Hb31187;1107303 wrote:Id put Rondo above Westbrook. And slide John Wall into the top 10, hes better than 8-10 on that list IMO

No he's not. You're obviously being fooled by his hype and the fact that he runs fast and jumps high.

Washington has gotten WORSE in John Wall's second season. He has a lot of talent but he's yet to develop it. He's under 10% from 3 and his FG% is right around 43... Not good.

To compare, Kyrie in his rookie season is shooting 48% from the field and 43% from 3. Kyrie also has a much better PER than Wall. Kyrie averages 6 minutes less, but averages more points and 2 less assists.

If you would have said he's better than Calderon, I may agree... But he's not better than Parker or Irving.

hoops23;1107310 wrote:No he's not. You're obviously being fooled by his hype and the fact that he runs fast and jumps high.

Washington has gotten WORSE in John Wall's second season. He has a lot of talent but he's yet to develop it. He's under 10% from 3 and his FG% is right around 43... Not good.

To compare, Kyrie in his rookie season is shooting 48% from the field and 43% from 3. Kyrie also has a much better PER than Wall. Kyrie averages 6 minutes less, but averages more points and 2 less assists.

If you would have said he's better than Calderon, I may agree... But he's not better than Parker or Irving.

I agree about Wall he is not in the top 10. I was just dealing with the current list form the link. If we can insert other names I am also putting in Lowry and Lawson and taking out Calderon and Conley.

hoops23;1107310 wrote:No he's not. You're obviously being fooled by his hype and the fact that he runs fast and jumps high.

Washington has gotten WORSE in John Wall's second season. He has a lot of talent but he's yet to develop it. He's under 10% from 3 and his FG% is right around 43... Not good.

To compare, Kyrie in his rookie season is shooting 48% from the field and 43% from 3. Kyrie also has a much better PER than Wall. Kyrie averages 6 minutes less, but averages more points and 2 less assists.

Don't want to take the time to do the comparison but I have to imagine that most if not everyone around Wall is playing worse too. I would think he gets looked at by opposing D's more than McGee(when he's not making boneheaded plays), Young, Crawford and Blatche.

IMO

1. CP3
2. D Will
3. Westbrook
4. Rose
5. Nash
6. Rondo (sorry, until he can hit a jumper he stays at 6)
7. Conley (he showed last year he's worth the money)
8. Irving
9. Parker
10. Lowry

sportswizuhrd;1107316 wrote:Don't want to take the time to do the comparison but I have to imagine that most if not everyone around Wall is playing worse too. I would think he gets looked at by opposing D's more than McGee(when he's not making boneheaded plays), Young, Crawford and Blatche.

Compare the Wizards roster to the Cavs roster.

count how many players you'd rather have from each team at their position.

Also, Kyrie is the defenses primary focus as well... Hasn't been an issue for him.. And he's playing with some garbage players.

sportswizuhrd;1107316 wrote:Don't want to take the time to do the comparison but I have to imagine that most if not everyone around Wall is playing worse too. I would think he gets looked at by opposing D's more than McGee(when he's not making boneheaded plays), Young, Crawford and Blatche.

Crawford and McGee are playing better this year. Young about the same and Blatche has fallen off a lot.
The Wizards have the talent and still have only 8 wins.

Not sure why people are putting Conley over Parker.

Conley
Pts. 13.5
Asts-6.9
Steals-2.6
FG%-.438
3FG%-.348

Parker
Pts.-19.2
Asts-7.9
Steals-1.1
FG%-.460
3FG%-.260

hoops23;1107325 wrote:Compare the Wizards roster to the Cavs roster.

count how many players you'd rather have from each team at their position.

Also, Kyrie is the defenses primary focus as well... Hasn't been an issue for him.. And he's playing with some garbage players.

Wasn't comparing Wizards and Cavs, I was comparing '10-'11 Wizards to '11-'12 Wizards.

hoops23;1107310 wrote:No he's not. You're obviously being fooled by his hype and the fact that he runs fast and jumps high.

Washington has gotten WORSE in John Wall's second season. He has a lot of talent but he's yet to develop it. He's under 10% from 3 and his FG% is right around 43... Not good.

To compare, Kyrie in his rookie season is shooting 48% from the field and 43% from 3. Kyrie also has a much better PER than Wall. Kyrie averages 6 minutes less, but averages more points and 2 less assists.

If you would have said he's better than Calderon, I may agree... But he's not better than Parker or Irving.

John Wall isnt as good of a jump shooter as Irving. But he rebounds,passes, and gets to the lane and draws fouls better than Irving..just scores slightly less. Im not knocking Irving at all, so I'm not sure why you're getting so defensive and saying an opinion is wrong lol.

Comparing teams is stupid because the #1 pg on mosts list is playing for a horrendous team.

And yeah, Conley isnt exactly putting up very Impressive numbers. Not sure why people have him so high on their lists

So because I'm debating means I'm offended? SMH.

Also, Irving gets to the rim just as easily as Wall does.

And if Wall was getting to the rim do easily, why is he only shooting 43% from the field?

He also doesn't pass better, he just has teammates more capable of hitting shots.

hoops23;1107349 wrote:So because I'm debating means I'm offended? SMH.

Also, Irving gets to the rim just as easily as Wall does.

And if Wall was getting to the rim do easily, why is he only shooting 43% from the field?

He also doesn't pass better, he just has teammates more capable of hitting shots.

Because Wall settles for stupid shots, and doesnt drive as much as he should. He needs to address that, because little to no PG in the NBA is gonna stay in front of him for a game, but if he takes dumb shots anyone can guard him.

And who Wall is passing to really isnt that much better if at all than Irving. They both have little to no supporting cast, so ill go with the player averaging most assists . Theyre both damn good, but when the differences arent all that great, Ill take the player with more size speed and athleticism, especially in this new era of Pg's.

Hb31187;1107352 wrote:Because Wall settles for stupid shots, and doesnt drive as much as he should. He needs to address that, because little to no PG in the NBA is gonna stay in front of him for a game, but if he takes dumb shots anyone can guard him.

And who Wall is passing to really isnt that much better if at all than Irving. They both have little to no supporting cast, so ill go with the player averaging most assists . Theyre both damn good, but when the differences arent all that great, Ill take the player with more size speed and athleticism, especially in this new era of Pg's.

LOL.

Wall is 6'4 195

Irving is 6'3' 191

HUGE size difference :rolleyes:

They both are lightening quick.

But, you'd admittedly take the PG who settles for stupid shots (I.E 15 foot jumpers he can't hit) vs the PG who is playing WAAAAAAY more efficient. Excuse me if that doesn't make sense.

Irving as a rookie has a FAR superior jumpshot and bball IQ than Wall does.

Also, Wall has teammates that are much better scorers than Irving's. Crawford, Young and McGee are all better scorers than everybody outside of Irving on the Cavs. Jamison is a volume chucker.

I mean, Irving only shoots about 5% (near 50% overall) better from the field and 40% better from 3, but yeah, those aren't big differences... lol

John Wall is an athlete playing the PG position. I've seen him play live 3 times, as well as a lot of Wizards games (they're must see TV this season. I'm looking forward to McGee making a jumper on the other team's basket, its going to happen this season). Wall is the better athlete but I think Irving is the better player/PG. Wall just doesn't seem to have the knack intangilbles that top teir PGs have. His team is plagued by horrible me first atitudes (want their stats) and he seems to buy into that. Instead of being a leader he seems to follow the mentality that Nick Young (never passes, nor as he not been open/seen a jump shot he didn't like), Blatche (might be the worst player in the association, talk about a guy that doesn't get team ball), etc.. The team around him is pretty bad, and the situation is toxic. They need to clean up the locker room there but it starts up top with Wall. Has all the potential, but he's not there yet. I probably wouldn't put him in my top 15 (right now) pgs in the league.

As for Conley over Parker, I'm a huge OSU fan (getting that out of the way). I've disliked parker and his game since he came into the league. Always thought he was over rated, and just an avg player. He's having a better year statistically this season, but I still think overall Conley is the better player/PG. Parker avgs 5.8 career ast total which as the starting PG with Tim Duncan on your team playing the ball they play is pretty poor. Conley is also a much better defender than Parker is just passable on that end (this goes beyond the steals). Conley is in the top 2 or 3 defenders at the PG spot. I can see the argument either way, Parker is having the better offensive season, but Conley is having the better all around season IMO which is why I rated him higher.

Commander of Awesome;1107414 wrote:John Wall is an athlete playing the PG position. I've seen him play live 3 times, as well as a lot of Wizards games (they're must see TV this season. I'm looking forward to McGee making a jumper on the other team's basket, its going to happen this season). Wall is the better athlete but I think Irving is the better player/PG. Wall just doesn't seem to have the knack intangilbles that top teir PGs have. His team is plagued by horrible me first atitudes (want their stats) and he seems to buy into that. Instead of being a leader he seems to follow the mentality that Nick Young (never passes, nor as he not been open/seen a jump shot he didn't like), Blatche (might be the worst player in the association, talk about a guy that doesn't get team ball), etc.. The team around him is pretty bad, and the situation is toxic. They need to clean up the locker room there but it starts up top with Wall. Has all the potential, but he's not there yet. I probably wouldn't put him in my top 15 (right now) pgs in the league.

As for Conley over Parker, I'm a huge OSU fan (getting that out of the way). I've disliked parker and his game since he came into the league. Always thought he was over rated, and just an avg player. He's having a better year statistically this season, but I still think overall Conley is the better player/PG. Parker avgs 5.8 career ast total which as the starting PG with Tim Duncan on your team playing the ball they play is pretty poor. Conley is also a much better defender than Parker is just passable on that end (this goes beyond the steals). Conley is in the top 2 or 3 defenders at the PG spot. I can see the argument either way, Parker is having the better offensive season, but Conley is having the better all around season IMO which is why I rated him higher.

That is why you are letting it cloud your judgement. Parker is better than Conley. Parker assists total are more the product of Popovich's system. Many people touch the ball in their offense. Ginoboli has the ball as much as Parker.

I like John Wall but he has some work to do. He needs to develop a jumper and mature himself mentally.

Melo has ruined the nba

The Magic lost to the Bobcats by 16

Yikes

Mullens 8 points 13 rebounds in 25 min

dave;1107529 wrote:Melo has ruined the nba

He is a hell of a lot better bball player than you are. I don't see you playing in the NBA with the world's best bball players. He is also making a crap load of money.

/robj55

like_that;1107539 wrote:He is a hell of a lot better bball player than you are. I don't see you playing in the NBA with the world's best bball players. He is also making a crap load of money.

/robj55

lol

like_that;1107539 wrote:He is a hell of a lot better bball player than you are. I don't see you playing in the NBA with the world's best bball players. He is also making a crap load of money.

/robj55

nice, I laughed actually

Kobe has struggled all game, but steps up and hits a huge shot to send it to OT vs the Pistons.

Pistons win it by 3 in OT. Rodney Stuckey breaking Kobe's ankles(not literally skyhook) will be on the top plays.

Kobe 8-26 for 22 points.

Gasol and Bynum go 21-32 for 50 points and 24 boards and 7 blocks.

Bench had 7 points.

Stuckey went 13-20 for 34 points.