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Cher
Posts: 276
Aug 12, 2012 11:31am
Here's my perspective, and I don't expect all of you to agree with me...
Over the past 40-50 years, the U.S. government has mutated into a two-party, giant bumbling mess of counterproductivity and corporate favoritism. Whoever has the deepest pockets wins elections and neither democrats nor republicans have true opinions anymore, and just follow what their respective party wants them to think. Presidential candidates might swing on certain topics, but Congress itself has mutated to the point where they can't pass a bill unless there's a catastrophic event such as 9/11 to bring about rash (bad) decisions such as the PATRIOT Act.
I don't consider myself a democrat, nor a republican, or anything for that matter. I consider myself right in the middle, because I think what I want to think...and I THINK the country is too far off the deep end to save.
Thoughts?
Over the past 40-50 years, the U.S. government has mutated into a two-party, giant bumbling mess of counterproductivity and corporate favoritism. Whoever has the deepest pockets wins elections and neither democrats nor republicans have true opinions anymore, and just follow what their respective party wants them to think. Presidential candidates might swing on certain topics, but Congress itself has mutated to the point where they can't pass a bill unless there's a catastrophic event such as 9/11 to bring about rash (bad) decisions such as the PATRIOT Act.
I don't consider myself a democrat, nor a republican, or anything for that matter. I consider myself right in the middle, because I think what I want to think...and I THINK the country is too far off the deep end to save.
Thoughts?
sleeper
Posts: 27,879
Aug 12, 2012 11:34am
I agree 100%. It isn't about doing what's best for the country anymore, it's about blaming the other side for all the problems.
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WebFire
Posts: 14,779
Aug 12, 2012 12:25pm
Agree 100% as well. It will ultimately be the ruin of our country.
Cleveland Buck
Posts: 5,126
Aug 12, 2012 12:36pm
You are correct, except it has been going on longer than 40-50 years. Both sides are the same. They serve the same masters. Thye bicker about gay rights and abortion to distract the sheep from what they are really doing, seizing control of every aspect of our lives. There is no left, right, or center. We either have unalienable rights to life, liberty, and property, or we have whatever rights the government is gracious enough to allow us to have. Those are the two sides. Both parties fall on the same side.
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Con_Alma
Posts: 12,198
Aug 12, 2012 1:09pm
I disagre that it's "too far off the deep end to save". I am not hopeless in my thoughts in that regard.
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stlouiedipalma
Posts: 1,797
Aug 12, 2012 3:02pm
I not only think it can still be saved, I also think it is worth saving. Even in our lowest times this is still the best and brightest in the world. I can't think of anywhere else that has the freedoms and the standard of living we enjoy. It's up to all of us to get involved, hold our elected representatives to doing what is good and just for all of us and to speak out against anything which jeopardizes our freedoms. Giving up is easy. This country should require hard work to keep it what it is.
FatHobbit
Posts: 8,651
Aug 13, 2012 8:50am
I would imagine people have felt disenfranchised by politics forever.Cleveland Buck;1245298 wrote: except it has been going on longer than 40-50 years
Heretic
Posts: 18,820
Aug 13, 2012 10:16am
Very true. You get a lot of that here (and the previous JJ poli board). All I can do anymore is laugh and be glad I was born with a functional brain.sleeper;1245238 wrote:I agree 100%. It isn't about doing what's best for the country anymore, it's about blaming the other side for all the problems.
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gut
Posts: 15,058
Aug 13, 2012 12:20pm
When the time comes, I will move to Canada :laugh:
believer
Posts: 8,153
Aug 13, 2012 3:12pm
I;m with you....I hear they have the best socialized health care system in the world. :thumbup:gut;1245855 wrote:When the time comes, I will move to Canada :laugh:
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stlouiedipalma
Posts: 1,797
Aug 14, 2012 12:06am
It's actually much better than what we have here. Rather than listen to the scare tactics, you should talk to some real Canadians. They think our system is a joke.
believer
Posts: 8,153
Aug 14, 2012 4:59am
I guess that's why some Canadians come to the United States when they need urgent care. That's scary.stlouiedipalma;1246242 wrote:It's actually much better than what we have here. Rather than listen to the scare tactics, you should talk to some real Canadians. They think our system is a joke.
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stlouiedipalma
Posts: 1,797
Aug 14, 2012 11:18pm
Here's a good health care story from Canada. I was consulting there in 2010 when one of my buddies from Iowa had a perforated ulcer which required emergency surgery. He was taken to the hospital and the surgery was performed and he recovered in a couple of weeks. A few days after the surgery the plant manager got in touch with me and asked me if I had insurance coverage from the States. I told him that I did, but wanted to know why he asked. It seems that my buddy's insurance provider disallowed his entire claim because he didn't get pre-approval for his surgery and post-surgery care. The Canadians were flabbergasted at this. The company we were consulting for picked up his entire medical bill, however, even though it wasn't work-related.
Not one single worker at that plant was willing to trade what they had in health care coverage for what we "enjoy" in the U.S.
Not one single worker at that plant was willing to trade what they had in health care coverage for what we "enjoy" in the U.S.
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I Wear Pants
Posts: 16,223
Aug 14, 2012 11:56pm
Again, having some of the best hospitals and doctors in the world is really an anecdote when talking about an overall health system.believer;1246268 wrote:I guess that's why some Canadians come to the United States when they need urgent care. That's scary.
(I say "again" because I've mentioned this on the board before, I'm unsure if you were in the discussion though)
believer
Posts: 8,153
Aug 15, 2012 5:38am
There are stupid issues in the American health care insurance industry to be sure. In fact I've gone on record many times agreeing that many things need fixed like pre-approvals, pre-existing conditions, etc.stlouiedipalma;1247176 wrote:It seems that my buddy's insurance provider disallowed his entire claim because he didn't get pre-approval for his surgery and post-surgery care.
But it doesn't negate the fact that American still enjoy the best health care system in the world.
Side note: Obamacare isn't fixing it by the way.
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Con_Alma
Posts: 12,198
Aug 15, 2012 6:03am
The biggest problem I see is that people don't accept insurance as insurance but rather use it as a funding vehicle. Insurance should be to transfer risk. How much risk a person wants to trasfer should be their choice.
It's not an escrow account used to fund all expenses relating to medical needs.
It's not an escrow account used to fund all expenses relating to medical needs.
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WebFire
Posts: 14,779
Aug 15, 2012 9:11am
Yes!Con_Alma;1247245 wrote:The biggest problem I see is that people don't accept insurance as insurance but rather use it as a funding vehicle. Insurance should be to transfer risk. How much risk a person wants to trasfer should be their choice.
It's not an escrow account used to fund all expenses relating to medical needs.
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QuakerOats
Posts: 8,740
Aug 15, 2012 9:43am
stlouiedipalma;1245330 wrote:I not only think it can still be saved, I also think it is worth saving. Even in our lowest times this is still the best and brightest in the world. I can't think of anywhere else that has the freedoms and the standard of living we enjoy. It's up to all of us to get involved, hold our elected representatives to doing what is good and just for all of us and to speak out against anything which jeopardizes our freedoms. Giving up is easy. This country should require hard work to keep it what it is.
We agree!
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Cher
Posts: 276
Aug 15, 2012 9:52am
US ranks:stlouiedipalma;1245330 wrote: Even in our lowest times this is still the best and brightest in the world.
Literacy: 7th
Math: 27th
Science: 22nd
Overall: 21st
Canada, Great Britain, Australia come to mind.stlouiedipalma;1245330 wrote:I can't think of anywhere else that has the freedoms and the standard of living we enjoy.
BGFalcons82
Posts: 2,173
Aug 15, 2012 10:32am
So what is the antidote? More spending? More power for the Dept of Edumacation? More power for teacher's unions? More control by Our Dear Leader?Cher;1247375 wrote:US ranks:
Literacy: 7th
Math: 27th
Science: 22nd
Overall: 21st
We've been spending more and giving more control to 3rd party players for decades and we're getting further down the rankings. Maybe we should try something different? Nah...let's just keep doing the same things over and over hoping for different results. That's how we keep bureaucrats and elitists in charge and they are best and brightest of all. :rolleyes:
sleeper
Posts: 27,879
Aug 15, 2012 10:42am
Bingo.Con_Alma;1247245 wrote:The biggest problem I see is that people don't accept insurance as insurance but rather use it as a funding vehicle. Insurance should be to transfer risk. How much risk a person wants to trasfer should be their choice.
It's not an escrow account used to fund all expenses relating to medical needs.
sleeper
Posts: 27,879
Aug 15, 2012 10:45am
Please remember when ranking the US education system vs. the world's there are two things to consider. #1: We keep shit teachers around far too long with bloated salaries protected by a overzealous and far to powerful union. #2: In the USA, we educated everyone and count everyone in the statistics(even mentally handicapped and morons). Other countries weed out crap students and only report their best and brightest(I'm looking at you China).Cher;1247375 wrote:US ranks:
Literacy: 7th
Math: 27th
Science: 22nd
Overall: 21st
Canada, Great Britain, Australia come to mind.
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Sonofanump
Aug 15, 2012 3:27pm
Sometimes there are shit teachers. Sometimes there are teachers who work more than they get paid.sleeper;1247423 wrote:Please remember when ranking the US education system vs. the world's there are two things to consider. #1: We keep shit teachers around far too long with bloated salaries protected by a overzealous and far to powerful union.
Yes.sleeper;1247423 wrote:#2: In the USA, we educated everyone and count everyone in the statistics(even mentally handicapped and morons). Other countries weed out crap students and only report their best and brightest(I'm looking at you China).
sleeper
Posts: 27,879
Aug 15, 2012 3:46pm
I agree 100%. I think good teachers are underpaid heavily.Sonofanump;1247730 wrote:Sometimes there are shit teachers. Sometimes there are teachers who work more than they get paid.
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Cher
Posts: 276
Aug 15, 2012 4:33pm
I am not saying otherwise, just poking holes in his claims.sleeper;1247423 wrote:Please remember when ranking the US education system vs. the world's there are two things to consider. #1: We keep shit teachers around far too long with bloated salaries protected by a overzealous and far to powerful union. #2: In the USA, we educated everyone and count everyone in the statistics(even mentally handicapped and morons). Other countries weed out crap students and only report their best and brightest(I'm looking at you China).