:32pm