majorspark;775370 wrote:Guess we deserved 9/11 for supporting them darn Jews.

Is that supposed to be funny? Nobody "deserved 9-11". If you don't understand the correlation between 9-11 and our unbridled financial, military, and political allegiance to Israel, then you have a very shallow understanding of middle eastern politics. and that is truly a sad, sad commentary.

Wow this guy is an idiot and a kook. He thinks the Israelis had foreknowledge of 9/11. His ten questions are not questions but unfounded accusations. He has no credible sources to back up his claims. What a putz.

Yeah....sure...this former CIA top official and lifelong conservative must be a kook....because you have labeled him a kook? I can tell you point blank that every point he has touched on is fully documented. The American media won't allow the general public to know about these "dirty little secrets". Thank God for google, where one can circumvent the Israeli propoganda, and unveil the facts. You are again showing your lack of historical knowledge as it relates to Israel and the geopolitics of the Middle East.

Bring up even 1 of the 10 questions asked by Giraldi...and I'll show the links proving his ascertations.

Footwedge;775799 wrote:Is that supposed to be funny? Nobody "deserved 9-11".

No. It is meant to be sarcastic. I am sick and tired of the blame America crowd. I am tired of hearing how the US should behave a certain way so bad things don't happen to us. I understand if we are in a foreign land by force of our will alone and their violent resistance against our military personal. But unprovoked violent actions against civilian targets just because we give financial aid to a nation that we have cultural and religious ties with? No way.

Footwedge;775799 wrote:If you don't understand the correlation between 9-11 and our unbridled financial, military, and political allegiance to Israel, then you have a very shallow understanding of middle eastern politics. and that is truly a sad, sad commentary.

I understand the correlation. The problem is some want to use that correlation to justify the 9/11 attacks or use it as a reason to change our foreign policy. What nations we choose to give financial aid to and why is our business. Using violence to change that policy will only beget violence upon themselves. Al Qaeda would have been better off hiring a lobbying firm and funneling large amounts of cash to American politicians.

There is a direct correlation to our foreign policy actions in the 1930's and the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor. Are you saying our foreign policy should be guided by potential acts of violence by foreign entities that disagree with it? That is the result they hope to see by their violent actions.

Footwedge;775799 wrote:Yeah....sure...this former CIA top official and lifelong conservative must be a kook....because you have labeled him a kook?

I don't give a shit if he is CIA. We got a lot of nuts in high levels of power in our government. As for him being a lifelong conservative, that means nothing, so is Rush Limbaugh. A lot of people call themselves conservatives.

I labeled him a kook because he insinuated that that Israeli intelligence had foreknowledge of 9/11 and willfully did not share it with US intelligence officials. For reasons that can only be speculated to be to their benefit because of the fore coming American wrath on their enemies. He threw this accusation out with no factual evidence to back it up.

Footwedge;775799 wrote:I can tell you point blank that every point he has touched on is fully documented. The American media won't allow the general public to know about these "dirty little secrets". Thank God for google, where one can circumvent the Israeli propoganda, and unveil the facts.

I hope you can. I am very skeptical of conspiracy theories. Lets see some proven documented facts. Not some nutbags opinions.

Footwedge;775799 wrote:You are again showing your lack of historical knowledge as it relates to Israel and the geopolitics of the Middle East.

How is that? Name one historical fact that I have got wrong. You attack my intelligence simply because I hold a different opinion that you. I have butted heads with you and Ptown many times. I can't recall one time where I accused either one of you of lacking knowledge of history in a specific matter.

I respect the knowledge both of you have of history and foreign affairs. Many times I disagree with you on how our nation should handle the aforementioned issues, but I will not shit on your intelligence because your interpretation of it is different then mine.

Footwedge;775799 wrote:Bring up even 1 of the 10 questions asked by Giraldi...and I'll show the links proving his ascertations.

I will bring up a few for times sake. I am interested to see these links.

2. Speaking of attacking, you rocketed, strafed, and torpedoed a US Naval vessel the USS Liberty in international waters in 1967, killing 34 of the crew and injuring 174. The attack was both unprovoked and brutal, intended to sink the ship and kill everyone on board. You claim it was an accident but have never given American investigators access to your government records. It sounds like a cover-up and many Americans are wondering whether you will ever come clean on what happened that day. Will you ever open up your records relating to the Liberty?

He insinuates a deliberate attack by the Israelis. For what purpose? What did they have to gain by a deliberate attack? The US was actively aiding them in their war effort. Accidents happen in the fog of war.

The US downed an Iranian civilian jetliner during the Iran-Iraq war. Killing 290 people. Outside of a horrible accident what would the US stand to gain? The environment of war is very confused.

4. Israel spies on the United States more than any ostensibly friendly country. You steal our defense secrets and our commercially valuable proprietary information and then use it or barter it to your advantage and America’s disadvantage. Prior to 9/11 you were running a massive and illegal spying operation inside the United States and you might even have known in advance about some aspects of the terrorist attack. You have even penetrated our telecommunications systems, allegedly including the White House. You do what you do because you know you can get away with it, that the Justice Department and President are reluctant to arrest and convict Israeli spies. Don’t you think that it is time for Israel to admit that it has been spying on Americans and for it to make a firm commitment to stop doing so with sanctions for non-compliance like shutting your exports out of our domestic market?

Show me the evidence that Israel spies on this country more than Great Britain, France, or the Japanese do. We do the same to them. Any good CIA man knows you keep your enemies close and your friends closer. Your friends know a hell of a lot more about you than your enemies.

I labeled Giraldi a kook because he insinuated Israeli intelligence possessed prior knowledge of the 9/11 attacks and did not pass that knowledge on to US intelligence. A reasonable person could only assume withholding of this intelligence was to allow the full wrath of the USA to be brought upon Israels enemies. Back this conspiracy theory up. I am curious.

7. Many believe that the United States went to war with Iraq partly because of pressure from Israel and its friends in the Bush Administration. Iraq did not threaten the US and the war has now lasted eight years, has killed nearly 5,000 Americans, and has cost trillions of dollars. Now you have told us that Israel would like to see the United States attack Iran. Since 1995 your government has repeatedly warned that Iran is either six months or a year away from having a nuclear weapon. The timetable slips every time you make a new prediction and you never seem to be embarrassed by your inability to anticipate actual developments in Iran. It appears that Iran might not really want to have a bomb and might never have the capability to make one even if it decides to move in that direction. It would seem that you have always been exaggerating the Iranian threat to turn Iran into America’s enemy as well as your own. Recently your former head of Mossad Meir Dagan said that attacking Iran would be “the stupidest thing I’ve ever heard.” Isn’t it time to stop citing Iran as a justification for the American military’s costly and dangerous remaking of the Middle East to suit Israel?

Giraldi claims part of the reason we went to war in Iraq was because of pressure from Israel. How so? Lets see some proof. How does a nation of less that 8 million with no major natural resources exert such great pressure on a nation of 300 million? A nation that receives billions in aid from the US holds this power? How are our balls so firmly in their grip that we would go to war with their enemies whenever they squeeze?

majorspark;776266 wrote:Giraldi claims...

The dude is out of work and free lancing. He needs people to buy his book, contract for his services, hit his blog, etc.... He's not the first, either.

majorspark;776260 wrote: I am sick and tired of the blame America crowd. I am tired of hearing how the US should behave a certain way so bad things don't happen to us. I understand if we are in a foreign land by force of our will alone and their violent resistance against our military personal. But unprovoked violent actions against civilian targets just because we give financial aid to a nation that we have cultural and religious ties with? No way.

C'mon Major. See the light. Amerika is the root of all the world's eeeeevil. If we would simply commit national suicide and take Israel down with us, all of the world's problems would go away. The "Final Solution" so to speak.

gut;776267 wrote:The dude is out of work and free lancing. He needs people to buy his book,.....

In a nutshell.........

For all the haters, listen and watch the speech here. The President went out of his way to defend Israel and state that the U.S. will not deal with a Hamas that does not accept Israel. He also confirmed the U.S. commitment to Israeli security, including vetoing UN Security Council Resolutions, against any UN vote on Palestine, increasing military aid and the Iron Dome anti-missile system. He also clarifies his statement on the 1967 line quote, saying the end result will be a swap that will be based off of the two parties agreement and the 67 line is a starting point.
http://www.c-span.org/Events/President-addresses-AIPAC/10737421659-7/

Even Jeffrey Goldberg, an known pro-Israeli writer for the Atlantic stated earlier that the President's Thursday's address wasn't bad and Bibi overreacted.

ptown_trojans_1;776408 wrote:Even Jeffrey Goldberg, an known pro-Israeli writer for the Atlantic stated earlier that the President's Thursday's address wasn't bad and Bibi overreacted.

Disagree. Asking the Israelis to withdraw to the 1967 borders literally hours before Netanyahu's latest White House visit was a bone-headed ploy by Obama to put the Prime Minister on the defensive before he even had an opportunity to formulate a response. No wonder Netanyahu reacted the way he did.

Two visits by the Israeli Prime Minister and both visits damaging to U.S/Israeli relations in my humble opinion.

"Starting point"? Bullshit.

believer;776532 wrote:Disagree. Asking the Israelis to withdraw to the 1967 borders literally hours before Netanyahu's latest White House visit was a bone-headed ploy by Obama to put the Prime Minister on the defensive before he even had an opportunity to formulate a response. No wonder Netanyahu reacted the way he did.

Two visits by the Israeli Prime Minister and both visits damaging to U.S/Israeli relations in my humble opinion.

"Starting point"? Bullshit.

It is the starting point. Where else do you start? It has been the starting point since 1967 and the only way one can get any sort of agreement. Ignoring that is ignoring reality.
I'd also say, U.S.-Israeli relations are fine. There have been darker days (late 60s). As the President said in his address today, the U.S. is increasing its aid and ties with Israel, including the Iron Dome and David Sling anti-missile systems.

ptown_trojans_1;776551 wrote:Ignoring that is ignoring reality.

And ignoring that BHO seems to have a habit of purposely kicking Netanyahu in the balls while claiming to be supportive of Israel is also ignoring reality.

Honestly, P-town, you go out of your way (it seems) to rave about Obama's foreign policy work...but twice now we've seen what I would call EITHER deliberate slaps at Israel or two really dumb mistakes just as the prime minister was due to visit.

Then you say Obama CLARIFIES his statement on the 1967 borders?

WTF?

It would appear to me that Obama was testing the waters both times these things happened. This White House seems to have a habit of sending up "trial balloons" on issues to gauge reaction, and then often comes back and changes or denies what might have leaked out. And yes, this happens mostly on domestic issues; not typically on foreign policy stuff, but it does happen.

Obviously, this wasn't a leak, but it has the same kind of trial "feel" to it.

Oh and lastly...you deserve to be bitch slapped once for using the term "haters" in your post.

Come on, you're better than that. I detest that term; it reminds me of something a 14 year old girl would say.

Writerbuckeye;776723 wrote:Honestly, P-town, you go out of your way (it seems) to rave about Obama's foreign policy work...but twice now we've seen what I would call EITHER deliberate slaps at Israel or two really dumb mistakes just as the prime minister was due to visit.

Then you say Obama CLARIFIES his statement on the 1967 borders?

WTF?

It would appear to me that Obama was testing the waters both times these things happened. This White House seems to have a habit of sending up "trial balloons" on issues to gauge reaction, and then often comes back and changes or denies what might have leaked out. And yes, this happens mostly on domestic issues; not typically on foreign policy stuff, but it does happen.

Obviously, this wasn't a leak, but it has the same kind of trial "feel" to it.

Oh and lastly...you deserve to be bitch slapped once for using the term "haters" in your post.

Come on, you're better than that. I detest that term; it reminds me of something a 14 year old girl would say.

lol, I knew haters would get a reaction. I thought it was a pretty strong speech. Whenever anything related to Israel comes up, emotions and rationality fly out the window.
I think the administration has had some ups and many downs on their Israeli-Palestine policy (George Mitchell was an absolute failure)

I don't fault the President for stating what has been the obvious since really 1967, that any Palestine state will be based off those 67 borders with large land swaps. That has been the basis of all negotiations even going back to Oslo in 1992. Ignoring of saying that is false, a slap in the face, etc, ignores all the history of the last 40 years. Any agreement is by default, going to have to start with the basics of the 1967 borders. That does not mean they will stick as there will be large, large land swaps both ways. But, the start is 1967 and then both work from there. I fail to see the problem in that. But, that is just me.

ptown_trojans_1;776774 wrote:I don't fault the President for stating what has been the obvious since really 1967, that any Palestine state will be based off those 67 borders with large land swaps. That has been the basis of all negotiations even going back to Oslo in 1992. Ignoring of saying that is false, a slap in the face, etc, ignores all the history of the last 40 years. Any agreement is by default, going to have to start with the basics of the 1967 borders. That does not mean they will stick as there will be large, large land swaps both ways. But, the start is 1967 and then both work from there. I fail to see the problem in that. But, that is just me.

The problem is we all know that the 1967 borders mean NOTHING to the Palestinians and the Arab world in general. The extermination of the state of Israel - more directly the end of Jewish rule - is the ultimate goal. This is and always has been the crux of the conflict.

As much as we desperately want to whittle this down to cause-and-effect Western secular political thinking, we are looking at centuries of highly irrational and extremely bitter religious and spiritual hatred that no amount of political diplomacy and talk of borders will ever resolve.

Each time Camp David-style agreements occur, everyone with any amount of common-sense knows that these "peace talks" are simply fluff and political sugar-coating to give an illusion of progress.

Pessimistic thinking or acceptance of the cold, hard truth?

ptown_trojans_1;776774 wrote:lI don't fault the President for stating what has been the obvious since really 1967, that any Palestine state will be based off those 67 borders with large land swaps. That has been the basis of all negotiations even going back to Oslo in 1992. Ignoring of saying that is false, a slap in the face, etc, ignores all the history of the last 40 years. Any agreement is by default, going to have to start with the basics of the 1967 borders. That does not mean they will stick as there will be large, large land swaps both ways. But, the start is 1967 and then both work from there. I fail to see the problem in that. But, that is just me.

When you say there will be large land swaps both ways, what large portions of pre-1967 Israel will the Israelis be giving up? Not only are the Jewish and Arabs communities intermingled with each other, strategically Israel does not have much to give up pre-1967. Israels border between north and south is at points less than ten miles. Neither side wants to uproot people from there homes.

Take a look at these two maps. Good luck carving two states out of that. That is why in my previous post I say the Israelis should annex the West Bank. Grant the Arabs full citizen ship and allow Gaza to operate as a full sovereign state.

Arab communities in Israel.



Jewish communities in the West Bank.

majorspark;776260 wrote:No. It is meant to be sarcastic. I am sick and tired of the blame America crowd. I am tired of hearing how the US should behave a certain way so bad things don't happen to us. I understand if we are in a foreign land by force of our will alone and their violent resistance against our military personal. But unprovoked violent actions against civilian targets just because we give financial aid to a nation that we have cultural and religious ties with? No way.

Al quada has clearly stated the reasons for attacking us and we continue the same foreign policy measures that have escalated the violence. and yet you and the war lovers see absolutely to culpability for the expansion of international terrorism. None. I blame America for our own fucking stupidity....when it comes to lot of things. It is America...I'm allowed to express my opinions. For how long...no one knows for sure. As for cultural and religious ties...who the fuck cares? I don't give a shit about their culture nor their religious practices. It's no concern of mine....and it should be no concern of yours either. What should be your concern is how our military, financial, and moral backing of the this country has made the world a much more dangerous place to live in. Apparently that's not important to you.

I understand the correlation. The problem is some want to use that correlation to justify the 9/11 attacks or use it as a reason to change our foreign policy. What nations we choose to give financial aid to and why is our business. Using violence to change that policy will only beget violence upon themselves. Al Qaeda would have been better off hiring a lobbying firm and funneling large amounts of cash to American politicians.

Yes indeed Al Quada used this reason and 3 others for justifying the terrorist attacks against the west. They cite the exact same reasons as the Lehi Group (led by head prime minister Menachin Begin)used for blowing people up. It's called theft and human right violations. How many times in the past year has the Israeli navy blown up relief effort ships to starving people? Well just last week was yet another hit....yet the mainstream mnedia refuses to write about it. And America tacitly supposrts the Israeli's own brand of terrorism. How many time shas Israel bombed innocent citizens in Qana Lebanon? How many?

And you, of all people, clamor about regarding fiscal responsibilty....and then lay claim right here that giving 3 billion a year to the 27th wealthiest per capita nation is "our own government's" business. The hypocracy is remarkable.

There is a direct correlation to our foreign policy actions in the 1930's and the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor. Are you saying our foreign policy should be guided by potential acts of violence by foreign entities that disagree with it? That is the result they hope to see by their violent actions.

Our foreihn policy is a train wreck...but it continues on and on and on and on. We have seen our embassies bombed....we have seen hundreds of embassy hostages take....we have seen our "allies" turn against us.....we have seen our buildings smashed into by terrorists....and we do the same shit over and over and over and over again....all to sate the lust of the war lover party members.

I don't give a shit if he is CIA. We got a lot of nuts in high levels of power in our government. As for him being a lifelong conservative, that means nothing, so is Rush Limbaugh. A lot of people call themselves conservatives.

I labeled him a kook because he insinuated that that Israeli intelligence had foreknowledge of 9/11 and willfully did not share it with US intelligence officials. For reasons that can only be speculated to be to their benefit because of the fore coming American wrath on their enemies. He threw this accusation out with no factual evidence to back it up.

And you base this observation, how? Have you researched it? No you haven't. Just as many never researched the Gulf of Tonkin "incident". Since the US government says something isn't so...doesn't make it so. If I had more time, I would prove every statement that Geraldi has stated as factual. You, and America at large, are blinded by the media that has strong agendas to keep the money flowing to Israel.

How is that? Name one historical fact that I have got wrong. You attack my intelligence simply because I hold a different opinion that you. I have butted heads with you and Ptown many times. I can't recall one time where I accused either one of you of lacking knowledge of history in a specific matter.

I respect the knowledge both of you have of history and foreign affairs. Many times I disagree with you on how our nation should handle the aforementioned issues, but I will not shit on your intelligence because your interpretation of it is different then mine.

Your intelligence is not being questioned. Your myopic view, festered by the propogandized sentiment of the American press, is.

You'll never see this shit reported....Israel stopping humanitarian aid....Who'da thunk it?

http://occupiedpalestine.wordpress.com/2011/05/16/israeli-navy-attack-aid-ship-to-gaza-and-force-it-back-to-egypt/

Major: I actually would support a situation where Israel just absorbed the West Bank, but gave full rights, including voting and citizenship, to the Palestinians.
I highly doubt it will happen unless there is new leadership on both sides. Plus, there will be a high resistance to this as it will be pretty hard to tell a Palestinian they cannot have their own country, but must live in Israel.

But, Israel has a catch-22. How could they do this and still claim to be a Jewish state? What would be a Jewish state to the state of Israel? Just having a Jewish majority, or having laws that favor Jews over others? Will ultra Orthodox Jews accept Arabs as equal in citizenship or would they rebel?

It is interesting, but raises a lot of questions. Again, I'd support it, but so many details have to be fleshed out.

I have no idea what to do with the Gaza strip in this instance though.

Footwedge;776928 wrote:You'll never see this shit reported....Israel stopping humanitarian aid....Who'da thunk it?

http://occupiedpalestine.wordpress.com/2011/05/16/israeli-navy-attack-aid-ship-to-gaza-and-force-it-back-to-egypt/

Given the source, gotta another news source to back up the attack?

ptown_trojans_1;776932 wrote:Given the source, gotta another news source to back up the attack?

Exactly! You will never see it reported in the US.

http://www.breakingnews.ie/world/israeli-navy-attacks-aid-ship-459763.html

majorspark;776260 wrote:No. It is meant to be sarcastic. I am sick and tired of the blame America crowd. I am tired of hearing how the US should behave a certain way so bad things don't happen to us. I understand if we are in a foreign land by force of our will alone and their violent resistance against our military personal. But unprovoked violent actions against civilian targets just because we give financial aid to a nation that we have cultural and religious ties with? No way.

The United States has religious ties with no one. Sort of an important part of our constitution.

Your "we never do anything wrong attitude and if we do anytime someone says something about it I'll just call them an America hater" viewpoint is just as or more frustrating.

Footwedge;776947 wrote:http://www.breakingnews.ie/world/israeli-navy-attacks-aid-ship-459763.html

This story is a year old and I remember it well, because it was reported here.

Footwedge;776926 wrote:Al quada has clearly stated the reasons for attacking us and we continue the same foreign policy measures that have escalated the violence. and yet you and the war lovers see absolutely to culpability for the expansion of international terrorism. None. I blame America for our own fucking stupidity....when it comes to lot of things. It is America...I'm allowed to express my opinions. For how long...no one knows for sure.

So in a nutshell we should surrender to Al Qaeda's demands? Al Qaeda initiates violence to achieve their goals and I am the war lover? Like I said they would have been better off hiring a lobbying firm in DC and funneling money to congressman's election campaigns.

Footwedge;776926 wrote:As for cultural and religious ties...who the fuck cares? I don't give a shit about their culture nor their religious practices. It's no concern of mine....and it should be no concern of yours either.

Whether it is a concern of yours or mine does not matter. In reality it is one of the reasons we support them. When it comes to separating the sheep from the goats though, I hope our nation is one of the sheep.

Footwedge;776926 wrote:What should be your concern is how our military, financial, and moral backing of the this country has made the world a much more dangerous place to live in. Apparently that's not important to you.

We have only existed as a nation in this world for 235yrs. 6,000 years of human history and in a mere 235yrs we have managed to screw up the whole up world and make it a hell hole? The world is now a more dangerous place to live in? Because of our support for Israel? You know better than this Foot. I know you are not that ignorant of history.

Footwedge;776926 wrote:Yes indeed Al Quada used this reason and 3 others for justifying the terrorist attacks against the west. They cite the exact same reasons as the Lehi Group (led by head prime minister Menachin Begin)used for blowing people up. It's called theft and human right violations. How many times in the past year has the Israeli navy blown up relief effort ships to starving people?

I am aware of the Lehi group and their history. The Lehi group did not attack my country. The Lehi group is not the nation of Israel. As for the Israeli navy blowing up relief ships kindly provide a source to back this claim up. Of course no one in this world would ever think of smuggling weapons in with humanitarian aid.

Footwedge;776926 wrote:Well just last week was yet another hit....yet the mainstream mnedia refuses to write about it. And America tacitly supposrts the Israeli's own brand of terrorism. How many time shas Israel bombed innocent citizens in Qana Lebanon? How many?

The Qana incident happened in the fog of war. Of course the freedom fighters would never choose a location at or near a UN compound for Lebanese refugees to launch offensive rockets at their Israeli oppressors.

Footwedge;776926 wrote:And you, of all people, clamor about regarding fiscal responsibilty....and then lay claim right here that giving 3 billion a year to the 27th wealthiest per capita nation is "our own government's" business. The hypocracy is remarkable.

If its not our governments business than whose is it? Al Qaeda's? Of course it is our business and ours alone. We should not kowtow to external forces. No matter their tactics. I do not think with our current fiscal situation we should be giving a dime to foreign governments without a guaranteed return on our investment. In fact I think at this point we should demand payment for our military protection. We no longer can afford to subsidize the defense needs of our allies.

Footwedge;776926 wrote:Our foreihn policy is a train wreck...but it continues on and on and on and on. We have seen our embassies bombed....we have seen hundreds of embassy hostages take....we have seen our "allies" turn against us.....we have seen our buildings smashed into by terrorists....and we do the same shit over and over and over and over again....all to sate the lust of the war lover party members.

Obviously our goose is cooked. Our ass has been beat. Time to raise the white flag.

Footwedge;776926 wrote:And you base this observation, how? Have you researched it? No you haven't. Just as many never researched the Gulf of Tonkin "incident". Since the US government says something isn't so...doesn't make it so. If I had more time, I would prove every statement that Geraldi has stated as factual. You, and America at large, are blinded by the media that has strong agendas to keep the money flowing to Israel.

Common sense. And I am skeptical of an conspiracy theory. I have briefly looked into it and find no credible evidence to support his accusations. Perhaps you could help me out.

You said this.

Bring up even 1 of the 10 questions asked by Giraldi...and I'll show the links proving his ascertations.

I brought up three. I settle for this one. Suddenly you have no time. Guess you showed me.

I Wear Pants;776991 wrote:The United States has religious ties with no one.

10's of millions of Americans believe in the same Judeo-Christian God.

I Wear Pants;776991 wrote:Sort of an important part of our constitution.

Its in our constitution that we have religious ties with no one? Please show me where in the Constitution that the people of the United States are forbidden to have religious ties with any nation. The context is not state sanctioning of any religion.

I Wear Pants;776991 wrote:Your "we never do anything wrong attitude and if we do anytime someone says something about it I'll just call them an America hater" viewpoint is just as or more frustrating.

I have posted countless times on our governments wrong doings. Many times directly related to our foreign policy. I can't recall a time I called some one an "American hater" because they disagreed with me. I always try to be respectful to posters especially those that are knowledgeable on the matter being discussed. I would never insult their intelligence by claiming they hate this country. Perhaps at times my sarcasm appears arrogant or condescending. It is only meant to drive home a point. You know me by now. We have locked horns many times. I would think you would know that I would never claim someone hates America unless it were truly so. But carry on with your labels.

majorspark;777292 wrote:I can't recall a time I called some one an "American hater" because they disagreed with me. I always try to be respectful to posters especially those that are knowledgeable on the matter being discussed. I would never insult their intelligence by claiming they hate this country. Perhaps at times my sarcasm appears arrogant or condescending. It is only meant to drive home a point. You know me by now. We have locked horns many times. I would think you would know that I would never claim someone hates America unless it were truly so. But carry on with your labels.

I can attest to this about you Majorspark and I also share the same feelings.

I've argued bitterly with OC's posters like IWP, Footwedge, KnightRyder, Stlouiedipalma, and even Gibby and Biggdogg but have never questioned their Americanism or their patriotism. They just have a radically different view on what direction this country should go.

Here is the date and first paragraph of the story footwedge says wasn't reported here:

Israeli Navy attacks aid ship
4Share
31/05/2010 - 07:08:41
Israeli warships attacked at least one of the six ships carrying pro-Palestinian activists and aid for blockaded Gaza today, killing at least ten and wounding an unknown number of people on board, reports said.

Read more: http://www.breakingnews.ie/world/israeli-navy-attacks-aid-ship-459763.html#ixzz1NBdOdVqn

Here is a link to the same story on MSNBC...which was also carried on NBC.

So much for the idea that the story wasn't carried in the US. It was given to every news outlet via AP.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/37423584/ns/world_news-mideast_n_africa/t/bloody-israeli-raid-flotilla-sparks-crisis/