http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/daily-ticker/u-pass-saudi-arabia-energy-production-iea-says-170907660.html;_ylt=Ams1vIpVNr8PIXil1MBVERmiuYdG;_ylu=X3oDMTN1MG1zNnJ0BG1pdANGaW5hbmNlIEZQIE1lZ2F0cm9uIDIEcGtnAzg5MGQxODc3LWEzYmQtMzk4ZS05NjljLTBmYWM5NGJjYmNlZgRwb3MDMQRzZWMDbWVnYXRyb24EdmVyA2FkYjY3OWQwLTJjZWItMTFlMi05ZTdmLWE3ZTcyM2M4YWY0NQ--;_ylg=X3oDMTJocThhZG92BGludGwDdXMEbGFuZwNlbi11cwRwc3RhaWQDBHBzdGNhdANob21lBHB0A3NlY3Rpb25zBHRlc3QDSG9yaXpvbnRhbF9NYXJrZXRfU3VtbWFyeQ--;_ylv=3

New report out today stating the US is going to surpass Saudi Arabia and Russia in energy production and eventually become self-sufficient. That's obviously good economic news for us, but foreign policy wise the middle east will become a giant shit show (more-so than it is now) when we finally stop depending on them for oil. Kind of nice and scary at the same time to think about...

I'll believe it when I see it.

sleeper;1318519 wrote:I'll believe it when I see it.

This.

derek bomar;1318516 wrote:http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/daily-ticker/u-pass-saudi-arabia-energy-production-iea-says-170907660.html;_ylt=Ams1vIpVNr8PIXil1MBVERmiuYdG;_ylu=X3oDMTN1MG1zNnJ0BG1pdANGaW5hbmNlIEZQIE1lZ2F0cm9uIDIEcGtnAzg5MGQxODc3LWEzYmQtMzk4ZS05NjljLTBmYWM5NGJjYmNlZgRwb3MDMQRzZWMDbWVnYXRyb24EdmVyA2FkYjY3OWQwLTJjZWItMTFlMi05ZTdmLWE3ZTcyM2M4YWY0NQ--;_ylg=X3oDMTJocThhZG92BGludGwDdXMEbGFuZwNlbi11cwRwc3RhaWQDBHBzdGNhdANob21lBHB0A3NlY3Rpb25zBHRlc3QDSG9yaXpvbnRhbF9NYXJrZXRfU3VtbWFyeQ--;_ylv=3

New report out today stating the US is going to surpass Saudi Arabia and Russia in energy production and eventually become self-sufficient. That's obviously good economic news for us, but foreign policy wise the middle east will become a giant **** show (more-so than it is now) when we finally stop depending on them for oil. Kind of nice and scary at the same time to think about...

Not at all. We will never be energy independent because we don't own the oil.

If the Chicoms are more willing to pay for it at a higher price than we are it will be shipped out of this country. It does not belong to us.

That is why I have always found this idea of American energy independence to be laughable. Our oil is sold to the highest bidder, not necessarily Americans.

How can we be independent when we don't own it and have no means of keeping it in this country other than paying what the highest bidder is willing to pay?

I thought we were already a net exporter of natural gas?

Also, while we might become the largest producer of oil, I think we are a long way from being self-sufficient there. We would need a lot more hybrids on the highways, and probably a ton more natural gas vehicles. And the infrastructure really isn't there to support either.

The middle east would be just fine. If (huge if) and when the US was self-sufficient, that would just alleviate demand pressures and help reduce the cost of oil for the rest of the world (which would be good for the global economy), but there would still be plenty of global demand.

The real risk to the middle east is a more viable/competitive source for cars and trucks. I don't particularly see natural gas or electric as a real alternative globally. If that did happen, then there would be a real issue competing with the glut of global natural gas.

But if we were self-sufficient we could let the rest of the world worry about the Middle East? I don't see that happening, either.

IggyPride00;1318531 wrote:Not at all. We will never be energy independent because we don't own the oil.

If the Chicoms are more willing to pay for it at a higher price than we are it will be shipped out of this country. It does not belong to us.

That is why I have always found this idea of American energy independence to be laughable. Our oil is sold to the highest bidder, not necessarily Americans.

How can we be independent when we don't own it and have no means of keeping it in this country other than paying what the highest bidder is willing to pay?

we could always nationalize the energy industry...

Let's not forget, either, that the gubmit makes a boatload of taxes on oil (both at the pump and on the corporations). I suppose if prices were to fall 50% the rise in economic activity should offset those revenue losses, but you know that's not how the govt thinks.

IggyPride00;1318531 wrote:... Our oil is sold to the highest bidder, not necessarily Americans.

How can we be independent when we don't own it and have no means of keeping it in this country other than paying what the highest bidder is willing to pay?

Agreed.

Independent or not the price will still be based on the world market.

It makes a huge difference where are energy is coming from...even if it is not all about the 'price' or world market. When you are dependent on foreign sources...you are at the mercy of the politics of the producer...and much of the world's sources of oil are in volatile regions, not always friendly to the US. You shouldn't have to look very far to see how oil/energy has influenced our foreign policy.

HitsRus;1318578 wrote:It makes a huge difference where are energy is coming from...even if it is not all about the 'price' or world market. When you are dependent on foreign sources...you are at the mercy of the politics of the producer...and much of the world's sources of oil are in volatile regions, not always friendly to the US. You shouldn't have to look very far to see how oil/energy has influenced our foreign policy.

Good luck selling this self-sufficient mumbo jumbo to the next generation.

Novel idea: Put all your resources and money one big lot! Then everyone can pull from it!!! And then the world is happy!

HitsRus;1318578 wrote:You shouldn't have to look very far to see how oil/energy has influenced our foreign policy.

And it will continue to do so. Like it or not, in a global economy we can't just ignore events that can destabilize or damage the global economy, because we still feel that pain.

There's no way we can or should just ignore the middle east imploding because we have our own oil. The resulting global depression still sucks us in. The difference is our war machine doesn't get shutdown.

HitsRus;1318578 wrote:It makes a huge difference where are energy is coming from...even if it is not all about the 'price' or world market. When you are dependent on foreign sources...you are at the mercy of the politics of the producer...and much of the world's sources of oil are in volatile regions, not always friendly to the US. You shouldn't have to look very far to see how oil/energy has influenced our foreign policy.

If the Middle East blows itself up, then the Chicoms just bid more for our oil because we would be the only stable supplier.

As long as oil is sold on a world market we are at the whim of the market, and what is happening around the globe will continue to impact what we pay.

Nothing short of nationalizing the industry can ever make us energy independent. Even then it is a wild stretch, but at least then we would be protected from having to ship it out to buyers willing to pay a higher price if we wanted to.

I am by no means advocating that, but any politician that has called for energy independence is indirectly advocating for that because that is the only way to truly keep American energy in America.

IggyPride00;1319519 wrote: I am by no means advocating that, but any politician that has called for energy independence is indirectly advocating for that because that is the only way to truly keep American energy in America.

It's not mutually exclusive, though. They could nationalize it whenever they want, practically just flip a switch. Blockade the ports, if they have to (hey, maybe that's why Romney wanted all those navy ships!)

derek bomar;1318516 wrote:http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/daily-ticker/u-pass-saudi-arabia-energy-production-iea-says-170907660.html;_ylt=Ams1vIpVNr8PIXil1MBVERmiuYdG;_ylu=X3oDMTN1MG1zNnJ0BG1pdANGaW5hbmNlIEZQIE1lZ2F0cm9uIDIEcGtnAzg5MGQxODc3LWEzYmQtMzk4ZS05NjljLTBmYWM5NGJjYmNlZgRwb3MDMQRzZWMDbWVnYXRyb24EdmVyA2FkYjY3OWQwLTJjZWItMTFlMi05ZTdmLWE3ZTcyM2M4YWY0NQ--;_ylg=X3oDMTJocThhZG92BGludGwDdXMEbGFuZwNlbi11cwRwc3RhaWQDBHBzdGNhdANob21lBHB0A3NlY3Rpb25zBHRlc3QDSG9yaXpvbnRhbF9NYXJrZXRfU3VtbWFyeQ--;_ylv=3

New report out today stating the US is going to surpass Saudi Arabia and Russia in energy production and eventually become self-sufficient. That's obviously good economic news for us, but foreign policy wise the middle east will become a giant **** show (more-so than it is now) when we finally stop depending on them for oil. Kind of nice and scary at the same time to think about...

Just wrote a paper on this for school. It'll never fully happen