I do some travel within the US, Canada and Asia.


I was thinking to help with security every American citizen (kids over the age of 16 years old) be required to have a Pass Port to travel via Air/Train within the US. Quick trip to Chicago show them a Pass Port, fling to Florida need a Pass Port.

Here is my reasoning:
1. Create additional revenue for the Federal Government to use to protect our boarder, guard against terrorist and Homeland Security funding.
2. Proof of Citizenship, Valid Driver License and Birth Certificate (Because of my situation I had to provide military records and documentation) not a bad idea for everyone that served to provide.
3. I think the cost and proper documentation would deter some from air travel who should not be traveling.

Thoughts and opinions?

Two thoughts:

1. This thread will probably get moved.

2. When I got my passport, it was almost $160 - picture included in that total price. I don't think that's a "reasonable" price for everybody to have to pay.

Oooops, I should have said three thoughts.

3. We already have social security numbers and birth certificates. That SHOULD be enough, but we know it isn't. And while it would certainly keep people from flying in our skies, it would also greatly reduce vacationing and tourism from the international community, which wouldn't be good for our wallets.

I have no interest in additional requirements to prove who I am or paying additional fees/taxes.

1. Passport is one word, not two.

2. If a passport is required for all interstate air and rail travel then you have each state it's own country, and in some ways, you have stripped states of their rights by needing a federal document to travel there.

3. I'm not sure how this would solve any travel issues that currently exist. This wouldn't get people through security any quicker or get people on their flights more efficiently.

4. This would be a huge hassle for anyone who has never flown before but has to take an emergency flight. I don't know numbers, but I would guess that there are a lot of flights where seats are sold last minute because someone needs to get on a flight due to a family illness, accident, birth, or death. If my father were killed in a car accident tomorrow I would need to get on a plane to fly out to Idaho were he lives to be with family. If I've never flown before and don't have a passport I wouldn't be able to board a plane under your system. Instead it would take me three days to drive cross country (two days if I drove straight through, which would be close to impossible if driving on my own) and a lot more money on gas and food than what a flight would cost me. I then have to take twice as long off work because of six days of travel instead of two, and I get to spend less time with mourning with my family and I'm no help making arrangements while I'm driving.

5. You said this would deter some from air travel who should not be traveling. I'm not exactly sure what you mean by this, but since most people who travel by air are doing so for some reason I can only assume that you really mean that those you don't won't to be on a plane with would not travel by air. This restricts commerce and would put most airlines out of business. Family's who would now have to drive to Disney World won't go because it's more expensive to drive to Florida and too much of a hassle with young children, whereas a flight is easy. You would cut out a lot of travelers who would choose other modes of transport, costing the airlines money and putting most under, which would then likely drive prices up since there is less competition.

Overall, this sounds like one of the worst ideas I've heard in a while. A big part of the reason why our state system and federal government was set up the way it is was to allow easy and unrestricted transportation and commerce from one state to another. This would effectively do away with that ease. That being said, I always use my passport as my ID when I travel, simply because I find it's easier to use than a driver's license.

I don't think having to carry a Passport is a good idea.

3. I think the cost and proper documentation would deter some from air travel who should not be traveling.

Who shouldn't be traveling?

One of the stupidest posts and ideas I've ever heard of on this site. Congrats Belly!

yeah 160 every 10 years is not something i want to pay unless im traveling i got mine last year and have used it three time but its not fair to charge people not traveling

CenterBHSFan;641162 wrote:Two thoughts:

1. This thread will probably get moved.

2. When I got my passport, it was almost $160 - picture included in that total price. I don't think that's a "reasonable" price for everybody to have to pay.

Oooops, I should have said three thoughts.

3. We already have social security numbers and birth certificates. That SHOULD be enough, but we know it isn't. And while it would certainly keep people from flying in our skies, it would also greatly reduce vacationing and tourism from the international community, which wouldn't be good for our wallets.

You paid $160??? When did you get yours?? I got mine almost 3 years ago and only paid like $100 total for everything.



EH....upon further review, I guess I only paid the $135 it costs to get it taken care of at the post office.

sportchampps;642244 wrote:yeah 160 every 10 years is not something i want to pay unless im traveling i got mine last year and have used it three time but its not fair to charge people not traveling

You don't HAVE to renew it after 10 years. And it's only $110 to renew lol

wildcats20;642245 wrote:You paid $160??? When did you get yours?? I got mine almost 3 years ago and only paid like $100 total for everything.

EH....upon further review, I guess I only paid the $135 it costs to get it taken care of at the post office.

Cats, I got mine at the Wheeling post office last year (september). The pic I had done somewhere else, hence the total was almost $160 altogether. Couldn't find a local Ohio post office that still did it.

What pissed me off was that if I drove or took a boat to Mexico, a passport/card would have only been $36. But to fly into Mexico a passport costs 4x's as much? What a ripoff!

dwccrew;642241 wrote:One of the stupidest posts and ideas I've ever heard of on this site. Congrats Belly!

agree.

dwccrew;642241 wrote:One of the stupidest posts and ideas I've ever heard of on this site. Congrats Belly!

Food for thought and some of you are choking:

I used the Passport/ Travel because it was documentation that requires drive license, birth certification and SSN to get and the Feds do a back ground check on those documents. Those three documents are the most fraudent documents used by illegals and terrorists.

The 9/11 Terrorist all had those three fraud documentation and several driver license for different state.

Think outside the box people: If travel within the US required and Passport what would be the benefits?
It is easy to talk about safe travel, prevent of terrorist movement and bombing, corruption of illegal but when a solution is within the present government ability to do. There a problem

http://www.cis.org/identitytheft

• Illegal immigrants are not “undocumented.” They have fraudulent documents such as counterfeit Social Security cards, forged drivers licenses, fake “green cards,” and phony birth certificates. Experts suggest that approximately 75 percent of working-age illegal aliens use fraudulent Social Security cards to obtain employment.
• Most (98 percent) Social Security number (SSN) thieves use their own names with stolen numbers. The federal E-Verify program, now mandated in only 14 states, can detect this fraud. Universal, mandatory use of E-Verify would curb this and stop virtually 100 percent of child identity theft.
• Illegal immigration and high levels of identity theft go hand-in-hand. States with the most illegal immigration also have high levels of job-related identity theft. In Arizona, 33 percent or all identity theft is job-related (as opposed to identity theft motivated simply by profit). In Texas it is 27 percent; in New Mexico, 23 percent; in Colorado, 22 percent; California, 20 percent; and in Nevada, 16 percent. Eight of the 10 states with the highest percentage of illegal aliens in their total population are among the top 10 states in identity theft (Arizona, California, Florida, Texas, Nevada, New York, Georgia, and Colorado).
• Children are prime targets. In Arizona, it is estimated that over one million children are victims of identity theft. In Utah, 1,626 companies were found to be paying wages to the SSNs of children on public assistance under the age of 13. These individuals suffer very real and very serious consequences in their lives.
• Illegal aliens commit felonies in order to get jobs. Illegal aliens who use fraudulent documents, perjure themselves on I-9 forms, and commit identity theft in order to get jobs are committing serious offenses and are not “law abiding.”
• Illegally employed aliens send billions of dollars annually to their home countries, rather than spending it in the United States and helping stimulate the American economy. In October 2008 alone, $2.4 billion was transferred to Mexico.
• Tolerance of corruption erodes the rule of law. Corruption is a serious problem in most illegal aliens’ home countries. Allowing it to flourish here paves the way for additional criminal activity and increased corruption throughout society.
• Leaders support perpetrators and ignore victims. Political, civic, religious, business, education, and media leaders blame Americans for “forcing” illegal aliens to commit document fraud and identity theft. No similar concern is expressed for the American men, women, and children whose lives are destroyed in the process.
• The Social Security Administration and Internal Revenue Service facilitate illegal immigrant-driven identity theft. Both turn a blind eye to massive SSN fraud and take no action to stop it. The Social Security Administration assigns SSNs to new-born infants that are being used illegally. The IRS demands that victims pay taxes on wages earned by illegal aliens using their stolen SSNs, while taking no action to stop the identity theft.
• State and local governments need to adopt tougher laws to supplement federal efforts. The Bureau of Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) is targeting large document fraud rings and the most egregious employers, but their resources are limited and stretched across multiple priorities. In 2007, identity theft cases represented only 7 percent of the total ICE case load.
• Employers must do their part. They can ensure that they have a legal workforce by using a combination of the federal government’s E-Verify and Social Security Number Verification Service systems and by signing up for the federal government’s IMAGE program or privately conducted audits.

Yeah, lets require our citizens to prove that they aren't criminals at all times. Guilty until proven innocent is the American way no?

I'm intrigued that Belly wants more power to go to the federal government.....

I Wear Pants;642498 wrote:Yeah, lets require our citizens to prove that they aren't criminals at all times. Guilty until proven innocent is the American way no?

Don't we already have that with projects like the TSA?

Reminds me of the old Soviet days - "show me your papers".

I use my passport for everything anyways

ptown_trojans_1;642513 wrote:I'm intrigued that Belly wants more power to go to the federal government.....

It’s not that I want bigger government nor do I want more government control. If the Federal Government has the ability and a department establish that can be utilized for the security of the American people and the prevention of terrorist and illegal’s movement within the America, use that department to it fullest potential.

Why spend millions and million for TSA when the first step of limited terrorist travel has not been implemented.
What is the goal of Homeland Security and the TSA?

queencitybuckeye;642556 wrote:Reminds me of the old Soviet days - "show me your papers".

Show a fraud document or show a authorized legal citizen proper passport to get on this plane or train ... no one asking you to carry a passport 24/7 ....

I Wear Pants;642498 wrote:Yeah, lets require our citizens to prove that they aren't criminals at all times. Guilty until proven innocent is the American way no?

But it is OK to scan and pat down citizen against their will... who the gulity one in that situation...

who the hell spells passport (Pass Port) that way? I thought you were edumicated, belly

Belly35;642572 wrote:Why spend millions and million for TSA when the first step of limited terrorist travel has not been implemented.
What is the goal of Homeland Security and the TSA?

If they are getting to the TSA and they are not US citizens, won't they have had to show a passport anyway? At least to get inside the US?

Belly35;642572 wrote:It’s not that I want bigger government nor do I want more government control. If the Federal Government has the ability and a department establish that can be utilized for the security of the American people and the prevention of terrorist and illegal’s movement within the America, use that department to it fullest potential.

Why spend millions and million for TSA when the first step of limited terrorist travel has not been implemented.
What is the goal of Homeland Security and the TSA?

Think about this for a second.
1. If everyone had to get a passport, that is a massive strain on the State Department's Passport office. Meaning, it would have to dramatically increase its budget and manpower to ensure there is not a huge backlog in the process. That is a bigger government.
2. Or we would have to radically change our passport services, leading to probably delays and screwups making no one happy.
3. The very concept of federal power, a passport, replacing a driver's license is very uneasy for many states.
4. What is the difference between this passport and a national ID that R's have been arguing against for many years?
5. Terrorists will find a way. They will use Americans, which they are already doing.
6. The solution is not a massive new passport program, but better and more coordinated intelligence. Coordinating intelligence from the CIA, NSA, etc. down to the state and local levels to act is the main role of the DHS and the TSA.

ptown_trojans_1;642920 wrote:Think about this for a second.
1. If everyone had to get a passport, that is a massive strain on the State Department's Passport office. Meaning, it would have to dramatically increase its budget and manpower to ensure there is not a huge backlog in the process. That is a bigger government.

Not everyone only those that want to travel via air or train. Many of those who already travel by air and rail have passport already. So the addition huge backlog should not be that much of a burden on a already budgeted operation. Plus the program can be 2 year project aided at stream lining the operation and updating the system to work with technology and do proper tracking of corrupt and fraud data.


2. Or we would have to radically change our passport services, leading to probably delays and screw-up’s making no one happy.

The program can be applied over the next year or two so to not to hinder the service and lead to delays and screw-up. I have a feeling that PT1 lack the confidence of the Federal Government to handle such matters. Correct me if I'm wrong but you support Obamacare and you have a problem with the fed handling data…...


3. The very concept of federal power, a passport, replacing a driver's license is very uneasy for many states.

Where was it stated replacing driver license ?????

4. What is the difference between this passport and a national ID that R's have been arguing against for many years?

This is not some ID assigned to every individual in America nor is this a ID tracking system this is a Passport to Travel and to limit the movement of illegal and terrorist in our country


5. Terrorists will find a way. They will use Americans, which they are already doing.

So be it but lets not make easy …..


6. The solution is not a massive new passport program, but better and more coordinated intelligence. Coordinating intelligence from the CIA, NSA, etc. down to the state and local levels to act is the main role of the DHS and the TSA.

Where is there a better starting point to coordinate intelligence then to stop the movement illegal and terrorist and create a data base of fraud documentation usage.

Read between the lines